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[nenjin]

*shrug*

Cut out a piece of cardboard as a base, then another strip of cardboard 2" high and however long.

Blam, you have low walls.

Cut out two pieces of square cardboard. Cut one piece of the card board in half diagonally with an irregular, jagged cut. Glue both pieces corner to corner on your base.

Blam, you have half a ruined building.

Real, good terrain takes a lot of time and creativity. But you can just slap books on the table to break up line of sight and create elevation.

If you're really serious about making terrain though, go buy some poster board and some MDF. Cardboard warps and is a bitch to make clean cuts on. But it does the job for throw away terrain.

[BishopX]

Soda cans works great as well. You can cut them up lengthwise for bunkers or in half normally and use the ends as missle silos or some such.

It's a little old school but you can also use felt or paper cutouts for area terrain.

[dogstile]

Buying stuff from world war 2 games and converting them also works, for the more expensive tables.

(Used to have a job making the stuff, then playing on it, was good)

[Smitehappy]

I just wish my local comic store was more interested in 40k. Their 40k section is near barren and the ratio of 40k events to yugioh events is like 1 to 20.

[userpay]

Demon hunters and dark eldar are next for a codex upgrade. I haven't heard anything about tau (they are still very playable).

Hmm it seems like they care more about the splinter factons than the base factons which is irritating to say the least.

On the subject of availibility of games in local regions, I'm surprised at how popular yu-gi-oh is compared to magic the gathering is at my local card (comic book actually) shop. On the subject of tabletops I haven't really asked around the group but storewise there isn't that much warhammer stuff though they've also got some mechwarrior stuff that just isn't selling lol. Actually I think theres very little tabletop stuff other than what little warhammer they've got, they only got a few rulebooks and I think those are dnd 4.0 and maybe the basic warhammer books.

[dwarfguy2]

Demon hunters and dark eldar are next for a codex upgrade. I haven't heard anything about tau (they are still very playable).

Hmm it seems like they care more about the splinter factons than the base factons which is irritating to say the least.

On the subject of availibility of games in local regions, I'm surprised at how popular yu-gi-oh is compared to magic the gathering is at my local card (comic book actually) shop. On the subject of tabletops I haven't really asked around the group but storewise there isn't that much warhammer stuff though they've also got some mechwarrior stuff that just isn't selling lol. Actually I think theres very little tabletop stuff other than what little warhammer they've got, they only got a few rulebooks and I think those are dnd 4.0 and maybe the basic warhammer books.

reminds me, i got 4.0 rulebooks today. anyone up for a game?

[Sir Pseudonymous]

Demon hunters and dark eldar are next for a codex upgrade. I haven't heard anything about tau (they are still very playable).

Hmm it seems like they care more about the splinter factons than the base factons which is irritating to say the least.

It'd be nice if they ignored the myriad of bullshit SPAAAAAACCCCCEEEEEE MAAAAAARRRRRy-Sue chapters, but the inquisition and deldar haven't been updated since 3e, while the Tau are (early?) 4e. Of course, Daemon Hunters is just code for THUPER THPECIAL THPATHE MARINETH. >:|

I'd say an Ordo Xenos codex would be interesting, but I know it would just be LOLDEATHWATCH (which are, as far as I can tell, just normal space marysues in black armor, aside from being a force drafted from the other chapters), like the Ordo Malleum one is just LOLGRAYKNIGHTS. >:|

[MagmaDeath]

Yeah....
Tau are not very playable, at all.
You basically have to compose your force to take out the army you are going up against, and not let ANYTHING EVER get hit.

GW seems to hate the tau, and the dark elder even more...
They have like 5 different SPESS MARINE chapters, and updated all of them Pre Dark Eldar.

[Sir Pseudonymous]

Yeah....
Tau are not very playable, at all.
You basically have to compose your force to take out the army you are going up against, and not let ANYTHING EVER get hit.

Tau are quite playable. They just have mediocre infantry and shit vehicles. They're all about battlesuits.

They're still shit next to IG though.

[BishopX]

I'm actually more afraid of a competent tau player than an competent IG one when I play guard. Railguns own face.

[MagmaDeath]

I'm actually more afraid of a competent tau player than an competent IG one when I play guard. Railguns own face.

The problem is the fragility.

[userpay]

Well in a place that has alot of los blocking cover and such those smartmissiles can be a bitch as those can go right over, also if you can pin squads with the sniper teams thats pretty fun to. I don't have my books on me now but as I think Tau have a general lack of aoe weapons that can effectively take advantage of pinning.

[Sir Pseudonymous]

I'm actually more afraid of a competent tau player than an competent IG one when I play guard. Railguns own face.

Vendettas are like cheaper broadsides (140 for three twinlinked lascannons (which are identical to railguns) and two heavy bolters, as opposed to 210 for three broadsides, each with one twinlinked railgun) that are also fast flying transport scouts with heavy bolters strapped to them.

If it came down to a shootout between a vendetta and a single squad of two broadsides, it would probably come down to whichever player got the first turn, unless there was cover high enough for the vendetta could get behind, in which case it would almost certainly be the vendetta after an hour of furious calculations, I am a little less sure that it's so clear cut, but the vendetta still has the advantage. It has a 97% chance to kill one of the broadsides, a 66% chance to kill both, and a 24% chance to kill a theoretical third broadside two. With it's lascannons, that is. There's no way in hell I'm doing what I just did for the heavy bolters too (which is, computing the likelihood of a certain number of shots hitting, and then calculating for each of those the chance of each possible number of shots wounding. Now, I'm tired, and sick of number crunching, so this last step is probably wrong: I took the percentages for each number of wounds based on hit, and then combined them in the manner A+(1-A)*B=C and C+(1-C)*D=E, where C (or E) is the final percentage, depending on whether there were two or three numbers to combine. I have the feeling I'm wrong in making the assumption, and I believe I know the correct method, but quite frankly I don't give a shit right now, and it's close enough to give a decent idea of the odds). So yeah...


Regardless of the accuracy of the numbers, the broadsides would still be in a proportionally worse position, dying on a 2+ wound roll, having only two shots between them, inflicting a penetrating shot on a 3+ instead of 2+, and having neither guarantee a kill, or even damage. Then there's the heavy bolters to contend with, if the broadsides are within 36". Although wouldn't help too much against broadsides, they're still another factor tipping the scales in favor of the vendetta.

Against anything other than broadsides, the vendetta is certainly more lethal, and carries much more utility, being a fast transport scout skimmer than can deepstrike and carries both anti-infantry and anti-armor weapons, all in a 12/12/10 shell.

[Luke_Prowler]

I'm actually more afraid of a competent tau player than an competent IG one when I play guard. Railguns own face.

Vendettas are like cheaper broadsides (140 for three twinlinked lascannons (which are identical to railguns) and two heavy bolters, as opposed to 210 for three broadsides, each with one twinlinked railgun) that are also fast flying transport scouts with heavy bolters strapped to them.

If it came down to a shootout between a vendetta and a single squad of two broadsides, it would probably come down to whichever player got the first turn, unless there was cover high enough for the vendetta could get behind, in which case it would almost certainly be the vendetta after an hour of furious calculations, I am a little less sure that it's so clear cut, but the vendetta still has the advantage. It has a 97% chance to kill one of the broadsides, a 66% chance to kill both, and a 24% chance to kill a theoretical third broadside two. With it's lascannons, that is. There's no way in hell I'm doing what I just did for the heavy bolters too (which is, computing the likelihood of a certain number of shots hitting, and then calculating for each of those the chance of each possible number of shots wounding. Now, I'm tired, and sick of number crunching, so this last step is probably wrong: I took the percentages for each number of wounds based on hit, and then combined them in the manner A+(1-A)*B=C and C+(1-C)*D=E, where C (or E) is the final percentage, depending on whether there were two or three numbers to combine. I have the feeling I'm wrong in making the assumption, and I believe I know the correct method, but quite frankly I don't give a shit right now, and it's close enough to give a decent idea of the odds). So yeah...


Regardless of the accuracy of the numbers, the broadsides would still be in a proportionally worse position, dying on a 2+ wound roll, having only two shots between them, inflicting a penetrating shot on a 3+ instead of 2+, and having neither guarantee a kill, or even damage. Then there's the heavy bolters to contend with, if the broadsides are within 36". Although wouldn't help too much against broadsides, they're still another factor tipping the scales in favor of the vendetta.

Against anything other than broadsides, the vendetta is certainly more lethal, and carries much more utility, being a fast transport scout skimmer than can deepstrike and carries both anti-infantry and anti-armor weapons, all in a 12/12/10 shell.

These, along side Manticores and Chimeras, are what I hate about Guard.

[BishopX]

I'm actually more afraid of a competent tau player than an competent IG one when I play guard. Railguns own face.

Vendettas are like cheaper broadsides (140 for three twinlinked lascannons (which are identical to railguns) and two heavy bolters, as opposed to 210 for three broadsides, each with one twinlinked railgun) that are also fast flying transport scouts with heavy bolters strapped to them.

If it came down to a shootout between a vendetta and a single squad of two broadsides, it would probably come down to whichever player got the first turn, unless there was cover high enough for the vendetta could get behind, in which case it would almost certainly be the vendetta after an hour of furious calculations, I am a little less sure that it's so clear cut, but the vendetta still has the advantage. It has a 97% chance to kill one of the broadsides, a 66% chance to kill both, and a 24% chance to kill a theoretical third broadside two. With it's lascannons, that is. There's no way in hell I'm doing what I just did for the heavy bolters too (which is, computing the likelihood of a certain number of shots hitting, and then calculating for each of those the chance of each possible number of shots wounding. Now, I'm tired, and sick of number crunching, so this last step is probably wrong: I took the percentages for each number of wounds based on hit, and then combined them in the manner A+(1-A)*B=C and C+(1-C)*D=E, where C (or E) is the final percentage, depending on whether there were two or three numbers to combine. I have the feeling I'm wrong in making the assumption, and I believe I know the correct method, but quite frankly I don't give a shit right now, and it's close enough to give a decent idea of the odds). So yeah...


Regardless of the accuracy of the numbers, the broadsides would still be in a proportionally worse position, dying on a 2+ wound roll, having only two shots between them, inflicting a penetrating shot on a 3+ instead of 2+, and having neither guarantee a kill, or even damage. Then there's the heavy bolters to contend with, if the broadsides are within 36". Although wouldn't help too much against broadsides, they're still another factor tipping the scales in favor of the vendetta.

Against anything other than broadsides, the vendetta is certainly more lethal, and carries much more utility, being a fast transport scout skimmer than can deepstrike and carries both anti-infantry and anti-armor weapons, all in a 12/12/10 shell.

I'm not going to bang out the math-hammer here, but just want to note four things:
1)Railguns are S10 AP1 compared to S9 AP2 lascannons, making them significantly more lethal.
2)Broadsides should generally have some form of cover, vendettas almost never do.
3)Shield drones increase the survivability of Broadsides by quite a bit.
4)It takes quite a bit more firepower to down a team of broadsides than a vendetta. I need 1 good damage roll to stop a vendetta, as opposed to 2-4 bad saves to shut down a broadside team without shield drones. This means that stuff like autocannons and Assault cannons are significantly stronger against Vendettas.