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Author Topic: Beginner's Mafia LIV: You Are Bread - Game over! Town wins!  (Read 34881 times)

Persus13

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Re: Beginner's Mafia LIV: You Are Bread - D1 - Protect the loaf!
« Reply #75 on: April 15, 2015, 01:30:05 pm »

Who is Tiruin? Are they in this game?
Tiruin is one of the mafia players in this forum and who is one of the veteran mafia players. She isn't in the game but does occasionally pop in to BMs and comment on general Mafia stuff (Notice how she commented on a question that was mainly focusing on game mechanics than anything else).

Larger post coming soon.
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Persus13

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Re: Beginner's Mafia LIV: You Are Bread - D1 - Protect the loaf!
« Reply #76 on: April 15, 2015, 02:09:19 pm »

Everyone except Tea: What do you think of Tea's suggestion about the cop thing?
That was a suggestion? I thought it was just a strategy that he'd used before. At any rate it seems to require cops with questionable sanities and a doctor if I read that right. Neither of which we have.

Persus13: You didn't actually comment on Tea's idea, which is that everyone claims a (fake or real) cop result every day so that if the cop is ever nightkilled or lynched, their results will be immediately made public knowledge.  I specifically asked in the post three above yours what everyone thought of it.

Everyone: From your own personal experience from various places and using your own judgement, how balanced do you believe this game to be?  Why do you say that?
You posted after I had already started working on that post, so I missed it. Then I misunderstood his strategy, and that's actually a pretty good idea. How a Jailkeeper factor into that would be interesting.

I believe that BMs tend to be Mafia sided, because of the scum IC position, possibility of ICs being scum, beginner's finding their scumhunting legs, and ICs more focused on teaching about stuff than hunting scum. Is this a bad thing? Not necessarily, because a game stacked slightly towards Mafia can raise the stakes a little.

And asking someone what role they like isn't really rolefishing.
I think it is because it gets people talking about differences in how they will play depending on what town role they have, which seems to help scum find power roles without providing enough benefit to the town to offset that, in this setup. I have often used knowledge of whether people prefer playing as a particular alignment to help me read them though, so I understand the value of that more.
Ah, I see where you are coming from now. I've never used people's favorite alignments as a way of figuring out who they are. It's probably a better strategy in RL Mafia because you can see people grin randomly.

Am I posting too much? I don't want to make the thread annoying for people to read but I am eager to get to the point where people stop saying there's not much to go on.
You are posting fine. More is only bad if you make a large post with barely anything worthwhile to say.

I'm not trying to insinuate that people would intentionally abuse their IC status but that I am unsure how balancing their role as an IC and their role in the game works. I will try to just let things play out tho.
ICs can be really hard to get a bead on their alignment mainly because of their focus on teaching. Talking with them and trying to get their input on the actual game is a good way to get them off teacher mode and into game-playing mode.

Perseus I am convinced I was day killed because I was disliked actually. It affirmed certain truths. Like people like things the way they like them. I'd rather not talk about it if that's okay with you. Doesn't serve any actual purpose this game except to remind people how I play, which I am trying to change. I'm fine answering questions but curiosities seem to hold up the game.
Okay, I don't think you were killed because you personally were disliked but because your playstyle was disliked (and Deathsword's kind of known for going after newish players when they make mistakes).

I do think some are too forgiving or not paranoid enough.
I can definitely agree with this, but sometimes being too paranoid can be a block though, and being unforgiving can lead to more dead town than scum. There's a fine balance that needs to be walked.
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Dorsidwarf

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Re: Beginner's Mafia LIV: You Are Bread - Confirming signups!
« Reply #77 on: April 15, 2015, 04:55:10 pm »

Everyone: From your own personal experience from various places and using your own judgement, how balanced do you believe this game to be?  Why do you say that?
I personally find BM games to be reasonably balanced - unless one or more ICs are scum. Obviously having ICs be unable to be scum in completely unfeasible due to balance, but the skill and power that experienced players bring to the table (especially when they're frequent players and newer players recognize, them, and at least in my case, instinctively believe their analysises perhaps more than they're due on their own merit.)
cannot be overstated.
In summary, I think that the game has the potential to be unreasonably balanced, but that that's an irreperable fault. Player skill,activity, and perseverence are definitely the important factors in a BM.
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Dorsidwarf

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Re: Beginner's Mafia LIV: You Are Bread - D1 - Protect the loaf!
« Reply #78 on: April 15, 2015, 04:59:34 pm »

unless tea is crumbling cop should probably keep that to myself. Thoughts on this anyone?
Wait, what? You acknowledge that you should keep something to yourself, then post it anyway and ask for thoughts on it? <<
I believe roo is saying the cop should keep his information to him/herself unless he/she finds scum.
I don't find that a reasonable interpretation of what he's said. As far as I can see, roo said (paraphrased into descriptive language for explanatory purposes)
"..Unless Tea is breadcrumbing 'cop' for a later claim, the I should probbbly keep that to myself. Thoughts on this theory, anyone?"
Which is why that it's weird that he posts the theory he immediately suggests he wouldn't want to mention, and draws attention to it by asking a question.

Roo, what is this post getting at? Is my interpretion correct? If so, why are you contradicting yourself?

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origamiscienceguy

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Re: Beginner's Mafia LIV: You Are Bread - D1 - Protect the loaf!
« Reply #79 on: April 15, 2015, 05:04:28 pm »

English is not his first language, so he can be kind of confusing. Just ask for clarification.
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Dorsidwarf

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Re: Beginner's Mafia LIV: You Are Bread - D1 - Protect the loaf!
« Reply #80 on: April 15, 2015, 05:05:30 pm »

I did, in the line directly below that which you responded to, OSG.
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Tea

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Re: Beginner's Mafia LIV: You Are Bread - D1 - Protect the loaf!
« Reply #81 on: April 15, 2015, 05:38:42 pm »

I've never used people's favorite alignments as a way of figuring out who they are. It's probably a better strategy in RL Mafia because you can see people grin randomly.
Probably easier to tell in a more fast-paced setting, but if someone is totally not getting into a game, a reason for that can be that they hate their alignment. Regarding rolefishing, I honestly don't understand why you disagreed with me initially, as if the question is not intended to have any relation to how people are playing in the game, then it's a useless/filler question. The more interesting discussion is whether it's scummy or just anti-town.

I do think some are too forgiving or not paranoid enough.
Funny that you point this out, since I'm seeing buddy-buddy behavior between you and origami already. When your read on him moves beyond gut I'd like to hear more, as I too have noticed people can tend to read people they like and are familiar with as town too quickly.

To Dani and illgeo, do you have any thoughts on anything at all that's been posted that aren't direct questions to you? <_<
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Tea

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Re: Beginner's Mafia LIV: You Are Bread - D1 - Protect the loaf!
« Reply #82 on: April 15, 2015, 05:48:48 pm »

Orc, why did you ask someone what role they would like?
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origamiscienceguy

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Re: Beginner's Mafia LIV: You Are Bread - D1 - Protect the loaf!
« Reply #83 on: April 15, 2015, 06:01:57 pm »

Orc, why did you ask someone what role they would like?
(I am OSG By the way; Origami+Science+guy)

I asked someone what role they liked to get a conversation going.
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4maskwolf

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Re: Beginner's Mafia LIV: You Are Bread - D1 - Protect the loaf!
« Reply #84 on: April 15, 2015, 07:24:38 pm »

I'm not going to post right now, because I'm irked at one of the other players for an out-of-game reason.  I'll get back to you all when I've cooled off a bit.

Playergamer

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Re: Beginner's Mafia LIV: You Are Bread - D1 - Protect the loaf!
« Reply #85 on: April 15, 2015, 08:05:17 pm »

I'm behind a bit, didn't see this started, sorry. Let me catch up, and I might ask some questions soon.

If I was cop, and two people were arguing, I'd watch for scumtells in day with intervening, and investigate the scummiest person at night.

As for my favorite role, I'd go with cop.

Tea's suggestion sounds kinda like breadcrumbing to me, and I don't like it very much. I mean, it's more visible than breadcrumbing, but it also seems like it wouldn't accomplish much.

The setup seems pretty balanced to me, although it could end pretty fast if town plays badly.
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Tea

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Re: Beginner's Mafia LIV: You Are Bread - D1 - Protect the loaf!
« Reply #86 on: April 16, 2015, 01:36:53 am »

Sorry about the name fuckups, OSG.

I actually kinda like OSG's responses in here so far as he doesn't seem at all defensive and I generally get the sense that he believes what he's saying. I'll probably switch my vote tomorrow but that's dependent on people actually, like, playing the game. Like there's a couple of things that bother me but it's not even likely that the few people who have said enough that I can see why they'd be scum are scum, and it seems stupid to punish them for making legit posts anyway. /rant

@Playergamer, it is like breadcumbing other than that sometimes breadcrumbing can be hard to do well (to be not obvious while they're alive or until it's revealed, but crystal clear afterwards.) So that would take some pressure off, but there's the two limitations that have been mentioned.
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Tea

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Re: Beginner's Mafia LIV: You Are Bread - D1 - Protect the loaf!
« Reply #87 on: April 16, 2015, 01:56:30 am »

Okay, illgeo

Literally not moving this until you convince me otherwise. One vote may seem like not a big deal, but if things continue at this pace, you will not want me still wanting you lynched on Friday. Do better than answering the two most pointless questions directed at you
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Dorsidwarf

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Re: Beginner's Mafia LIV: You Are Bread - D1 - Protect the loaf!
« Reply #88 on: April 16, 2015, 05:40:54 am »

Playergamer: The question was 'all else being equal', implying that neither were being particularly scummy, but thanks for responding. That's a pretty solid standard answer.

Roo: Do you think that Illego is being lazy as a town player, or lurking as a scum player?
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Illgeo

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Re: Beginner's Mafia LIV: You Are Bread - D1 - Protect the loaf!
« Reply #89 on: April 16, 2015, 06:46:24 am »

Can I ask for an replacement?
Kind of busy in University.
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