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[Roden]

Oh. That was unexpected. I had a question for Web too.

I wanted to know, if he thought I was hinting at a PR, why he would openly state that. Why did he then also try to reiterate just how town I am? That's weird to set up a potential PR as easy night kill choice.

Oh my fucking god. Sorry, it took twice as long to write this because I had to stop by an emergency center so they could harness the power of my eyes rolling to power a small city.

Because hiding an obvious piece of information is for cowards, and it's exactly what I believe ToonyMan saw, making it a potential easy pocket. That's why I'll fully admit that I'm a Vanilla Townie. Or maybe I'm not. Maybe I'm a Doctor! Oooooo!

I mean, worst case scenario is I have to live with the looming knowledge of Christmas Future's vision. I couldn't honestly care less if it gets you NKed because it's not really my problem who is alive or dead at the end as long as the dead include two scum, and you should take heart in knowing that your death contributed towards that, because it'll keep the people I think are Townier alive.

But, my bad, if you'd like to jump on the wagon ToonyMan's looking to build, then I'll advocate for your death, too. Totally plausible match-up, given ToonyMan's projection.

This is such a weirdly defensive and accusatory reaction. If you think I'm town spewing, what do you gain by getting me killed? From your perspective as town, wouldn't keeping me alive only be a good thing for you if you're so sure I'm town and possibly a PR? And who could possibly appear to be townier than me if I'm apparently obvious town?

What makes you think my death isn't your problem anyway? If you advocate my mis-elim then you look scummier than Toony. I don't see how anything you're saying here is good for town.

I'm not sure why you're assuming you're getting wagon'd here either. I don't think my questions were unreasonable, and I didn't accuse you of anything.

[Magma Mater]

Alright, one final thing: Don't rate Blue too highly as Town.  Blue might be a newbie townie, but they're an expert scummer.  Blue as mafia is perfectly capable of doing exactly what they're doing now.  In fact it reminds me of our last game together, where Blue flipped mafia (Roguelike).
However, Blue's quick jump on Hedgerow seems like a suicidal mafia team strategy if both were mafia, since it could lead to D1 hedgerow lynch then D2 town catching Blue as mafia and game over.  This means that the scum team is probably not Blue and Hedgerow.

I agree with your conclusion, but your logic is off, and I don't follow any of it. If you think that Blue is an expert scummer, how could we catch him (and why would he be afraid of being caught) D2? And if hedgerow flips wolf, why would we suspect Blue as his partner right away when he has voted for him so early? Furthermore, there's a bit of a paradox here: if Blue and hedgerow are partners, and Blue presumably wants to avoid being eliminated right after his partner, wouldn't it make sense to distance himself from hedgerow like he has? It's not really a suicidal strategy at all.
The way I read this is that you had a conclusion that you wanted to get to, and filled in the blanks with logic that doesn't make any sense. That's the only way I can parse it.

Magma Mater

1. How much mafia experience would you say that you have?
2. Do you consider yourself good at the game?
3. What's your preference, town or wolf?
4. How would you describe your playstyle?

1. Most of my experience is on these forums - so with roughly close to ten games under my belt - albeit I have far more experience as mafia than town.
2. Fuck no.
3. Weirdly enough, mafia - albeit that doesn't mean I want to be it all the time.
4. Reserved until I get a trail - I like to lay back, wait for picking breadcrumbs from other players, then push players I get suspicious of. That's usually why I don't post much the first hours of the game.

Magma Mater - would you prefer a doctor or a bullet-proof in this setup?

Euchrejack

Read list:


Confirmed Town: EuchreJack - Let me see, yup still town
Slightly town: prefuzek - scumhunting and calling me out for not doing enough of it

Null team:
Roden.
Rolan7
Magma Mater
webadict
ToonyMan[Veteran Player]

Scum team:
BluarianKnight - Blue is always scum
hedgerow - Awaiting a response that might convince me they're not scum

First off - I feel like this is far from a readlist. At best you've confirmed yourself and another player as town on your list (the equal number of a mafia-team) while avoiding and leans downward. No comment on any of the other players past scum team.

You put me on here just because of my luck;

@Blue:[/b] Did you roll scum again?

This doesn't make me feel better about assumptions - you asked then smacked me on, which means you're reaching.
Don't know why yet, but.. I dunno. Poor readlist, just confusing.
It does have one good point on it though.

Hedgerow:

EuchreJack.

I'd say the BP is irrelevant.  The hackers are going to win you over with flirtatious misinformation and forked reasoning.  We should eliminate anyone who buys into the townie-killing narrative, first.

Your first post is a vote against Euchre, why?

As well, your narrative of 'eliminate anyone who buys into townie-killing narrative' is.. first off, confusing - I'm maybe misreading but I don't know what that means, but second, it's aggressive. It feels like you want to put someone on the chopping block for any reason you can muster.

Newbie town can hunt, but full-out 'vote whoever' is a mafia tell, at least for me. I'm willing to remove my vote if you prove me wrong, and give me a reason/explanation.


A quick list of reads;

I like Magma Meter's plays - no aggression, decent questions for a first start. I get town vibes.
Toony is Toony - god as my witness, I still can't read them to save my life. Mentor role might make them seem more town then worth, but for now town for me.
Pref's hunting is pretty good in my eyes - townlean.

I don't like hedgerow's quick aggression - want to see something from him to prove me wrong. Scum most likely for now.
Euchre rubs me wrong - tiny scumlean.

Null for everyone else!

i don't know. Can't do much else, everyone else null for now, Open and ready to deal with anything.
Problems or otherwise - blue's down to do some mafia.

Because we might have a tracker, and because they'll just ignore the BP and hunt down the other townies for a quick win.  The idea that they'll even target the BP when they're trying to not lose their data is ridiculous.  Just for entertaining that line of thought for a second, you're already spilling suspicious.

Did you quote the wrong post? I don't see where Blue did what you say he did.

[Magma Mater]

@Webadict: Please promise not to Chinese Fire Drill.  This is a newbie game, and not a good place to be doing a Chinese Fire Drill.  Please? 

Why me? I would probably promise that, but I would end up breaking it eventually. I'll give a rough "maybe".

Anyway, since I'm feeling a bit better, initial feelings are:

Magma Mater - Super blathery but also super Town. Probing for answers. Enter the pocket.
EuchreJack - Very Town. Sheeping the right answers.
hedgerow - Hmm... Town. Call it a hunch. I would explain why, but only if hedge asks. The pocket easily fits two.
Roden - Townlean. Against the BT strat for what feels like legitimate reasons. Is that even a good reason to trust someone is Town? Maybe. Still gonna do it.
Rolan7 - I forgot everything I read from them.
BluarianKnight - Scumlean. Absolutely no reason. Okay, maybe also because bias.
ToonyMan - Was Townlean until they didn't like EuchreJack's reasoning for BluarianKnight, which is really baffling and super passive. Give me better.

Can you give an example of where EuchreJack was sheeping the right answers?
Roden wasn't against the BP strat, he was the one who suggested it. Does that change your opinion of him?

[Magma Mater]

I actually agree with Bluarian about Jack which seems to be a minority opinion. I think this makes mafia! Bluarian less likely. Even if we're wrong I don't believe Blu would trying to go against the flow of shading Jack as mafia when blindly reading them as spew town is easier. It feels to me they aren't sure of player's alignments.

This isn't true, Blue has a "tiny scumlean" on Euchre, although for unspecified reasons. Where you thinking of someone else?

Web didn't mention Pref in his list so maybe the scumteam is Web/Pref?

OMGUS from a Toony? Why, I never.

I, clearly, left prefuzek off the list as a cunning ruse, which you obviously fell for. Heh, chalk one up for the good guys.

Do you have an opinion of prefuzek?

Weak Town Reads
Prefuzek - has posted once, but the post was good

Can you elaborate a little please?

Webadict - pocketing everyone, also Jack gives strange reasonings for why they're town here

Are you seriously scum-reading webadict for saying that he's putting people in his pocket? I don't think that's what that phrase means, and him simply saying it certainly doesn't make it true. What am I missing here?

@Toony: I can pocket however many people I want.

This is not a great response, though.

[Magma Mater]

Oh. That was unexpected. I had a question for Web too.

I wanted to know, if he thought I was hinting at a PR, why he would openly state that. Why did he then also try to reiterate just how town I am? That's weird to set up a potential PR as easy night kill choice.

It could be a sneaky way to tell his partner about a PR read before he replaced out.

[Magma Mater]

What happens if we can't find a replacement for webadict? I'd be open to eliminating him today if we have to, although there are other people I'd prefer.

[prefuzek]

Sorry I don't have the energy to post much for environmental reasons. Anyway, reads! Mix of gut and a few actual reasons.

BluarianKnight - town lean

EuchreJack - not getting the strong town vibes I usually do. In the past Jack's looked like they have no idea who's who and flail around because of it. They're still posting a lot but I think they have more information this time so it's less erratic. Scum, going to leave my vote for now

Magma Mater - strong town

webadict - up for replacement D1 so doesn't really matter. I disagree with some of their reads though

hedgerow - my gut said their first couple (very short) posts were scummy. This post would be super audacious for a new scum though so I don't know what to think. I'm guessing they'll be a lynch target today, good to keep an eye on.

Roden - probably town for suggesting BP step forward first

Rolan7 - null

ToonyMan - not playing normally (because of vet status?). Scum lean

Overall guess: 1 scum between EuchreJack/hedgerow and 1 scum between Toonyman/webadict/BluarianKnight.


Magma Mater

hedgerow, how do you know what the hackers are going to do? Isn't it a little early for a policy lynch, especially in a beginner game?

a) Why are you assuming that Euchre is a policy lynch for hedgerow? As he's already said in-thread (and I even bothered to verify!), he tends to get killed by wolves early. I don't think it qualifies as a good policy to eliminate a player who is easily read without even attempting to do so.
b) What is your own reason for voting for Euchre? Judging from Euchre's later posts, I'm not sure whether the "looking town instead of hunting" comment is a joke.

Just the wording - "We should eliminate anyone who..." sounds like a policy lynch to me. I agree that it's a bad policy, which is why hedgerow is suspicious. My vote on Euchre was because he said his priority was to look town and not find mafia. Reading his posts it seems like he's been following through with that priority which is scummy. See my read above.

Rolan7, please vote someone.

[ToonyMan]

I actually agree with Bluarian about Jack which seems to be a minority opinion. I think this makes mafia! Bluarian less likely. Even if we're wrong I don't believe Blu would trying to go against the flow of shading Jack as mafia when blindly reading them as spew town is easier. It feels to me they aren't sure of player's alignments.

This isn't true, Blue has a "tiny scumlean" on Euchre, although for unspecified reasons. Where you thinking of someone else?

No I wasn't, but you're right. I thought Bluarian's read was stronger when I read it the first time. I still think their feelings seem genuine like they don't actually know player's alignments.

Weak Town Reads
Prefuzek - has posted once, but the post was good

Can you elaborate a little please?

I'm not alarmed by anything in it. I also like the pressure on Jack. They haven't posted since then so I can't say much more than that. I probably should have them in Neutral along with one-time poster Rolan.

Webadict - pocketing everyone, also Jack gives strange reasonings for why they're town here

Are you seriously scum-reading webadict for saying that he's putting people in his pocket? I don't think that's what that phrase means, and him simply saying it certainly doesn't make it true. What am I missing here?

I think it's something he would do as mafia, but fine. Webadict is having a mental breakdown so I'll give him a break today.

Oh. That was unexpected. I had a question for Web too.

I wanted to know, if he thought I was hinting at a PR, why he would openly state that. Why did he then also try to reiterate just how town I am? That's weird to set up a potential PR as easy night kill choice.

It could be a sneaky way to tell his partner about a PR read before he replaced out.

Ehhh...scum can communicate in private via scum chat Magma. No reason to signal in public.


PPE:

Rolan7, please vote someone.

Yes.

[ToonyMan]

hedgerow - my gut said their first couple (very short) posts were scummy. This post would be super audacious for a new scum though so I don't know what to think. I'm guessing they'll be a lynch target today, good to keep an eye on.

I tend to agree. Hedgerow is being ridiculously obstinate which doesn't make sense as mafia. I don't think a newbie mafia would refuse to participate so adamantly.

[EuchreJack]

I want more from my neutral reads. This is also a newbie game so I want to encourage players to post.

I would actually vote Web over you right now Jack, because Web is more likely scum between the two of you.

Well, you seem to be out for my blood, so I don't really see much reason to respond to you further, honestly.  You'll have my head, as the Veteran Admin, if you so wish.  Scumbag.

@Hedgerow:
Got anything to say besides BP mechanics?

No.

@Hedgerow: Keeping vote on you, hedgerow.  I mean, seriously, I think you're just lazy and can't form an argument to save your life, but you gotta give us something! 

Webadict has asked for a replacement.

I'll just leave Web alone, I'll miss you Wubba. 

I personally don't like throwing down a reads list until closer towards the end of D1. I think the value of reads in the first 24 hours are not very high, but yes every player should share how they feel about every other player before the day is over. I haven't been a mentor before and I don't want to abuse green text much beyond mechanical advice.

I can add some individual reads though.

Pretty sure Roden is town, why? They're openly discussing ways for town to game the Matrix6 system. I believe a mafia player would be hesitant to talk about that idea tbh. Maybe mafia!Roden would, but I'm not feeling it. Their confidence is convincing me they're town.

Side-note:

I found this forum through a game called Gnosia, since someone on the sub reddit linked the game a group played here a month or so ago, and though it was too late to play it got me interested in trying post-by-post.

Haha, really? I didn't catch this the first time reading the thread. It's a little unfortunate how that game went, but maybe we'll get a second Gnosia game that's closer in the future.

Yeah, from what I saw the Gnosia team didn't realize how it was supposed to be played until it was too late. I'd definitely be down to play if another got started up.

Also, your town on read me makes sense from the perspective of a veteran player sorting a new player. And I think it is genuine since the quote of me mentioning Gnosia implies you went through my ISO before making your town read. This isn't a confirmed town move, but I do think town has a reason to actually do that before giving a town read.

I also don't see the point in scum reading a player just because they roll the alignment often. RNG isn't alignment indicative.

It's called scumhunting.  I got a reaction out of Blue, now they can be examined for signs of scum.  In fact, I'm promoted Blue from Always Rolls Scum to slightly scummy for trying to buddy me (it was a weak attack on me, and they voted the same person as me, ergo I'm calling it buddying).  Liked the read list though.  More people should be doing that.  Surprised ToonyMan hasn't thrown that in green text yet.

If Blue is as good at playing scum as you say, I don't think his reaction will be particularly telling tbh. I'd be more interested in seeing who wants to jump on voting Blue tbh. If you're both town then I could see mafia wanting to endorse an easy mis-elim they could then blame you for.

What happens if both of you are alive in an elim-or-lose situation?

If a BP doesn't exist and we have an outed Tracker like in your hypothetical situation, then that means we have a Doctor and no Roleblocker. Doctor then protects the Tracker in secret and we're pretty much set to win. It's not quite follow the cop, but it's a safer alternative since Doctor + Cop does have a Roleblocker.

I like this idea a lot. It's a bit game-y, but hey the wiki acknowledges it's not a perfect strategy either.

I'm not a one-shot Bulletproof Townie.

I saw that strat too but I don't want to rely on it unless it falls in our lap. It just feels a little lame, which is why I originally only brought up BP.

Hm, so you're willing to risk losing the game to look cool? 

Huh? How did you come to that conclusion?

RE: Blue: Blue is a null read because while they're giving off pretty good town vibes, I know they can do that quite well on D1 as scum.  Day 2, when Town has more information, Blue can get tripped up on that.
Also, we were close to a Elim-or-Lose situation in Dreams of Elan, both as Town, where we won.  I'm hopeful Blue and I can figure it out if it happens here.

What happens if we can't find a replacement for webadict? I'd be open to eliminating him today if we have to, although there are other people I'd prefer.

We have till Tuesday.  I expect we'll either get a replacement, or web will soldier on.  If web is town, and they can only muster half their normal effort, its still more than I could give on the best of days, so I'd be against eliminating them on those grounds.  Then again, if web starts voting themselves because they can't find a replacement, a mercy lynch would be ok.

EuchreJack - not getting the strong town vibes I usually do. In the past Jack's looked like they have no idea who's who and flail around because of it. They're still posting a lot but I think they have more information this time so it's less erratic. Scum, going to leave my vote for now

Actually, I have less information.  There are no clever magic spells, or character classes to discuss.  Those few things that exist, are best left unmentioned.  The bulletproof discussion is probably the only real strategy discussion we're going to be getting D1 I'm afraid.  Also, I'm not as engaged this game as I was last time.
I dunno, just not feeling the joy in fighting off persecution that is D1.  I am getting a scum read on you however.

Since Toonyman is Invincible, I'm switching my FOS onto you, Prefuzek

Why did you agree with the problems with Hedgerow's voting on me, but then vote me?  I can't reconcile those two things.  Explanation?

[EuchreJack]

Sigh, reads list!

EuchreJack: The Townie you're most likely to lynch
Magma Mater: Seems to be stepping up nicely
Webadict: Null read if substituted, gotta give props for defending me
BluarianKnight: Like I said, good town play, but I know scum Blue is capable of it, so Null read
Roden - Well, you're participating, but as mafia or Town?  Null read
Rolan7 - I don't think you'd like being mafia, but this town play is probably scary also.  Lurking Mafia or Lurking Town? If I'm missing something, please let me know - Null Read
ToonyMan[Veteran Player] - Scum read: I don't like what you're doing in this game, but I've seen you play similar as Town, so you're not at the bottom of the list.  Like you give a fuck what I think.  Please oh please attack me more for this snide remark, I know you want to...
prefuzek - I'd like to rate you higher, I really would, but I'm seeing inconsistencies in your play that are worrying me greatly
hedgerow- Post or die

Well, I'm quite tired, and feeling emotionally drained after wading though all this.  But at least I didn't resort to drinking to get confirmed town, so personal victory

[EuchreJack]

@Prefuzek: You've got some explaining to do...

No votes yet...I'm going to vote Prefuzek for some pressure. Who are you going to keep an eye on in this game?

EuchreJack.

I'd say the BP is irrelevant.  The hackers are going to win you over with flirtatious misinformation and forked reasoning.  We should eliminate anyone who buys into the townie-killing narrative, first.

I might not be super active the next couple of days but I'll try.

Magma Mater

1. How much mafia experience would you say that you have?
2. Do you consider yourself good at the game?
3. What's your preference, town or wolf?
4. How would you describe your playstyle?

I played a bunch of games here many years ago, but I don't think I was very good back then. I've played a few games here lately and I think I'm better now but I still feel pretty inexperienced with forum mafia (I've played tons of hidden-role games in person). I'm happy when I'm a wolf because it's rarer. I'm a pretty calm and methodical player and don't do anything too unexpected usually.

What have you learned from the answers you have so far? Are you suspicious of anyone yet?

ToonyMan

No votes yet...I'm going to vote Prefuzek for some pressure. Who are you going to keep an eye on in this game?

I always like to keep a pretty steady eye on the experienced players. Also, for now, EuchreJack. The brand new players shouldn't be too hard to read. What do you think of all this setup discussion on D1?

EuchreJack, why are you focused on looking town and not on finding mafia?

hedgerow, how do you know what the hackers are going to do? Isn't it a little early for a policy lynch, especially in a beginner game?

Hm, you're questioning hedgerow for voting me as "a policy lynch", yet Hedgerow didn't say "policy lynch"? 
AS you put a second vote on me, by throwing words from a previous game AT me, to confuse me into backing down and/or targeting hedgerow.

I could actually see the scum team as being prefuzek and hedgerow, as prefuzek's post sort of explains hedgerow's post by questioning it.  Sort of like hedgerow basically fucked up their first post, and has now run away scared.  I'm sure it all made more sense in scumchat to them, if they were the scumteam.

@Prefuzek: What made you think Hedgerow's post was a "policy lynch"?  What "policy" did I break that meant I that I needed to be "lynched"?

[EuchreJack]

@Toonyman: Sorry about the foul language and snide comments.  How about I give you 0.0000000000001 town points in exchange?

[TricMagic]

FallacyofUrist has replaced webadict.

[EuchreJack]

FallacyofUrist has replaced webadict.

Yay, welcome FallacyofUrist!

How much of your predecessor's posts do you take up as your own, or do you plan on "starting fresh"?