You are either scum or a good hunter. And if you're a good hunter, I'm not sure where to look next.
I really hope we've got a cop to prove my innocence.
*OOC, every time you said good hunter I was hearing all of them Bloodborne voices.I asked earlier and we do have either a cop or a jailor; perhaps both. The cop should also be able to reveal who they investigated is innocent or mafia... At risk of lynching. Though then again, jailer could protect them afterwards, but that would also stop the cop from further investigating. I must say that makes the mechanics more than a bit interesting, as the cop has to collate enough information and reveal it before they're lynched or sicked by mafia, as after they reveal their role they are guaranteed to either be sicked or relegated to ordinary townie status.
The cop and jailer could reveal themselves now and the innocent person the cop has identified, which would make us 3 townies for certain and shrink the mafia suspect pool down to 2/4 people, assuming the cop didn't investigate Graknorke. Then there'd be a 50% chance of lynching the right guy next time round... And the mafia would have to be found before they get rid of the 3 known vanilla town/role town.
Unless we've only got a jailer in which case I'm not really sure what the jailer can do beyond admit they're jailer and perma-invincimode themselves to shrink the pool down 1 suspect.
*Listens to music*
Okay. Oi you, when did someone frame Graknorke? I see no evidence of that.
Someone planted steroids on him, when he was a stellar Luchadore whose muscles were gained fairly with an all Biltong diet and sick reps!
The scum must have seen him as the threat to their ranks that he was.
...So it is interesting then, that he was one of the people you named as scum.
... here's the important(and more relevant bit): you've given some good arguments against me, but no arguments that prove(or attempt to prove) that you or Urist McCoder are not scum. In fact, good sir, it seems that you're trying to distract from your own scumminess by attacking me. I, for better or worse, am the scapegoat at the moment. I await your reply.
Well I'm not going to prove that Urist McCoder is not scum because I don't know that he isn't nor do I have proof of that, and if anything Urist McCoder is high on my list of suspects so I don't even care to do that. And I can't prove I'm not scum either because I don't know the cop and all I know is I'm town, Hiddenleafguy and Graknorke were town.
The only way I can prove I am town to other honourable Luchadores and not just myself is by lynching mafia. So I strive to do my best to lynch mafia, until I am killed by mafia or lynched by Luchadores. I cautioned against lynching Hiddenleafguy because he seemed to be genuinely nooby in my judgement and not acting in malice or deliberate deception (although I agree he did act in insane confusion, one must expect that of a Luchadore who wears leaves within their mask), and one who defends a town about to be lynched against majority opposition in favour of someone who does not suspect them is not someone who particularly cares about going under the radar and is one who cares about keeping the town population high.
Also to repost it, my list of most trusted to least:
Graknorke (good scum hunter)
Tawarochir (has given me no reason to assume town, but has also given no reason to suspect mafia)
4maskwolf (active encourager of scumhunting)
H4zardZ1 (innocuous, gave few reasons to suspect)
notquitethere (my initial suspect, but tearing down bandwagons with logic and reason lowered suspicions)
Hiddenleafguy (was all over the place)
Urist McCoder (really coming off as scummy)
FallacyofUrist (really coming off as scummiest)
And my revised list:
Graknorke Confirmed town, retired by mafia
Hiddenleafguy Confirmed town, lynched
Tawarochir (has given me no reason to assume town, but has also given no reason to suspect mafia)
notquitethere (we disagree on scumhunting technique and who is scum, nevertheless convictions appear based on strong luchadore morals however and not a grand mafia plan)
4maskwolf (has been slightly absent as of late)
H4zardZ1 (may have connections with FallacyofUrist, does not seem so but enough to spark suspicion)
Urist McCoder (guilt largely hinges on the guilt of FallacyofUrist)
FallacyofUrist (really coming off as scummiest)
I will post everything and anything I can possibly post to give you insight into the mind of Luchadore Whispers and the life of Luchadore Whispers short of posting the PM saying I am vanilla Townie, because that would be gamebreaking to all hell.
One thing the good Graktastic Grakopop machine did theorize before being disgraced by mafia shenanigans was that the poetic Urist and Urist scumteam was looking less likely given your diametric oppositions. The Grakular Grakophone was usually quite well reasoned in these matters; should you be revealed as town FallacyofUrist, Urist McCoder will be my suspect #1 and should you be revealed as mafia Urist McCoder will rest in my books as a probable townie. After a few questions.
Blast it. Here's the deal. I believe that Loud Whispers and Urist McCoder are the scum because they've assaulted me, to a large degree, but done nothing to logic out their own innocence. I've poked and pushed at them multiple times, but they don't respond to defend themselves. Look up ad hominem. If that's the way to spell it. It's latin for to the man. Loud Whispers and Urist McCoder are striking at me instead of my arguments.
I believe there is some projection going on here.
What happened when Grakomorph Pargon Pargon Grakthulhu and Tarowachir put the spotlight on you?
I would speak on the possibility of a Graknorke and Tawarochir scum team, but that would backfire heavily at the moment.
When someone accused you of being scum all you did was accuse them of being scum instead.
Tawarochir: please state, thoroughly and in your own words, why you are not scum and I am.
hiddenleafguy: please tell me, exactly why you think I'm scum and explain why you're not.
Repeaateedly.
Because there is no one else to pressure, and I think he is scum
Oh, missed you. At this point, your scummyness increases in my eyes.
Every single time.
Blast it. Here's the deal. I believe that Loud Whispers and Urist McCoder are the scum because they've assaulted me
Like clockwork.
And where have you poked and pushed at me "multiple times?" I should think a teal masked Luchadore from the town of Emuridan is very hard to confuse with any of the other Luchadores you have lied about poking and pushing, and that is to say - ones you have simply called scum because they looked at the evidence screaming above your head "this is scum."
I am town. Is there anything wrong with saying that I'm town?
Loud Whispers, why do you vote me for aggressively scumhunting(in my opinion)?
Loud Whispers: I agree with hiddenleafguy shouldn't edit the post and Fallacy's repetition, but voting someone is a great way to pressurize someone. What do you disagree with, "I am town" repetition, voting persistence or both?
Everyone: Ask everyone. Random vote one.
Constant reaffirmation that "I am town" is one thing - akin to being at the scene of a Luchadore murder running around screaming "I DID NOTHING HERE" when no one suspected them to begin with.
What particularly caught my attention was this:
Point ho. One vote on NQT isn't enough pressure.
Come on, people, vote for the guy, let's get him hurting! Let's get him talking!
Calling for a sword of damocles to be placed above notquitethere.
I'm telling people to vote NQT because I think he's scum. I don't think that telling other people who to vote for is a bad thing. This isn't a game where votes can be forced onto people with role abilities. Make your own choices, just note that I want you to vote for NQT.
And then we see FallacyofUrist switching from fleeting suspicion to confidence in notquitethere's guilt, without explaining any reasoning or new information which could have allowed for such a leap in judgement.
EVIDENCE:
I would speak on the possibility of a Graknorke and Tawarochir scum team, but that would backfire heavily at the moment.
The simple truth here is that I don't know what to do at the moment. I would unvote, but that would look scummy. I would then choose someone else to pressure, but that would look scummy.
A true Luchadore is not concerned with the appearance of justice; beneath the mask - the Luchadore is justice.
And if not, they are scum.
A Luchadore would be willing to die to save the most glorious wrestling match to have ever been seen; a Luchadore would be willing to die to bring down the people they know without a doubt are sullying the wrestler life.
Fermat's last theorem? What's that?
Also, so I can be sure about my lynch target for this day,
Everybody but Hiddenleafguy: what is your current opinion on Hiddenleafguy?
Hiddenleafluchadore is #2 on my list of suspects. The only thing bringing me to hesitation is that of the both of you, it is unlikely that both of you are corrupt, unless the efforts to have each other lynched is just a cover. The reason why I currently suspect you most over HLG is that HLG is more plausibly making horrendous nooby mistakes, as HLG is a horrendous noob who went so far as to edit a post. And whilst you also claim to be innocent by noob plea:
This is my first game of forum mafia. I have however read several pages worth of mafia theory at the wiki. And many, many, interesting and complex non-beginner games have also been read by me here in the pursuit of knowledge.
You are more well-versed in these ways.
FOU, may you elaborate on the issue of your sudden certainty that nqt was rigging the match?
... please quote the post in which I said anything of the sort.
Okay.
First up, please spell my username correctly.
Second up: I'm telling people to vote NQT because I think he's scum.
Your plea is moving, but the mounting evidence leads me to maintain my scary red text.
Note well that your response to my arguments is to attack Urist McCoder and I.
Urist McCoder is suspicious to me but you are the most suspicious beyond a reasonable doubt. Sure I suspect others but you occupy the furthest extent of my suspicion that I must clarify once and for all whether you are town or foe if only for my own sake.
I have levied upon you already that my suspicions have been founded:
- On your attempts to get "pressure" on NQT which appeared more like you attempting to get a bandwagon on NQT going.
- Some of your mistakes you passed off as noobiness, which you said you would accustom to adapting your playstyle. My suspicions on Hiddenleafguy were lowered because his noobiness seemed genuine, but you are by admission well-versed in Mafia game theory.
- Constant declarations of innocence. This did not work in your favour.
- Your actions and statements have shown you to be one more concerned with appearing the honourable Luchadore and not being the honourable Luchadore. Actions speak louder than words, and your words have been meaningless and your actions treacherous.
- You've been lying. No simpler way to put it. You've tried to get people to lynch others based off of "evidence" you posted that you never did, and still are doing so.
- When attacked with arguments you rush to ad hominems on other targets. Some like Hiddenleafguy and Urist McCoder are easy targets, others like myself are not. But when in doubt, just pretend there is evidence, it appears to be that FallacyofUrist is fond of fallacies.
- Hiddenleafguy being lynched. Ironically you made the admission that sometimes lynching a townie can be useful, as Hiddenleafguy was a very confusing person who seemed genuinely insane. He was high on my list of suspects, narrowing my suspicions and widening the possibility it is you who is mafia.
Hm. For the matter, I've decided to put a "Potency List" here(the skill level of the players).
4maskwolf
Notquitethere
Graknorke
Tawarochir
FallacyofUrist
Urist McCoder
Loud Whispers
H4zardZ1
Hiddenleafguy
If I were scum, I'd lynch and nightkill people on the top of the list first.
As for who will die in the night... only the scum know for sure. I predict they'll focus on the more skilled players first though, for obvious reasons.
Graknorke was quite high on that list. Do you know something else?
Loud Whispers, here's my trust-o-meter(trusted on top, not trusted on bottom):
FallacyofUrist(me)
Graknorke(incredibly good scum hunter)
4maskwolf(obsidian dagger to the scum's heart)
Notquitethere(less aggressive of a scum hunter, still a good player)
Tawarochir(eh, slightly shifty, still hunting pretty well)
Loud Whispers(you lack many posts with actual content, my gut is off on you)
H4zardZ1(blasted noob or devious scum?)
Hiddenleafguy(for obvious reasons, most likely scum, still small chance of just horrible noob)
Urist McCoder.(and you're at the bottom. active lurking, passiveness, bandwagoning. It's you who is scum.)
He was the highest on
that list. And then he got lynched. By your own admission Graknorke was an incredibly good scum hunter whilst Notquitethere was merely "still a good player." I don't know where "obsidian dagger to the scum's heart" ranks there but of note is that Graknorke was the person you most purported to trusting to be on your side, assuming of course that meant that Graknorke was the most likely to be town and was an excellent scumhunter. And if you were scum, you'd lynch the people highest on your "potency list."
I think we all agreed that Graknorke was the truest amongst us, and the most competent at scumhunting.
He also had his suspicions about you.
I'm not even done. I've been looking into your posts and I've been spotting more inconsistencies and lies.
That says scum.
Note in the first post, one of the rules is "play to win". I hope that doesn't count as quoting the mod, but I don't thank it should. That defense is- that isn't a defense.
You could have logiced it out, tried to actually fight for your survival. Instead... you just gave up. That, plus a double dose of passiveness, marks you as scum. This makes me want to keep my vote on you even more.
1. Okay, validated. A town lynch can often lead to good things. But the thing is, it leads ever closer to the Mafia victory! Most of the time town should not be passive and let themselves get lynched, because their living is much more harmful to scum and their continued arguing can locate scum better. The benefit of a town lynch is outweighed by that of a scum lynch. Always try to lynch scum. A townie defending himself logically is a good thing, because it means scum is more likely to be lynched.
3. You don't have to be alive to win, from what I know(that's only for survivors).
You go from one moment claiming that a good townie should not concern themselves with defending themselves over scumhunting, yet you flip flop on this virtue as soon as it compromises you. A good Luchadore will remove mafia from the premises first and concern their livelihood second.
I don't know where you stand there, because you have claimed both stances.
And here's examples FallacyofUrist, of tactically voting and not trying to hunt scum, but instead trying to get people lynched for little good reason or else just trying to appear "good" and not actually hunt scum good:
err....
4maskwolf, if you had time for a history recounting post, I imagine(I could be wrong) that a small bit of scum hunting could have gone on. Welp.
Now... blast it, I'm town, and I don't want to appear passive, but asking for who to lynch or something is scummy...
er... er...
er...
... I'm not voting.
FallcyofUrist, it shouldn't be expected of you to outright tell someone else who to vote for. Honestly your entire thing comes across to me as an attempt to domineer the path of the game with minimal justification. So far all we have is hiddenleafguy having very little idea how to play Mafia, and you accusing an IC of being scum.
The simple truth here is that I don't know what to do at the moment. I would unvote, but that would look scummy. I would then choose someone else to pressure, but that would look scummy. It looks like unfortunately I have been decreed to be scum by a large number of people.
Well, the easiest place to start would be the one that I first picked you up on:
While I'm at it, Graknorke, I'm going to recommend that you vote for NQT(notquitethere) and later hiddenleafguy as a result of evidence posted by me and Urist McCoder.
You said "as a result of evidence posted", but the actual evidence was... negligible. I read this as you just trying to brush off any real analysis and just getting people to jump into a blind lynching of someone of your choosing for nearly no reason, yet with you seeming absolutely certain of it. But now you're going to stop trying to press for questioning at all? That comes across as some overcompensating damage control.
But since I'm me, I know I'm town and thus a Urist McCoder and me scum team is impossible.
Do you realize how suspicious you're looking right now? You've been bringing up "I'm town" every ten seconds. That's not going to convince any of us that it's true, but you're acting like it's cold, hard, logical proof that you wouldn't do anything like this.
Blast it. Here's the deal. I believe that Loud Whispers and Urist McCoder are the scum because they've assaulted me, to a large degree, but done nothing to logic out their own innocence. I've poked and pushed at them multiple times, but they don't respond to defend themselves. Look up ad hominem. If that's the way to spell it. It's latin for to the man. Loud Whispers and Urist McCoder are striking at me instead of my arguments.
If you reread the thread you'll find all the things I've failed to mention,
because there are even more. One, two - even a handful could be chalked off as noobiness, general mistakes and erring, but you've gone so far as to just brazenly lie. Hiddenleafguy being lynched removed all the reservations I had about you.
Do you wish to know what the people of Emuridan have to look forward to? Quite literally nothing. Forward is not a word that exists in the Emuridan dictionary. There is only backways jump, sidestep and tackle up. Wrestling is love, wrestling is living.
Wrestling is Emuridan.
Someone wants to poison the greatest wrestling match ever seen and
poison Emuridan. Someone wants to do this, and for what? Money? To forfeit a match on purpose, rig it - disgrace good Luchadores everywhere, for this gain? I am filled with righteous fury. It seethes within me, quietly. I am not angry like the lion who has found out his brother has slept with all 20 of his wives, no.
I am angry like the cobbler and the mountain Kilosans, angry like the rain over the Emuridan pinwheeler trees and their seeds that go every sidestep and backways up as they body slam to the ground. This anger is not the explosive fires of Carnivale fireworks that tackle up into the sky. This is the molten ignitions that pool down a thousand sunsets away on the islands of Wesmalin calmly and unstoppable into the ocean below.
I must find the mafia before they kill Emuridan. Rob her children of hope, rob her parents of their children, and send the country backways jump forever.
If you are town, see you in the next great match they call life; I do not believe this Luchabowl longs for either you or I. Whether you be innocent or guilty I do not think I am long for this Luchabowl, I fear that the forces that conspired to sully Graksimus Aurelius will put my mask in the laundry basket with red clothes, sullying the teal beauty of my non-machine washable mask forever.
But of all Luchadores, you have convinced me of one thing to the point of conviction. If I am not using the Luchadore maverick techniques with their high minded stats and science and am just using good old fashioned intense Emuridan investigation - the evidence, and note well
the evidence and not
lies, it tells me you are most likely the single most obvious force conspiring against Luchabowl IV.
FallacyofUrist, do you hate Emuridan?
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Topic: Beginner's Mafia LV: Masked Trouble - Scum Victory (Read 48724 times)