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[FallacyofUrist]

Target: Hiddenleafguy

To begin with before... Damn forgot the name of the person who pointed out that you had said that you were town in most of your posts. After that I read back through and notice that you had, that was suspicious to me. As for why I am not scum who would rig a match, you will just have to trust me, and take my mask when I inevitability die, dry clean only by the way.

... er... you effectively did exactly the same thing I did with the "I am town" thing! You're either insane or scum. I meant logic. Use logic, blast it, Hiddenleafguy. Now I'm serious- as of this moment I believe you deserve this vote for multiple reasons.
1. Blast it, active lurking, not using your own arguments.
2. Your posts are tiny tiny tiny. Canst thou not use big words?
3. You have no real reason for voting me beyond my temporary insanity.
4.

How much time till night?

Just curious about how much time we have left before one of us dies in the night from a heart attack.

And another thing: you just seem to want the day done. You're too focused on me being scum to the exclusion of everybody else. For better or for worse, you seem to see me as your archnemisis.
~~~
Target: Tawarochir:
You're excused for the moment. For now. Hiddenleafguy seems more likely to be scum, but you're one of my top suspects at the time, for the same reasons as Hiddenleafguy. At least you're semi-logicing it out.
~~~
Target: Graknorke:
You are a brilliant scum hunter, from what I've seen. I hope you're town.

Oh, missed you. At this point, your scummyness increases in my eyes.

Because he thinks you're scum? That's some OMGUS behaviour right there. Exactly in line with how you've been acting the entire game so far.

Actually, because he said I'm scum- then gave no real reason for it. He said something like "because there's no one else to pressure". Does that not seem scummy to you?

[Graknorke]

Actually, because he said I'm scum- then gave no real reason for it. He said something like "because there's no one else to pressure". Does that not seem scummy to you?

That does make sense. It would have helped if you'd explained that at the time. As always, justification is key. I think I'd rather have people posting utter rubbish theories that is well backed up than I would them trying to emulate Fermat's last theorem. At least with the former you can go through the given evidence and arguments to consider whether it's sensible or not.

[FallacyofUrist]

Fermat's last theorem? What's that?

Also, so I can be sure about my lynch target for this day,

Everybody but Hiddenleafguy: what is your current opinion on Hiddenleafguy?

[Urist McCoder]

FOU I think you are scum for several reasons.
1.You seem to care about not being lynched a lot which does not make a ton of sense if you are town (IC's please correct me If I am mistaken here.)
2.You have only used 2-3 defense, even though no one is buying them. This makes me think that you don't actually have a good defense, and are just using some predetermined defense to try and skate buy.
3.90% of your arguments are just something that someone else said that you changed just enough that people might not notice.

[FallacyofUrist]

FOU I think you are scum for several reasons.
1.You seem to care about not being lynched a lot which does not make a ton of sense if you are town (IC's please correct me If I am mistaken here.)
2.You have only used 2-3 defense, even though no one is buying them. This makes me think that you don't actually have a good defense, and are just using some predetermined defense to try and skate buy.
3.90% of your arguments are just something that someone else said that you changed just enough that people might not notice.

1. ... good sir, mafia and town both don't want to be lynched. And again, using bits from my previous insanity tirade, which I consider no longer valid. I'm Logic Man now.
2. Skate by? Well, if I was, it's not working very well. And what makes you think my defense is predetermined? Or even if I have a defense at all(probably not true)?
3. Explain this, provide examples please.

[Graknorke]

Fermat's last theorem? What's that?

Spoiler: not game relevant (click to show/hide)

Fermat's Last Theorem was written in the margin of a book by the mathematician Pierre de Fermat, and only proved after his death. He wrote that there are no three integers a, b, and c where aⁿ + bⁿ = cⁿ when n is greater than 2. Then that he had a proof, but couldn't fit it in the margin so decided not to write it at all. This caused a few hundred years of effort by mathematicians to prove something, all because one guy couldn't be bothered to explain a thing. A true thing, but the only reason anybody bothered with it without proof is because Fermat wrote it.

Everybody but Hiddenleafguy: what is your current opinion on Hiddenleafguy?

Shady, but also kind of ineffectual. No offence HLG, but your posts so far really haven't had any substance to them, helpful or disruptive. It's something I don't like, but there's people with suspect voting patterns which are more actively demanding investigation.

using bits from my previous insanity tirade, which I consider no longer valid

Everything is valid forever.

[FallacyofUrist]

using bits from my previous insanity tirade, which I consider no longer valid

Everything is valid forever.

Better word then: relevant. I don't consider the insanity tirade relevant anymore. Unlike validity, relevancy in Mafia... well I suppose it depends on the game, but as time goes by, that little tirade should grow less and less relevant. Should, according to my opinion.

[Graknorke]

It's not really up to you to decide what of your actions are relevant though, is it? Again: kindly stop trying to dictate how other people should think. It's not anyone's job to outright tell others how to vote, and it's not anyone's job to outright tell others that their own actions are above scrutiny.

[Urist McCoder]

Everybody but Hiddenleafguy: what is your current opinion on Hiddenleafguy?

this is another thing that makes me think you are scum. You ask for other peoples opinions instead of formulating your own arguments. this makes it seem like you don't want to stand out, which as far as I understand is something of a scum tell.

FallacyofUrist
1.Town still wins even if the are dead, and if you are town once you get lynched other people could look at who attacked you in the most scummy way. Which very well may lead to finding the scum
2.predetermined is not really the right word. What I was trying to say was that it felt like your defenses are very 2 dimensional.
3.examples

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

On the other hand... He hasn't asked me a question either. Perhaps he's using his experience to frame Tawarochir and me as a scum team. Ouch.

Unvote Tawarochir.

 Vote notquitethere.

I would like to note that post editing is frowned upon in Mafia games for obvious reasons. Considering he's new he might have an excuse for the moment, though.

Hmm I'm not very angry yet, you won't like me when I'm angry also I could also argue that you are scum because you are aggressive and are accusing me because I didn't accuse someone.
Also the active lurking is because I leave my browser open when i do stuff.

I'm going to quote this bit so if you edit it again for some reason we'll know easier. I didn't notice the first time you did it.

It was different. I posted my response before he edited. Hm.

Okay, that's it. I'm saying a notquitethere and a hiddenleafguy scum team for the moment. Let's take them down.

Should I keep my vote on nqt or move it to hlg?

this was my argument

Hiddenleafguy, how many games of Mafia(forum or otherwise) have you played?

this had already been asked by graknorke.

Target: Hiddenleafguy
2. Your posts are tiny tiny tiny. Canst thou not use big words?

I had used this for when I voted for hiddenleafguy. looking back at all of this you have been on the defensive for the majority of the game.

[Tawa]

Target: Tawarochir:
You're excused for the moment. For now. Hiddenleafguy seems more likely to be scum, but you're one of my top suspects at the time, for the same reasons as Hiddenleafguy. At least you're semi-logicing it out.

Let me explain. You looked incredibly scummy at the start of the game. You're making up for it, but that doesn't excuse the fact that you looked like scum incarnate. However, I'm starting to think that you're not as suspicious as you seemed, since you're proving to actually be a rather effective scumhunter, so for now unvote.

That said, I will agree that HLG looks incredibly suspicious--significantly more suspicious than you ever did--and as such, I'm going to ask some questions, Tawa-style.
Hiddenleafguy:
You're under a lot of suspicion right now. How does that make you feel?

Everybody but Hiddenleafguy: what is your current opinion on Hiddenleafguy?

Hiddenleafguy is being shady as fuck right now.

Everybody but Hiddenleafguy: what is your current opinion on Hiddenleafguy?

this is another thing that makes me think you are scum. You ask for other peoples opinions instead of formulating your own arguments. this makes it seem like you don't want to stand out, which as far as I understand is something of a scum tell.

Objection! He could be using the opinions to formulate his own arguments!

[FallacyofUrist]

It's not really up to you to decide what of your actions are relevant though, is it? Again: kindly stop trying to dictate how other people should think. It's not anyone's job to outright tell others how to vote, and it's not anyone's job to outright tell others that their own actions are above scrutiny.

Noted.

Okay. I'm going to leave Tawarochir alone for the moment(don't think you're out of my partial focus, yet).

To you, Urist McCoder:

Everybody but Hiddenleafguy: what is your current opinion on Hiddenleafguy?

this is another thing that makes me think you are scum. You ask for other peoples opinions instead of formulating your own arguments. this makes it seem like you don't want to stand out, which as far as I understand is something of a scum tell.

FallacyofUrist
1.Town still wins even if the are dead, and if you are town once you get lynched other people could look at who attacked you in the most scummy way. Which very well may lead to finding the scum
2.predetermined is not really the right word. What I was trying to say was that it felt like your defenses are very 2 dimensional.
3.examples

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

On the other hand... He hasn't asked me a question either. Perhaps he's using his experience to frame Tawarochir and me as a scum team. Ouch.

Unvote Tawarochir.

 Vote notquitethere.

I would like to note that post editing is frowned upon in Mafia games for obvious reasons. Considering he's new he might have an excuse for the moment, though.

Hmm I'm not very angry yet, you won't like me when I'm angry also I could also argue that you are scum because you are aggressive and are accusing me because I didn't accuse someone.
Also the active lurking is because I leave my browser open when i do stuff.

I'm going to quote this bit so if you edit it again for some reason we'll know easier. I didn't notice the first time you did it.

It was different. I posted my response before he edited. Hm.

Okay, that's it. I'm saying a notquitethere and a hiddenleafguy scum team for the moment. Let's take them down.

Should I keep my vote on nqt or move it to hlg?

this was my argument

Hiddenleafguy, how many games of Mafia(forum or otherwise) have you played?

this had already been asked by graknorke.

Target: Hiddenleafguy
2. Your posts are tiny tiny tiny. Canst thou not use big words?

I had used this for when I voted for hiddenleafguy. looking back at all of this you have been on the defensive for the majority of the game.

1. Okay, validated. A town lynch can often lead to good things. But the thing is, it leads ever closer to the Mafia victory! Most of the time town should not be passive and let themselves get lynched, because their living is much more harmful to scum and their continued arguing can locate scum better. The benefit of a town lynch is outweighed by that of a scum lynch. Always try to lynch scum. A townie defending himself logically is a good thing, because it means scum is more likely to be lynched.
1.5. At the moment, the most likely scum team looks like you(Urist McCoder) and hiddenleafguy.
2. 2 dimensional? Sure. You consider my defenses weak, and they likely are, but that's no reason to lynch me. By the way if you want town lynches(I hope not), a weak defense is a good thing for you, Urist McCoder.
3. Much of those examples are invalid, and as for the copied arguments I did use, I felt validated using them at the time because they seemed true.

It may be more effective to lynch Urist McCoder rather than the more noobish Hiddenleafguy, but I'll keep my vote on Hiddenleafguy for now because I want to keep my focus-nah, I'm focusing on Urist McCoder at the moment. Unvote Hiddenleafguy(don't think I've stopped watching you), Vote Urist McCoder.

Can I get a vote count?

[Urist McCoder]

FOU I was not trying to say that you should let yourself get lynched. I was saying that all you did for many pages was say you are town.

[FallacyofUrist]

... yes, I said for many pages, "I am town".

Have we not yet established that that was temporary insanity(noob craziness sparked by game start) of a sort?

Is that really your main reason for assaulting me? Temporary insanity?

[FallacyofUrist]

And one more thing:

FOU I was not trying to say that you should let yourself get lynched. I was saying that all you did for many pages was say you are town.

Couldn't you have done a bit more post analysis than one sentence? For that matter, that's not analysis, that's correcting yourself(or at least explaining yourself better).

[Urist McCoder]

Everybody but Hiddenleafguy: what is your current opinion on Hiddenleafguy?

this is another thing that makes me think you are scum. You ask for other peoples opinions instead of formulating your own arguments. this makes it seem like you don't want to stand out, which as far as I understand is something of a scum tell.

Objection! He could be using the opinions to formulate his own arguments!

It just seems really scummy considering that he asked who to vote for earlier. And even if he is using it to formulate an opinion, it seems like the main reason for him leaning on other peoples opinions is to not stand out while still having an argument that would pass muster.

FOU the reason for the whole correcting my self thing is because when I talk it takes me a while to figure what what word best suits the current situation. And I don't really have a good way to figure out what word to use when I am posting in forums. So i end up correcting myself, and not being very clear in how I present my thoughts.