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Which update would you like the most?

Randomized Backstories
- 67 (25.9%)
Genetic Additions
- 98 (37.8%)
Mess Hall
- 50 (19.3%)
Revamped Area
- 44 (17%)

Total Members Voted: 257


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Author Topic: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*  (Read 811142 times)

Jakkarra

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #2820 on: July 18, 2009, 10:48:13 am »

call it M.A.G.M.A.

Multiuse

Assymmetrical

Granulated

Momentum

Assesser




Acronym is good, translation, not so much, ill think of a better one, uless you can...

Yanlin

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #2821 on: July 18, 2009, 10:57:21 am »

I say we dispose of the silly idea of internal combustion engines. It's the future! We have cold fusion!

I say the entire station is powered by one cold fusion engine and has one backup engine.

While at it, make bombs realistic. Currently plasma explodes for no apparent reason. The only difference being that you burn a hole in the tank (How come that doesn't ignite it?) and then set it off normally which would result it in just releasing the gas the same way...
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Jakkarra

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #2822 on: July 18, 2009, 11:00:13 am »

we should have a little Bicycle in a room as the back-up generator.

Yanlin

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #2823 on: July 18, 2009, 11:02:39 am »

That's silly! Not dwarven!
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Jakkarra

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #2824 on: July 18, 2009, 11:03:38 am »

we have the captain doing the Cycling.

cib

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #2825 on: July 18, 2009, 11:09:24 am »

I don't think we will have cold fusion by the time of SS81, unless we set it more in the future than SS13.
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andrea

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #2826 on: July 18, 2009, 11:13:06 am »

hot fusion should be enough.

Yanlin

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #2827 on: July 18, 2009, 11:21:41 am »

hot fusion should be enough.

You have ABSOLUTELY NO IDEA what cold fusion is, do you?

It doesn't literally mean cold fusion. It just means cold enough to ACTUALLY CONTAIN INSIDE SOMETHING.

We ARE capable of hot fusion. Except right now it's about as hot as the sun, if not hotter. This causes the obvious problem of actually containing the reaction.

Picture how hot the current SS13 engine runs. Now picture proto. Now picture a bit hotter than that, you got cold fusion on a reasonable temperature.
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Jakkarra

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #2828 on: July 18, 2009, 11:37:49 am »

Lukewarm fusion?

qwertyuiopas

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #2829 on: July 18, 2009, 12:11:31 pm »

Also, I'm glad that someone is working on a remake with such enthusiasm. Keep up the good work, qwerty!

Most of my enthusiasm comes from the community.
Ideas are important.

I've just started reading qwerty's source and I noticed that the breathing part is extremely detailed - and also hard to read, on that regard. Please keep in mind that this degree of accuracy isn't strictly necessary - from the player point of view, it's enough if it feels somewhere like that, but it need not work exactly like that. While realism to a certain degree is very nice, a well-abstracted representation that "works good enough in most cases" is preferable in my opinion, especially since the computer's resources are limited, even more so when building on an inefficient language like DM. Don't forget that DM was designed to create simple games and the designers never had extensive simulations or complex algorithms in mind.

In this case, you could for example remove the relation between the amount of blood and the amount of oxygen, which would probably greatly simplify the code, yet have little impact on the game play(when bleeding to death, you have other problems to deal with than suffocation anyway).

Of course, I can understand you enjoy researching and conceptualizing complex algorithms, so if that's your main motivation, you are free to make the game as complex as you want, but if you also want to make a fun game that is played by other people, you should take these considerations into account.

The player oxygen number acts as a buffer zone between oxygen and health loss.
Blood vs oxygen is basically a multiplier so that losing "only" 15% of your blood will make it harder to maintain oxygen levels. Naturally, you can compensate by reducing your oxygen use, mostly by stopping running everywhere, laying down, and maybe sleeping, this gives the medics time to heal you.

I already shifted some realism to fun: see that *40 in the oxygen gain? That was to match oxygen intake to use.

I agree that we dont want too many complex algorithms around to slow down the server, but just one or two wouldnt be too much of a problem, right?

Anyways, I'd like to propose something too: a standarized system for all machines to work on. What I mean by this, is that all machines use power in the same way (NOT same amount, same way as in we dont have one checking for wires while the other checks for APC in the area, etc...), and that they can somehow be made to communicate with each other (like, be able to connect a radio signaler to the communications pc so that sending a certain code on a certain frequency activates the communication computer to call the shuttle (if someone with necessary clearance is logged in on it, ofcourse), kind of like we already can do with airlocks). This would make for some INSANELY COOL contraptions IMO.

Code: [Select]
/obj/machinery/powered/door/airlock
Doors are powered machinery.
To add such a feature, add it to machinery and all machinery, powered stuff, and doors will automatically work with it.


Depends on how often it is called. For example, calling a very complex algorithm every time someone moves, is.. bad. In general, it's just important to consider the effectiveness of the code.

All of the complex code is shifted into the once-per-second tick() (called from the world loop), when you move, it increments a counter of how active you have been recently. Then, when breathe() is called during the tick(), it takes your activity into account only when it needs it.
As for the old code, it would do a cosine for EVERY solar panel every time it or the sun moved.
The sun moved every 50 seconds, but with autotracking, each panel would move quite often.


Alright, since I really want bots in the game, I'm trying to add a skeleton to qwerty's source. However, it seems not to have been designed at all with something like that in mind, the /mob datum wholeheartedly assumes that every mob has hands, feet and organs. So you didn't plan to add jellyfish, qwerty? =(

All of the procs are defined on the mob.

When adding a bot, override the procs!

/mob/bot/tick() will override /mob/proc/tick(). you use active_item() elsewhere rather than active_hand().item or "mob.active_hand? mob.l_hand.item : mob.r_hand.item", so defining a bot to return current_tool can be done.

Qwerty, since you're basically creating a new SS13 from scratch, shouldn't we make it more dwarven?

Get rid of "Plasma" since Plasma is not a gas. It's a state of matter. (Blood plasma excluded. I have no idea why it's called plasma, but it isn't.) The blood plasma in medbay should be renamed as well. It should say blood plasma. Not just plasma.

I was thinking of replacing it with a "combustion mix" of generic hydrocarbons, optimized for combustion rather than using that ancient, crude, poorly mixed gasoline, or some futuristic substance that is unlikely to exist anymore(and doesn't right now anyway)



Also on the ideas-to-do list:
A materials reprocessing device.

It would be used to dispose of waste objects and break them down into their primary components for use in a more complex version of the autolathe.

This means that trash bins will be more common, you can access them like toolboxes and stuff, and it will be the janitor's duty to empty them into the materials reprocessing room(probably with the addition of wall-chutes, that could be used for purposes such as feeding prisioners and garbage disposal from within secured areas to maintainence areas.

It is also how you would properly discard scraps(that the autolathe will produce in bucketfulls as it works) and convert metal rods back into metal sheets.

Naturally it would be a bit of a power hog, less while idle.


Today's work(potential schedule):
-Full space-blocking windows
-one or more new equipment slot
-held item images?
-tile stacking and other multi-use objects
-putting multi-use objects base code into /obj/item
-regulating multi-use items with max_stack on the item's def
-certainly more.
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Yanlin

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #2830 on: July 18, 2009, 12:34:04 pm »

As long as you make walls stop looking like fucking boxes... I'm cool.
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qwertyuiopas

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #2831 on: July 18, 2009, 12:37:56 pm »

Well, I could add a turf calc_icon proc, and add a few more wall icons...
Of course, nothing will change in the editor.
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cib

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #2832 on: July 18, 2009, 12:45:19 pm »

Alright, it seems there is nothing to worry about, you seem to know what you're doing pretty well. =)

Quote
All of the procs are defined on the mob.

When adding a bot, override the procs!

/mob/bot/tick() will override /mob/proc/tick(). you use active_item() elsewhere rather than active_hand().item or "mob.active_hand? mob.l_hand.item : mob.r_hand.item", so defining a bot to return current_tool can be done.

Yep, that's what I figured. It's just a bit confusing to overwrite already existing logic to something totally different. Also, with this approach, whenever something new is added to /mob, it might screw over /mob/bot, if you forget about it.

Let me share my thoughts about bots:
- They would not require oxygen or breath at all. They do have air sensors, though.
- They would run on electricity.
- Current body parts include: Chipset, Battery Slot, Arms, Torso, Drive(Chain Drive sounds good)
- When a bot loses power, it dies similar to human, shutting its chipset down last.
- Bots only know the physical damage type, which represents hull damage, but the body parts also have a "cut_wires" variable, which, if true, will cause the part to cease functioning.
- The A.I. would be a bot without drive.

Also, I'd like to share some of the power code with the machinery code. How would I go on about this? Copy the procs onto the bot in New()?

The next problem is using tools and the like. How would a bot perform actions? Would it be able to pick up items?

There could be different types of bots. The type of the bot determines the type of tools. There might be security bots, which mainly have combat tools, engineer bots, which have building tools, medical bots, which have medical sensors, syringe-like devices and maybe even surgery tools, a carrier bot that has a large storage(backpack-like) and hand-like tools. Maybe the tools should be displayed in the HUD, but I'm not quite sure, it would require the HUD to be very dynamic.

I hope there is someone who would like to do the icons for the bots, I have created a basic place-holder one, but I'm really no good at it.

Quote

Also on the ideas-to-do list:
A materials reprocessing device.

It would be used to dispose of waste objects and break them down into their primary components for use in a more complex version of the autolathe.

This means that trash bins will be more common, you can access them like toolboxes and stuff, and it will be the janitor's duty to empty them into the materials reprocessing room(probably with the addition of wall-chutes, that could be used for purposes such as feeding prisioners and garbage disposal from within secured areas to maintainence areas.

It is also how you would properly discard scraps(that the autolathe will produce in bucketfulls as it works) and convert metal rods back into metal sheets.

Naturally it would be a bit of a power hog, less while idle.

Sounds like an excellent idea.


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Poltifar

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #2833 on: July 18, 2009, 12:46:47 pm »

I'd say the best thing is somewhere between SS13 type 'unrealistic' technology and Yanlin's true-to-life technology. If its completely realistic and follows all laws of physics and is always made of substances that we know exist, it wouldnt be a truly nice sci-fi game, now would it? And on the other hand, the plasma bombs did seem quite odd, if only for the 'bore a hole' thing. The rest seems logical, heated plasma is ignited and released all at once, basically an explosion.

Also, since we're talking about bombs anyways, add more stuff like that to toxins (yes i know, it would be a long-term idea), like say, making EMP-grenades from computer components and an energy cell, that stops power to all nearby electrical and electronic machines for a while (or completely shorts them permanently if the energy cell used has alot of energy in it).

As for the bots and mobs thingy, would it be possible to add NPCs like the monkeys and more complex things as well?
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<@Poltifar> i specced myself into a corner, i should just reroll
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<@Akroma> just play the minigames until your subscription runs out

andrea

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Re: Space Station 13 *READ RULES ON FIRST POST*
« Reply #2834 on: July 18, 2009, 12:51:35 pm »

actually, when speaking about cold fusion people usually speak of Fleischmann-Pons experiment,the one with electrolysis of heavy water.and we aren't even sure it can really happen.
as cold fusion, there is also muon-catalyzed fusion, which doesn't produce energy unless we find new and cheaper ways of producing muons.

looking at your description, hotter than proto ( which already goes past 1 million C°), you probably mean standard fusion reactors, like ITER or JET, which have a temperature several times HIGHER than the one of the sun, and because of this are "hot" or "standard" fusion

small post, but it took an hour to read all the links...
some of them are from wikipedia,so they might not be 100% accurate, and i never heard of muon catalyzed fusion before, but i think the post still makes an average job at saying that cold fusion is cold, and 1 million C°+ is not in modern standards for cold fusion. still colder than modern standards for hot fusion though... more like a warm fusion, which is outside of any research at the moment, as far as i know ( might be wrong on this).the working reactors use VERY hot plasma , that can be contained by magnetic confinement systems.

and to poltifar : there is nothing wrong in realistic or semi-realistic technology in my opinion.

time to post, hoping that i made no big errors. i am not good at writing posts.
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