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[Neyvn]

Draw Card.
Tap Both Farmers +4Food
Play Scout to Military Zone -3Food
End Turn

Ched Draw 11

Spoiler: Status (click to show/hide)

Cheddarius
FS 25
{f}x7 {w}x0 {s}x0 {m}x0

Field:
-Military zone:

-Civilians zone:
Peasant
Peasant
Smith

Used draws: 2, 6, 17, 10, 45, 1, 15, 36, 24, 11

Grave:
[Full Alert]

Neyvn
FS 25
{f}x1 {w}x0 {s}x0 {m}x0

Field:
-Military zone:
Recruit
Scout

-Civilian Zone:
Farmer
Farmer
Smith



Grave:
[Full Alert]

Used draws: 14, 7, 37, 40, 29, 47, 9, 18, 25, 24, 31

[Cheddarius]

You've made a few editing mistakes (not adding the food you got, etc.)
From now on, could you copy the status from my post when updating, instead of yours? Otherwise, it won't be correct. For example, if on my turn I gather some food, and then you copy the text from your post before that turn, I won't have the food that I got.

Both peasants gather.
I play [Dwarf Scout] to my Military Zone for 3 food.

Neyvn's Draw: 26

Spoiler: Status (click to show/hide)

Cheddarius
FS 25
{f}x6 {w}x0 {s}x0 {m}x0

Field:
-Military zone:[Dwarf Scout]

-Civilians zone:
[Dwarf Peasant]
[Dwarf Peasant]
[Dwarf Smith]

Used draws: 2, 6, 17, 10, 45, 1, 15, 36, 24, 11

Grave:
[Full Alert]

Neyvn
FS 25
{f}x9 {w}x0 {s}x0 {m}x0

Field:
-Military zone:
[Dwarf Recruit]
[Dwarf Scout]

-Civilian Zone:
[Dwarf Farmer]
[Dwarf Farmer]
[Dwarf Smith]



Grave:
[Full Alert]
[Dwarf Peasant]
[Dwarf Peasant]

Used draws: 7, 9, 14, 18, 24, 25, 26, 29, 31, 37, 40, 47

[Neyvn]

My Food should be correct...

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Turn 2 +1  1
Turn 3 +1  2
Turn 4 -2  0
Turn 5 +4 -4  0
Turn 6 +4 -3  1
This Turn

Your Food should be...

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Turn 2 +1 1
Turn 3 +2 3
Turn 4 +2 -2 3
Turn 5 +2 5
Turn 6 +2 -3 4
This Turn Coming

Only ever had 1 Peasant

Anyway
Draw Card//
Tap both farmers +4 F
End Turn

Ched Draw 14

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Cheddarius
FS 25
{f}x4 {w}x0 {s}x0 {m}x0

Field:
-Military zone:[Dwarf Scout]

-Civilians zone:
[Dwarf Peasant]
[Dwarf Peasant]
[Dwarf Smith]

Used draws: 2, 6, 17, 10, 45, 1, 15, 36, 47, 24, 11, 14

Grave:
[Full Alert]
[Wall]

Neyvn
FS 25
{f}x5 {w}x0 {s}x0 {m}x0

Field:
-Military zone:
[Dwarf Recruit]
[Dwarf Scout]

-Civilian Zone:
[Dwarf Farmer]
[Dwarf Farmer]
[Dwarf Smith]

Grave:
[Full Alert]
[Dwarf Peasant]

Used draws: 14, 7, 37, 40, 29, 47, 9, 18, 25, 16, 31, 26

[Cheddarius]

Oh yeah never mind, sorry.

Primary Phase: I play [Dwarf Manager]. Both Peasants gather.
Combat Phase: My Dwarf Scout attacks! Pick a unit to have it attack, or take the hit to your Fortress Strength.

Neyvn's Draw: 12

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Cheddarius
FS 25
{f}x2 {w}x0 {s}x0 {m}x0

Field:
-Military zone:[Dwarf Scout]

-Civilians zone:
[Dwarf Peasant]
[Dwarf Peasant]
[Dwarf Smith]
[Dwarf Manager]

Used draws: 2, 6, 17, 10, 45, 1, 15, 36, 47, 24, 11, 14

Grave:
[Full Alert]
[Wall]

Neyvn
FS 25
{f}x5 {w}x0 {s}x0 {m}x0

Field:
-Military zone:
[Dwarf Recruit]
[Dwarf Scout]

-Civilian Zone:
[Dwarf Farmer]
[Dwarf Farmer]
[Dwarf Smith]

Grave:
[Full Alert]
[Dwarf Peasant]
[Dwarf Peasant]

Used Draws: 7, 9, 12, 14, 18, 24, 25, 26, 29, 31, 37, 40, 47

[Neyvn]

Was gonna double check with Combat just now, so good as time as any...
When combat between critters happen, they deal damage to eachother at the same time right. So if I blocked with say my Recruit they would both die...

Also the reason that the critters untapping at the end of your turn is stupid is cause you can attack and defend all the time without worrying about anything. Also makes some cards pointless. Surprise attack for one of them. Its better that your critters untap at the beginning of Your turn, meaning that they are tapped DURING your opponents turn...

Gonna Block with my Recruit...

[Cheddarius]

No, my Scout would kill your Recruit. The defending unit does not attack:

Creatures in D:TH are either melee attackers or ranged attackers.  There are a number of differences between the two.  When you begin your combat step you declare your melee attackers and what player you are attacking.  That player then chooses which creatures or structures will take the attacks, choosing one per attack.  When a melee attacker does damage to another creature, that creature takes damage equal to the attacking creature's stregnth, the first listed number at the bottom of the card.  Damage is subtracted from the creature's toughness, the second listed number, and is kept track of for the turn.  If a creature's toughness is ever 0 that creature is removed from play and sent to its owner's crypt.

Note that it says the defending creature takes damage, but not the attacking one.

Why does your cards being tapped or untapped during my turn matter? I don't understand.

I think Surprise Attack is for doing this:
Primary Phase: I play Morul, Dwarf of Dwarves. Look at his beard, Ye Mighty, and despair.
      I use Surprise Attack. He is -(X)-ed.
Combat Phase: Morul single-handedly chops down your entire fortress. I win.

Your Recruit dies. Your turn.

[Neyvn]

See in Magic the Gathering when you attack you leave yourself open to a counter attack meaning you have to think more then throwing all your units at your foe. Also when a creature blocks they both do damage to one another unless one of them has the ability called first strike, first strike allows them to hit first and if it had enough attack points to hit all the target's defence points then the first striker does not get hit in response. This allows for more Tactics to be added into the combat phase, cause if you look at what just happened...

Whats the point in blocking. I am now less a unit and you still have yours. Sure I can attack myself with the Scout I own, but then you could easily block or something like that...

Also the reason that Untapping should only happen at the start of your own turns is cause it allows the other to know what has been used, where there is gaps in the opponents field and what moves they can do to get around them...

For example. Attacking with your scout now, and it remained tapped until the beginning of my turn allows me to freely play an Event Card without worrying about you countering it with the said scout. So the moment a scout hits the field and remains alive the opponent can't play ANY Event cards due to the limited number there is, cause you can't really play a weak event card in hopes to play a strong one cause atm they are all strong...

None the less, I am playing to see all these faults and flaws that can arise in both cards and play...

My Turn...
Draw.
Tap Farmers +4
Play Last Stand. Collect Recruit from Grave. Undraft Recruit to a Peasant... Due to Last Stand targeting Recruit, Peasant is not affected by Last Stand.
Attack with Scout.]

Ched Draw: 29

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Cheddarius
FS 25
{f}x2 {w}x0 {s}x0 {m}x0

Field:
-Military zone:[Dwarf Scout]

-Civilians zone:
[Dwarf Peasant]
[Dwarf Peasant]
[Dwarf Smith]
[Dwarf Manager]

Used draws: 2, 6, 17, 10, 45, 1, 15, 36, 47, 24, 11, 14, 26

Grave:
[Full Alert]
[Wall]

Neyvn
FS 25
{f}x5 {w}x0 {s}x0 {m}x0

Field:
-Military zone:
[Dwarf Scout]

-Civilian Zone:
[Dwarf Farmer]
[Dwarf Farmer]
[Dwarf Smith]
[Dwarf Peasant]

Grave:
[Full Alert]
[Last Stand]
[Dwarf Recruit]

Used Draws: 14, 7, 37, 40, 29, 47, 9, 18, 25, 16, 31, 26, 12

Also to note your numbers for the Used Draws in my list from your spoiler is wrong. Use mine please...

[Cheddarius]

Hmmm, yes, those do add another layer of strategy to the game.

Listen, I don't intend offense, but that's a really cheap way to use Last Stand. I don't think that was the way it was intended to be used; I think you just found a loophole. It's like saying "I play this card that reflects damage for one turn. Now I play this card that lets me sacrifice damage to get more cards. I sacrifice 10 billion damage, you lose."

[Neyvn]

Welcome to Magic the Gathering Strategies...
Its a common thing from where I come from (MTG games) to Find these loopholes as you call them and manipulate them. Trust me, Go to a Gaming store where there is a MTG Comp on and during the break ask them about their Crazy combos...

One example is a Combo which a Card when scarificed it gives 1 points of mana it costs 1 points of mana to play. Having a Card in play that allows you to return it to your hand for free somehow (Can't remember) allows you to play, sac, play, sac and repeat till the cows come home. Then play a card that costs 2 mana which reads... Deal 1 damage to Player or Creature. Storm (for each spell played before this card, Copy this card) I have been hit for the Population of the world once...

One sec give me a moment...

http://www.planeswalker.org/Magic-The-Gathering-Shroud/info/Wild-cantor-and-an-easy-win?id=8b4f0422680c2f64373f080aa7b696cb

[Cheddarius]

Sure, that's a legal Magic: The Gathering strategy.
Doesn't mean it's not totally cheap.

[Neyvn]

Sure, that's a legal Magic: The Gathering strategy.
Doesn't mean it's not totally cheap.

Sorry let me repharse that...
Its common TCG Strategy...

[Cheddarius]

Same rebuttal.

[Neyvn]

Same rebuttal.

Thats what I mean... Cards are written and set. Its up to the player to work out what to do with them. Meaning that even if its Cheap. Then no matter what, it don't matter. That combo I had in the post. No one can do anything about it really. Its cheap but its legal cause its playing the cards as they are written...

If Last Stand Read, If the minion is the target of an ability discard it. That would mean that the card is discarded before the Undraft ability triggers meaning that the Peasant is not targeted and thus not brought to the field...

[Cheddarius]

There is a difference between strategy and these sorts of combos. These games are supposed to be played with skill, and whoever is the best wins. That's the premise of most games, I believe, though many have some degree of luck. Being the best entails know how to use the cards, etc. It does not entail stacking your deck with four specific cards, waiting to draw them, and instantly winning. That's not skill, that's the ability to look up combos on the Internet.

Now, the problem with these combos is that they're too strong. Instantly winning once you get this combo makes the game boring and a poor test of skill. Suppose you had a card that said, "You win." or a Dwarf Smith that dealt 30 damage and had 100 health. Sure, that would be how the card was written, and perfectly legal. But it would make for a very boring game. Last Stand, when used with this loophole, lets people summon Elite Swordsdwarves for free, and that's just overpowered when compared with the rest of the deck. It keeps the game from being fun.

[Neyvn]

Last Stand, when used with this loophole, lets people summon Elite Swordsdwarves for free, and that's just overpowered when compared with the rest of the deck. It keeps the game from being fun.

Say what???
To summon a Elite you would have first lost a Sword or an Axe dwarf. And even then if you have LOST one to begin with you would have had it on the field to begin with aswell. Thus meaning you could have anyway. Yes there will be Combos that can be done that can make the play seem Unfair, but it still means that YOU can do it too as there is little variety in cards atm. ALSO this is more of a Alpha test of the game, It flawed, it has holes...

Last Stand brings back a creature from the Grave and puts it into the field for that turn to be used, after use it goes back to the grave. BUT what I have done is used the Creatures ability. This is in all Tech legal cause all I have done is brought it out of the grave...

The Creature's Ability is to Undraft, Discard itself (see sac) and bring a Peasant from the grave and put it one the field. Due to Last Stand Targeting the Recruit, and the Recruit is no longer on the field. Last Stand has been used. The Recruit is back in the Grave where it was going anyway and the game continues as normal. I don't see me having an I WIN combo there...

To Play a TGC, be it real or on a Fourm. You need to look at the cards, read the cards, be sure of what they say, then begin to work out how you can manipulate the rules. In Magic the Gathering there are Hundreds of FIRST TURN (As in your opponent doesn't even get to play) wins out there. You just need to know how to get the cards to do so...

Don't fret over this... Its just part of the game, I have just done what the cards read...