NQTI'm going to have to vote NQT. I can't give an in depth analysis at the moment, but the short form is that his behaviour just seems off. [1]He was questioning Cheeetar's reasoning for voting on Scintillant until an hour before day's end, then voted for Scin over me because of the same reasoning he was questioning an hour before. [2] The flip flop on the vote and him declaring me to be town today make me think he was trying to set me up for the final mislynch, since leaving Scin alive would have had Scripten still defending him.
[3]NQT, what was your reason for investigating Cheeetar in the first night instead of one of the people who were acting suspiciously day one, like Crusader?
1. I was trying to press my town ally to make the best damn case he could make. I wanted to be confident he was playing at his best so as to maximise the chance of not mislynching.
This is hilarious bad. I realize our newbie players may not be quite as entertained as I am, but yeah... Basically, NQT is saying that he was foregoing scumhunting to focus on confirmed town. Why? To make sure that this player was scumhunting well.
But he claims to have investigated Cheeetar due to Cheeetar's experience. Wat?
If Cheeetar was so experienced, then why did you see the need to coach him, NQT?
2. I switched my votes because of a genuine doubt over you being scum, and although I wasn't 100% happy with a Scint lynch, it was the better of the two options. Changing votes is always the right thing to do if you have legitimate doubts. Being afraid of putting yourself in the firing line and keeping quiet is the worst thing to do.
Doubts you apparently didn't decide to air until... actually, you never aired these doubts.
Your last post before the series in which you mislynched Scintillant. That doesn't look like doubt to me. In fact, right before you vote Scintillant, you wrote
this post here. Can you show me the doubt you claim you had? Because I'm seeing less doubt here than in my own play, and I still found Deus Asmoth the best place for my vote! Thankfully, you showed that I was wrong to be voting him -and- outed your entire team. I consider that a pretty awesome situation.
3. Mostly, it was this game. I knew Cheetar was a formidable opponent if he was playing as scum. I had just replaced in, it was night time and I didn't personally have that much time.
So... you investigated a player not on their actions in this game but on shaky metagame analysis? The game you're posting was a chaotic role mania game where the majority of the gameplay was happening off-screen! How in the world can you consider that good, let alone better, justification?
I had a read through the thread and although other people had found folk scummy, they were all people likely to be lynched by town anyhow. Much better to pick someone unsuspected but dangerous: best case, he would have been scum and then I could get him lynched; worst case and he's town (as happened), I could be sure of having a competent town ally. I thought about investigating Krusader but figured that so many people found him scummy he'd like as not be lynched without my investigation, whereas a scum-cheetar would almost certainly never be lynched. Scripten claims to have made a N1 pick based on his "gut"-- do you find that a more compelling reason?
Oooh, so this time you had time to read through the thread? I thought you just said that there wasn't much time so you had to rely on metagame analysis?
It's like you're just building a web of your own lies that you can't even keep consistent from sentence to sentence or something.
1. Investigating the most competent and experienced player is a flimsy reason to investigate? Sorry what? I saw how Cheetar, as scum, won Wuba's last game; I didn't want him as a foe. 2. Talk about flimsy reasons! You had a 'gut' feeling. You expect people to buy that? 3. Completely ignoring the fact that the second person I got a town read on was still alive, but sure, go ahead and spread transparent lies.
Again, totally different game, with a totally different gamestate. You're literally just appealing to your accomplishment as a veteran mafia player here, by saying that your supposed gut read is more valid than my gut read. Hypocrite.
By the way, you've ignored the elephant in the room. If you were going by experience and likelihood to be lynched, why didn't you investigate
me on Night 2? Sure, I'm not an IC, but if you had been following the game, you would have seen references to my experience and the way in which other players were reacting to it. The closest I ever came to being lynched was when Dorsidwarf accused me and Scintillant of being scumbuddies, which was invalidated by Scint's town flip. And it's not like you weren't pretending to be suspicious of me.
So please, elucidate us.
So you admit my actions weren't scummy. That's good, because they weren't.
I said that avoiding a no-lynch was a null action, not that your actions weren't scummy as all hell. They totally were, especially for a player that purports to play from such a high-minded logical stance. What you're selling here is that town!NQT came into the game at the very end of the day, voted a player with no wagon on them, then came back mere minutes before day's end to purportedly break a tie, voting for a player because you had a "trusted town read" that you apparently didn't find competent enough to play without your "coaching" earlier in the day. That just doesn't work.
I knew Cheetar was town, and my different methods were given mixed indications for Deus/Scintillant (no mystery, now, as it turns out they're both town).
Yeah... the only difference between Scintillant and Deus Asmoth you knew about was that you thought you could push me into lynching DA, but not Scintillant. Your actions were blatant, sir. Nobody's fooled.
I often air last minute worries and um and ah when I'm breaking a tie. See this game for instance, where I break a tie and lynch scum but with extreme reticence.
You mean the game in which you were a newbie and were deferring to the two ICs?
Because that's totally relevant to your play now.(In case anyone is wondering, that is massive sarcasm.)
This is nonsense. My analysis was solid, some of the best I've done. I'm pretty sure my conclusions about the voting patterns will draw out, though can't say for certain until we lynch you and your scumbuddy (Dwarf is it?).
*BZZZT* I'm sorry, that's not the answer we're looking for.
Thank you for your qualitative opinion on your own play. Johnny, tell him what's he's won!
And further, do you deny that newbie players mislynch one another all the time? Hasn't this very fact been born out so far this game?
Since when are you a newbie?
This is ironic. I found your baseless insinuations scummy. Over-reading isn't scumhunting. And you say I was subtly manipulating, but you can't say who was supposed to have been taken in by this.
Tsk tsk. Over-reading, is it? Here, let me pull up a handy dandy quote (I like having evidence for my claims, have you noticed?) and we can let our fellows make their own conclusions:
NQT:
Scintillant offers a number of reasons to vote Shamrock and backs them up in reference to actual posts. This case is formed in reaction to Scripten's questioning, and the vote on Shamrock is buried in the response rather than directed at their target. A great way to to get inexperienced players mislynched is to not directly question them when you're trying to lynch them.
What exactly are you implying here? Are you implying that I was trying to get Comrade mislynched? You seem to be saying at first that my case against Comrade was good, but then go into observations about it and describe a possible scumtell. How do those three things relate?
Poor Scintillant must have been very scummy to you, NQT. I mean, he thought you were making implications and being subtly manipulative. Tell me, what did that get him?
Oh right.
You mislynched him.Oh, and as for who was supposed to be taken in by your implications, I'm pretty sure scum can't lynch town without at least one townie joining them on a wagon. It's almost as if you pushed that Scintillant was scummy and didn't hop on the wagon until late in the day, when it had already formed without your help, and guaranteed the mislynch of a most inconvenient player. Or maybe that's exactly what happened.
Again this is nonsense. Changing your mind as you gain new insights is not scummy; whereas sitting on the same case all day like you did is.
Ah, yes, because nailing in a mislynch mere minutes before the end of the day isn't scummy, silly me! How silly I am to forget that actually scumhunting instead of being a manipulative, underhanded scummer is absolutely the worst way to play as town!
What would we do without your masterful insight, NQT?
Deus AsmothScripten, why did you investigate NQT last night anyway? The last minute vote change was suspicious, but you were certain I was scum for the majority of day 2. Why not check if you were right?
This is pertinent. I was not sure that you were scum by day's end, though, until NQT showed up with his scummy move onto the Scint wagon, I didn't have any better options for a lynch. Seeing NQT, an experienced player, do something so blatant made me massively suspicious. Sadly, the post I wrote with regard to that was struck from the record, but I still have my investigative result on him. To be totally honest, NQT's lynch choice was not terrible scum play, considering he probably thought Cheeetar was the cop, due to the slightly quieter way he was playing. If he'd realized I was the cop, he definitely would not have lynched the guy I was defending all day in such an audacious and scum-sided manner.