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[Neonivek]

The political spectrum is not a circle. It's a delliberate misrepresentation which has survived to our day and lost it's original meaning

I've seen the Spectrum test... yeah...

Better yet it is intentionally misleading. You think that everyone has some sort of purpose in life? Well you are communist!

[SalmonGod]

All reports so far tonight indicate a complete lack of activity by the police.  I think those in charge realize what a political disaster the crackdown was and have ordered the police to be as hands off as possible until they can figure out what to do.  There was a big metal fence already erected around the park after the eviction, and police just watched as protesters tore the whole thing down by hand.

[Dsarker]

Well, according to the article, sexual assault, plain assault, and other crime was rampant in the camp.

[Loud Whispers]

According to the media in the UK, Anonymous is a hacker group out to destroy the world, the guy fawkes mask is a sign of rebellion and the protesters are protesting against capitalism.

/sigh/well informed/not biased

[MonkeyHead]

According to the media in the UK, Anonymous is a hacker group out to destroy the world, the guy fawkes mask is a sign of rebellion and the protesters are protesting against capitalism.

/sigh/well informed/not biased

Sceptical as I am of all coverage of events such as the ones unfolding, that comment just aint true... or am I not getting sarcasm?

TBH the Occupy London lot arent doing themselves any favours by blocking off St Pauls - IMHO most neutrals will feel sorry for an Anglican Church in such a situation. Maybe if they had chosen a Catholic building...

[SalmonGod]

Well, according to the article, sexual assault, plain assault, and other crime was rampant in the camp.

I'm not buying that it was rampant.  I've only seen a couple specific examples mentioned in all the stuff I've read.  The sexual assault claim seems especially out of place to me, since I've seen at least one specific example cited for every other accusation, but the sexual assault is always tucked in between the others or mentioned like some sort of afterthought -- "oh and.... sexual assault"  I'm just very critical of these things, because pretty much every propaganda technique is used in these situations.  They'll lie about what weapons they're using.  They'll send in undercover agents and agent provocateurs.  They'll mention isolated incidents in a context that makes them sound common... and so on.  The OPD have already been caught at lying and infiltration.

But some bad things did definitely happen at the camp.  The occupation there wasn't handling itself very well, and I hope it takes this whole event as an eye opener that they need to push for more responsible behavior and self-regulation if they want to survive long-term.

[Dsarker]

I don't doubt that it wasn't very often, nor do I claim that it happened at all.

In fact, is there any evidence for it besides hearsay? Were police called to the camp?

[Loud Whispers]

According to the media in the UK, Anonymous is a hacker group out to destroy the world, the guy fawkes mask is a sign of rebellion and the protesters are protesting against capitalism.

/sigh/well informed/not biased

Sceptical as I am of all coverage of events such as the ones unfolding, that comment just aint true... or am I not getting sarcasm?

TBH the Occupy London lot arent doing themselves any favours by blocking off St Pauls - IMHO most neutrals will feel sorry for an Anglican Church in such a situation. Maybe if they had chosen a Catholic building...

Agreed, the protesters have made paths and signs to allow people through, but a lot of people have been scared off :/
But no, really pretty much every newspaper is saying the most moronic things.....

[SalmonGod]

Rubber bullets are very much confirmed at this point.

The OPD has been staunchly denying that these were used.

Anyway, there was one report of a guy being assaulted by a 2x4 at the camp.  When paramedics arrived, occupiers obstructed them.  I have no idea why they would do that, but that's the story.  And... that's really the only specific instance of crime that I've heard mention of.  Everything else has just been really vague picture painting.  Apparently a rat infestation had moved into the camp and conditions were getting unsanitary, which got the camp labeled as a "health hazard".  Just how bad it was isn't clear, but I sincerely doubt the hazard was as great as that presented by shitloads of tear gas, small explosives, and soft ammunitions being fired directly at crowds of people...

It's also pretty clear that at least some protesters were being unfriendly towards police.  Before the morning raid, there was one incident where someone threw some paint at police, which they described as "assault with hazardous chemicals" in their official press justifying the raid.  After the raid and before Oakland turned into a war zone that night, many protesters were throwing rocks and bottles.

I'm off to bed now.  I'm sure plenty more info will surface tomorrow.

[Loud Whispers]

Rubber bullets are very much confirmed at this point.

The OPD has been staunchly denying that these were used.

Anyway, there was one report of a guy being assaulted by a 2x4 at the camp.  When paramedics arrived, occupiers obstructed them.  I have no idea why they would do that, but that's the story.  And... that's really the only specific instance of crime that I've heard mention of.  Everything else has just been really vague picture painting.  Apparently a rat infestation had moved into the camp and conditions were getting unsanitary, which got the camp labeled as a "health hazard".  Just how bad it was isn't clear, but I sincerely doubt the hazard was as great as that presented by shitloads of tear gas, small explosives, and soft ammunitions being fired directly at crowds of people...

It's also pretty clear that at least some protesters were being unfriendly towards police.  Before the morning raid, there was one incident where someone threw some paint at police, which they described as "assault with hazardous chemicals" in their official press justifying the raid.  After the raid and before Oakland turned into a war zone that night, many protesters were throwing rocks and bottles.

I'm off to bed now.  I'm sure plenty more info will surface tomorrow.

You have to be skeptical when people do things they have been campainging aganst for days... Weeks...

[Neonivek]

plain assault

I hate it when people assault me with their plainness

[palsch]

TBH the Occupy London lot arent doing themselves any favours by blocking off St Pauls - IMHO most neutrals will feel sorry for an Anglican Church in such a situation. Maybe if they had chosen a Catholic building...

To be fair, they didn't block it off. They had worked with the cathedral as much as they could before a sudden reversal on very flimsy grounds.

David Allen Green documented everything that went on regarding the closure and health and safety claims in the New Statesman.

http://www.newstatesman.com/blogs/david-allen-green/2011/10/health-safety-cathedral-camp

And today the Canon Chancellor who originally supported the protest using the grounds resigned. It's looking like there is some internal politics going on between those who support the protests and those against them. The CofE have been looking progressive lately, but traditionally are seen as a Tory club with nicer club houses. Elements encouraging the closure to make the protesters look bad would not surprise me.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/mobile/uk-england-15472362

Sorry for crappy links: on my phone on a bus.

[sneakey pete]

I'm not buying that it was rampant.  I've only seen a couple specific examples mentioned in all the stuff I've read.  The sexual assault claim seems especially out of place to me, since I've seen at least one specific example cited for every other accusation, but the sexual assault is always tucked in between the others or mentioned like some sort of afterthought -- "oh and.... sexual assault"  I'm just very critical of these things, because pretty much every propaganda technique is used in these situations.  They'll lie about what weapons they're using.  They'll send in undercover agents and agent provocateurs.  They'll mention isolated incidents in a context that makes them sound common... and so on.  The OPD have already been caught at lying and infiltration.

Yep, the evil corporations are all sending minions in to stir trouble, but hey someone who got sexually assaulted would never be cagey about it at all ever would they.

[mainiac]

The victims would be cagey yes but not the police department or mayors office spokesmen.

[Jake]

And today the Canon Chancellor who originally supported the protest using the grounds resigned. It's looking like there is some internal politics going on between those who support the protests and those against them. The CofE have been looking progressive lately, but traditionally are seen as a Tory club with nicer club houses. Elements encouraging the closure to make the protesters look bad would not surprise me.

My (limited) experience of the CofE is that they're actually pretty good about adhering to all the New Testament, not just the bits that enable their parishoners to feel smug and superior compared to their heathen neighbours. At least on the frontlines, anyway; I'm sure office politics gets just as Darwinian in the higher echelons of the Church as in any other large organisation. And they're the established State church and thus answerable to the Crown, or in practice to Parliament; Her Majesty could technically countermand the Prime Minister if she really wanted to, but that would effectively mean a return to absolute monarchy if it didn't push us over the brink and into out and out civil war.