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[GrizzlyAdamz]

So uh, what's with the health meter getting dark? That some sort of stamina damage?

I kinda wish I could try it with the cursor glued to the floor instead of being painted onto the lens of the camera. I feel it could make it feel more consistent.
Fighting these controls is rage-inducing.

[Virtz]

So uh, what's with the health meter getting dark? That some sort of stamina damage?

I kinda wish I could try it with the cursor glued to the floor instead of being painted onto the lens of the camera. I feel it could make it feel more consistent.
Fighting these controls is rage-inducing.

There's two types of damage. Temporary, denoted by darkening the yellow bar, caused by lighter blunt damage (including in the case of bladed weapon hits that fail to penetrate armour), regenerates automatically with time. Permanent, denoted in red, requires items to heal (very rare in Exanima, but they give a full heal each).

And yeah, the controls take getting used to. But it becomes pretty satisfying in a Die by the Sword sort of way once you get it (although still less clunky than that). Remember that double-click does an over-head, and the attack gets directed at the floor you're pointing at, so you want to aim at where someone's standing rather than directly at them.

[hemperor]

  Very impressive!!! maybe the most realist fight animation that i ever seen!

[GrizzlyAdamz]

Hm, the dev said something about 'wailing against an enemy's defenses is bad, trying to find openings is good', and trying to hit an enemy's weak/non-shield/free side doesn't seem to be very successful- no damage, no real push-back, not even with a solid wind-up & a high-impact weapon.
Is jabbing them while they're swinging really the only way to score a hit?
Seems the AI is just so much more in-control of their movement, every little slow-mo tap or over-swing that manages to graze me takes out a chunk of my HP. Not to mention the way they wield 1h weapons, they have about the same reach as my 2h.

I really wish I could see how the AI aims & moves, their control inputs.

[Virtz]

Hm, the dev said something about 'wailing against an enemy's defenses is bad, trying to find openings is good', and trying to hit an enemy's weak/non-shield/free side doesn't seem to be very successful- no damage, no real push-back, not even with a solid wind-up & a high-impact weapon.
Is jabbing them while they're swinging really the only way to score a hit?

I think it's also possible to get under their block and hit the legs, provided they're using one-handed arms. Best to just counter, tho.

Most of the undead in the main mode don't block at all, tho. Only special ones you'll immediately recognize do.

Seems the AI is just so much more in-control of their movement, every little slow-mo tap or over-swing that manages to graze me takes out a chunk of my HP. Not to mention the way they wield 1h weapons, they have about the same reach as my 2h.

I find that an important factor of range is how you're moving at the time. Moving towards the enemy will lengthen it, moving away will shorten it. So trying to be both defensive and attack isn't gonna work great unless you have a significant weapon range advantage.

[Vortex Rikers]

After a solid day of practicing and getting to know the controls, I am amazed at how fluid the combat system is. It's brutally difficult, but once you wrap your head around it, learn to judge distances, study the movements of your enemy it becomes unbelievably satisfying.

[GrizzlyAdamz]

@Virts
Glad to know that about the undead.
Yeah, but I'm still spinning my character in circles with incorrect mouse movement. Though the AI may not be as smart as me, it always does exactly what it wants to do.
If there's a difficulty slider, I think I'll unashamedly be playing on easy.

After a solid day of practicing and getting to know the controls, I am amazed at how fluid the combat system is. It's brutally difficult, but once you wrap your head around it, learn to judge distances, study the movements of your enemy it becomes unbelievably satisfying.

How do you reliably get around the mace-peasant and the barbarian woman?
Those two are just too real.

[SalmonGod]

I think I'm starting to really get the hang of this, and it feels amazing.  It... really just takes some time for the timing of the footwork to start to feel intuitive.  There's a rhythm to it, and it's very hard to maneuver until you start to get a feel for when those big steps are going to happen and how they'll effect everyone's momentum.

But once you start getting the hang of it... you then start realizing how goddamn versatile this thing is.  I love how when I fail an offensive manuever, I can dull my opponent's counter-attack by pushing into them and throwing off their swing.  Or how picking up a new weapon is kind of like re-learning the game.  This is the most powerful case I've ever seen in game design of equipment choice being genuinely down to play style.  Fighting with that two-hand hammer is completely different from fighting with a hatchet and shield, to the point that you can't consciously adjust.  It's a "feel" thing.

[Vortex Rikers]

If I have a long, two handed weapon, for a split second I move the mouse cursor to my left shoulder, then quickly move the mouse cursor forward towards the maceman/shield woman. They have a hard time blocking attacks that are coming to their right, since the shield is worn on the left hand, and that particular movement sends a very strong, clockwise swing.
Or, just stay on the defensive. Read the movements of your opponents. As soon as you see an opening, you strike. If they move forward, you step back. When they swing their weapon left, then right, they need a fraction of a second to recover their momentum, this is an ideal time to attack.

It's like dancing, you have to get in the rhythm of it. I barely played this game beyond a couple of days, it's difficult to explain.

Edit: @SalmonGod, it's giving me massive Mount and Blade flashbacks when I first picked the original game up many, many years ago. It's completely different from anything I've played up to this point, and requires forgetting everything you 'know' about combat in video games.

[SalmonGod]

I've also found that staying on the offensive can work out just fine as well, so long as you're good enough with the in & out timing that you don't give them an opening.  I finally beat the girl with the axe & shield by slowly beating her down with aggressive strikes from my 2-hand hammer, even though she blocked every single one.  I kept to an in & out rhythm that kept her reeling and unable to close distance and counter-attack.

It also helps when you get some armor... it allows you to be much more aggressive, because as I mentioned before, you can throw off the enemy's balance to prevent them from getting a strong hit in.  Once you get some armor from the 4th or 5th arena opponent, you can use this strategy to stay on the offensive and shrug off most of the weak counter-attacks they throw at you.

The guy after the axe+shield girl is tough.... has a massive two-hand sword that seems to be pretty sharp.  He doesn't need a strong swing to do decent damage to you, even with armor.  And he uses his range well.  Need to be good at parrying to fight him.  But I've only reached him 3 times.

I'm really impressed with the scaling of the AI.  Each fighter doesn't seem to just have better equipment.  They seem to get genuinely more competent at fighting, too.  I can pretty much rush in and beat down the first guy at this point, and his responses seem much clumsier than everyone after him.

Well... I just beat the expert arena.  I'm really excited to see this progress.  As is, the base mechanics feel fairly polished.  The overall rhythm of combat could be tightened up a bit... but that's seriously my only complaint.  I found the evolution of combat as it progressed into higher tier equipment pretty interesting.  Things change pretty dramatically when both parties are dressed in plate armor.  It's a lot more shoving and scraping as both sides work at getting in those solid blows.  And weaponry becomes a little less about personal preference, and more about trading your own defense for more ability to pry open that enemy can.  A short sword isn't going to do the job very well.  The weapon that I settled on for my final attempts was a flanged mace.

[sebcool]

Well, this game is definitely getting my money.

I just wish it was on GOG.

[Virtz]

Glad to know that about the undead.
Yeah, but I'm still spinning my character in circles with incorrect mouse movement. Though the AI may not be as smart as me, it always does exactly what it wants to do.
If there's a difficulty slider, I think I'll unashamedly be playing on easy.

Well, maybe try looking at a combat tutorial to get a better grasp of basic controls?

How do you reliably get around the mace-peasant and the barbarian woman?
Those two are just too real.

Against shield users I find overhead swings to be the most reliable. I think you can even get a hit in when they're blocking if you place it just right. Overheads are kind of hard to land in general due to enemy side-stepping, but once they hit it's really heavy damage, maybe even a knockdown, especially when you hit the head.

Alternatively, as SalmonGod mentioned, you can get good results with a backhand swing. A tactic that often seems to work against the AI is doing a forehand swing and continuing to hold down the LMB to do the followup backhand swing. The AI may let its guard down after the forehand to counter-attack, but be too slow to carry it out before the backhand lands.

[SalmonGod]

I can't get overhead swings to work very well.  I double-click and my character only executes the attack maybe 1/3 of the time.  And it's usually really weak.  I've been subject to some vicious overhead strikes, though.  Right in the face.

So..... I'm trying the dungeon crawl section of the game again, thinking all the practice in the arena will have paid off.  No it fucking did not.  Those zombies are still murdering me.  WTF.  I may have to give up on this, until they implement a save feature.  It's incredibly frustrating starting over from scratch and going through the same stuff every time.

[sebcool]

Played the game for 9 hours. Completed the novice and expert arena, but god damn I can't figure out the main game. I've never been good at dungeon crawling (especially when I'm under-equipped), and I'm having a really hard time surviving, even when trying to avoid most of the enemies.

But the combat is amazing. Best system I've ever tried. It's amazing just how complex you can make the system with just one button.

[Puzzlemaker]

Combat is difficult, it needs to have easier enemies in the beginning to teach players how to play.  Right now you are on even footing in a very deep and complicated combat system, which involves a lot of frustration.