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[juicebox]

Which posts?

Why don't you quote those so it'll look like I'm being too defensive of TricMagic.

Sure

Spoiler: Web quotes (click to show/hide)

Nah, it ain't TricMagic, we're not doing the vote out TricMagic thing people do when they're lazy.

Webadict: why didn't you want NQT to pressure Tric?

I assume this is a real question and not you simply wasting time with obvious nonsense because, well...  It's obvious.

I think TricMagic is Town.  I think pressuring TricMagic is pointless because it will create a scum-adjacent response where people focus on TricMagic, spiraling into a wasted Day.  You literally said you wanted there to be less waste, and I'm doing it for you right now.

You wanna go after TricMagic?  Go after me.

@Web: What about the possibility that Tric is Mafia claiming Vigilante?

Less than 1%.

I even wrapped them up in a nice little box for you

 

To be honest Juice, I barely remember you, also.

With your meter punched now, why exactly are you looking to lynch me? You'd need to find a partner, and right now there aren't many candidates Juicebox. Doesn't matter if I'm cleared or not. As it stands, my actions are confirmable, you know what I do at knight. And yeah, I get lynched while I'm asleep a lot as town. It's an easy day 1 lynch that doesn't give too much away, but I tend to use that myself to find out who's scum. (Admittedly, to varying degrees of success, but I manage sometimes!)

Always messing up..

I'm not really looking to lynch you right now. I'm more concerned about getting a read on Webby.

[Maximum Spin]

You guys, TricMagic is obviously town. Just trust me.

Honestly, the conventional meta read thing has really dramatically narrowed the field of likely candidates for me. I still harbor MVM3-related suspicion of Web and ToonyMan, but I'm pretty sure they're just flirting.

I'm thinking notquitethere. My arbitrary assumptions about him worked last time. Same basic reasoning too.

[webadict]

Spoiler: Web quotes (click to show/hide)

Nah, it ain't TricMagic, we're not doing the vote out TricMagic thing people do when they're lazy.

Webadict: why didn't you want NQT to pressure Tric?

I assume this is a real question and not you simply wasting time with obvious nonsense because, well...  It's obvious.

I think TricMagic is Town.  I think pressuring TricMagic is pointless because it will create a scum-adjacent response where people focus on TricMagic, spiraling into a wasted Day.  You literally said you wanted there to be less waste, and I'm doing it for you right now.

You wanna go after TricMagic?  Go after me.

@Web: What about the possibility that Tric is Mafia claiming Vigilante?

Less than 1%.

Much better.  I like when all these sit in one place so that instead of vaguely referencing my eager overdefensiveness.  It's easier to point out its ridiculousness.

TricMagic is almost definitely Town, and that's all there is to it.

Also Tric, whenever you die in your sleep, it's typically because the people you trusted to defend you just say "fuck it, vote him out" instead of pushing a vote they actually want. And they're not always scum either.

You can get town read through your meta of "my role my role my role", but meta doesn't matter to everyone. You're a lot less likely to get voted out when you focus less on your role and instead make your thoughts and attempts to solve more well known.

That's not why I'm metareading him, but that's okay.  I think if you're voting for him, you either don't believe that he's a Vigilante or you do believe him.  Those are really the only two possibilities to me.  And if you don't believe him, you haven't played with him as scum enough.

You guys, TricMagic is obviously town. Just trust me.

Honestly, the conventional meta read thing has really dramatically narrowed the field of likely candidates for me. I still harbor MVM3-related suspicion of Web and ToonyMan, but I'm pretty sure they're just flirting.

I'm thinking notquitethere. My arbitrary assumptions about him worked last time. Same basic reasoning too.

I'm in on notquitethere.

[TricMagic]

Much as I'd hop on them.. Give em time to process when they come back online.

... Not sure why mind you.

[Maximum Spin]

A fair warning:
EITHER Fallacy is giving out red-herring abilities again OR alignments can change in this game.

[ToonyMan]

I'm thinking notquitethere. My arbitrary assumptions about him worked last time. Same basic reasoning too.

But NQT make beep boop noises. I like beep boop.

[ToonyMan]

Your actions aren't confirmable to anyone who doesn't know what status effects are relevant to your role, or what any of them mean, or what burning things even does. Nor does it take into account Multitasking or abilities that combine a lethal and non-lethal action into one.

Yeah, but...it's Tric.

Hey Tric, who's definitely town right now?

This line of thought of "oh that's just how Tric is" is a major reason he gets miseliminated so often though. Like that may be enough for a core four people who play with him so often, but that still leaves everyone else. It creates this weird situation where people have to read Tric by also reading some combination of you/Web/Max/Jim, which is just...not feasible, at all.

I read Tric correctly 80% of the time, all the time.

[EuchreJack]

A fair warning:
EITHER Fallacy is giving out red-herring abilities again OR alignments can change in this game.

Wasn't it Fallacy that said he might put cults into any game of 13 or more players?

Nah, it ain't TricMagic, we're not doing the vote out TricMagic thing people do when they're lazy.

The game just started and Tric has barely done anything yet. What do we gain from shutting down any suspicion on Tric so early into the game? That just prevents town from naturally coming to their own conclusions.

You can put me into the "probably won't vote Tric" camp. We mislynched Tric round 1 last time, which explains why Web has jumped to this point. I routinely defend Tric from mislynches, so it's nice to have someone else doing that for a change.
Maybe we could just informally agree not to Lynch Tric Day 1, and look at other suspects?

I'm thinking notquitethere. My arbitrary assumptions about him worked last time. Same basic reasoning too.

But NQT make beep boop noises. I like beep boop.

+1, ninjaToony says it better than what I was thinking.

[Knightwing64]

What’s with all the Pokémon images?


And what do you mean by 100 percent pure love?



PS: Have you ever tried to game the system by putting a really powerful name but the role you get disappoints you? I mean, it’s okay, but it requires a lot of things to go my way.

PPSS: People think Tric is town? Well, I know one scum now.

ToonyMan - 100% Town:  We all know he's good, right?  Like, it's obvious to everyone, right?  Am I confused here?  No, it's the kids who are wrong.

Uh, no, no! Webadict is more town! He's 101% town!

Sus, I’m obviously 102% more town.

Tric, why would mafia ever think to kill you if you're only advertising the negative utility of your role?

Bad vote.

Ur a bad vote

@Max I do want to hear a bit more from you. Does anything stand out to you at the moment? Is there anything anyone has said that you want to look into more?

I'm gonna go ahead and tell everyone that I have no night actions, however my actions can still affect the night phase.

Haven’t seen you before, anybody know this guy? I don’t have infooooo

Juicebox cool name tho

Obv town

[NJW2000]

Spoiler: replies to Web (click to show/hide)

-

Your reasoning is conditional on your being town, and it's double-guessing the setup, but ok, I guess it makes sense given those. I'm still in favour of alowing people to pressure Tric, and find over-zealous defences suspect... I think most players here can read Tric to some degree by now, so would be ok with having my read on him solidified by seeing him under pressure. I see the D1 tric elims as more of a laziness/b12 meta thing, to be honest.

Nonetheless, this is a satisfactory explanation of your thought process - you were generally sure about Tric, and wanted to shut down discussion. No further questions.

So, I'll ask you a slightly better question:  Why aren't you pressuring NQT? 

I'm not going to attack someone for doing something basically reasonable... Unlike you, I don't think a small amount of early pressure on Tric is sure to hurt town. Also, I basically think people have a right to coach/impose standards on newer or younger players a bit, independent of the game being played. I know I've made this argument as scum before, but when say Toony says something like "but town-Tric always claims D1 independent of whether it's a good idea" I genuinely think they hurt the development of a player, and thus the bay12 forum.

@NJW2000: I am flattered that my presence was so inconspicuous I passed for a non-person. I wouldn't mind if you continued thinking so for the rest of the game

That's Jim Groovester. We're not similar, but he has been unobtrusive this game, so I forgive you.


Roden coming in with a combination of good and awfully confusing takes. Not sure what to think, as their thought processes are very different from mine.

Not confident or far enough into the day to post a readslist, so let's just play:

WHO'S BEING QUIET?

NQT is being quiet by most people's standards, but honestly this is pretty loud for them.

Vector's busy, so Vector's quiet. That's ok. Max has been unhelpful, but Max is always unhelpful. Jim's been quiet, but he's been at work, under the mistaken impression Nakeen was an NPC and has strong opinions about RVS, so maybe that's understandable. Perhaps he'll be louder when he has something useful to contribute.

Nakeen's made one post, and it's very nothing. They also haven't read the thread carefully... were they talking to someone else? Hmmmmm.

TolyK's made six posts, and none of them have a take. They said they'd try to break the game, but they haven't been doing that.

TolyK has been being very, very quiet.

[Maximum Spin]

Max has been unhelpful, but Max is always unhelpful.

Why do you always say that? I've been extremely helpful. I told you who to vote for. What more do you want?

[TricMagic]

Max has been unhelpful, but Max is always unhelpful.

Why do you always say that? I've been extremely helpful. I told you who to vote for. What more do you want?

Readlists! Or maybe more gold for my horde.

... Kinda interesting NJW comes in and says NQT is being loud. It could be read as them putting up a front instead by going full analytic. So they don't give off the scum-tell of not doing lists and deductions of all players by just doing so from the start.

That said, good chance they slip up at some point. That type of model has holes where logic and reason cross each other.

[webadict]

Your actions aren't confirmable to anyone who doesn't know what status effects are relevant to your role, or what any of them mean, or what burning things even does. Nor does it take into account Multitasking or abilities that combine a lethal and non-lethal action into one.

Yeah, but...it's Tric.

Hey Tric, who's definitely town right now?

This line of thought of "oh that's just how Tric is" is a major reason he gets miseliminated so often though. Like that may be enough for a core four people who play with him so often, but that still leaves everyone else. It creates this weird situation where people have to read Tric by also reading some combination of you/Web/Max/Jim, which is just...not feasible, at all.

I read Tric correctly 80% of the time, all the time.

I mean, they wouldn't have to rely on us if they thought about things from TricMagic's perspective.

Sure, it requires a lot of heavy drinking and Abyss staring, but it's not that difficult.

Honestly, I think everyone should do that, it'll make you better at Town AND Mafia.

A fair warning:
EITHER Fallacy is giving out red-herring abilities again OR alignments can change in this game.

Wasn't it Fallacy that said he might put cults into any game of 13 or more players?

I'm actually under the impression that there's at least a Mafia, since someone explicitly mentioned a Mafiakill interaction, so my guess is that Mafia have a way to recruit someone.
 
@NJW2000:
I actually agree that Tric claiming is antithetical to his progression as a Mafia player.  That's actually not why I think he's Town, though.  Or, maybe it's better to say that him claiming isn't why I see him as Town.  His claim is.  I've legitimately claimed what I am, and I know that it's a bad thing, but I think the difference is that I'm sort of all about gambling on stupid premises to throw scum off-kilter.  I am going to continue defending him though because, while I do think he's wrong a lot of the time, he's actually right a surprising amount of the time as well.  It's usually the things that are so incredibly wrong that end up looping around on themselves to being right.

[Maximum Spin]

Readlists!

Didn't I already do that? Okay, I left most of it implicit, but come on, don't make me lead you all the way to water.
You're town. I'm town. EuchreJack's probably town. Webadict and ToonyMan are probably dating. Knightwing's probably town. That's half, so scumhunt in the other half. Nakéen doesn't read like mafia for being a newcomer, although it's impossible to be sure. Vector's barely present, but I'll extend the benefit of the doubt. We'll know whether Jim is scum by whether or not he gets killed n1 so who cares. TolyK and NJW2000 are whatever. Juicebox, Roden, and notquitethere are most suspicious to me right now. This was so overwhelmingly obvious that I'm willing to lay it all out in full even though I am on record hating readslists. I'll probably get scumread for upsetting the status quo for that.

[ToonyMan]

Readlists!

Didn't I already do that? Okay, I left most of it implicit, but come on, don't make me lead you all the way to water.
You're town. I'm town. EuchreJack's probably town. Webadict and ToonyMan are probably dating. Knightwing's probably town. That's half, so scumhunt in the other half. Nakéen doesn't read like mafia for being a newcomer, although it's impossible to be sure. Vector's barely present, but I'll extend the benefit of the doubt. We'll know whether Jim is scum by whether or not he gets killed n1 so who cares. TolyK and NJW2000 are whatever. Juicebox, Roden, and notquitethere are most suspicious to me right now. This was so overwhelmingly obvious that I'm willing to lay it all out in full even though I am on record hating readslists. I'll probably get scumread for upsetting the status quo for that.

Wow a good Max post.