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[nenjin]

One would think the measure of a good communicator is that they're capable of not being a braying jackass when they don't have a teleprompter. Who gives a fuck if you sound presidential when reading from a speech someone else wrote for you and you rehearsed? Grade school kids can do that. It's more important that you're an articulate, measured communicator when you DONT have all the tools and support to make you seem so.

[Frumple]

Seriously, dude...it's okay to say "I stand corrected," once in a while. Unless you're copping a page from Clinton-senpai and doing the whole "I believe what you believe" thing.

... it's also okay to ask for clarification instead of building a caricature mound over a possible misunderstanding, yeah?

[Sheb]

Jill Stein offer Sander a place on the Green Party ticket.

[Arx]

RK: NC has become more conservative.
M: No, it's just been gerrymandered so the conservatives are louder.
RK: I don't believe you.
M: Here you go.
RK: There are few blues with huge margins and many reds with smaller margins. It's gerrymandered.
M: That agrees with what I was saying.
RK: Flip-flopper!

Or at least, that's what I get from looking back over the exchange. :v

[RedKing]

RK: NC has become more conservative.
M: No, it's just been gerrymandered so the conservatives are louder.
RK: I don't believe you.
M: Here you go.
RK: There are few blues with huge margins and many reds with smaller margins. It's gerrymandered.
M: That agrees with what I was saying.
RK: Flip-flopper!

Or at least, that's what I get from looking back over the exchange. :v

Except that's not at all how he characterized it.

The north carolina government has been getting more polarized but the electorate has not been getting more conservative:
http://cookpolitical.com/file/filename.pdf

(emphasis added)

My interpretation of the Cook PVI is that you're seeing a great impact of gerrymandering since 2010 which is inflating the Dem margins in the few districts they're all packed into, and thus skewing the aggregate. I'd love to see per-district historical trends, though they're not directly comparable over a large time-frame because they've been redrawn every 10 years.

[Frumple]

... except if you emphasize the first ~half of that sentence, you get pretty much exactly what arx just said; the conservatives are louder because the government has been more polarized, giving them more positions in legislature et al. So it... kinda' is how M characterized it. Just not entirely, and apparently in language that y'tripped up on. Is why ask before going throat spelunking, heh.

[SalmonGod]

Jill Stein offer Sander a place on the Green Party ticket.

The cries of vote-splitting and handing the country over to Trump would be deafening.

[RedKing]

... except if you emphasize the first ~half of that sentence, you get pretty much exactly what arx just said; the conservatives are louder because the government has been more polarized, giving them more positions in legislature et al. So it... kinda' is how M characterized it. Just not entirely, and apparently in language that y'tripped up on. Is why ask before going throat spelunking, heh.

But in the context of "my vote won't matter because NC will go red in November", the polarization of the legislature is a non-sequitur. It's the popular vote we're talking about.

You know what, fuck it. Obviously, I should just admit defeat because I'm a known agitator and enemy of the peace round here. I'll shut up now.

[Sheb]

Doesn't the PVI measure the presidential vote onyl, meaning it's four years out of date now anyway?

[Frumple]

Blue hell RK, or maybe just talk to people instead of going in swinging. There's no defeat to be had, y'all are just trying to friggin' explain your different viewpoints.

[Strife26]

Sucks to be outgroup in the America thread.

[Loud Whispers]

Sucks to be outgroup in the America thread.

Is the outgroup Bernie or Clinton

[darkrider2]

Sucks to be outgroup in the America thread.

Is the outgroup Bernie or Clinton

Both apparently.

[Flying Dice]

Jill Stein offer Sander a place on the Green Party ticket.

The cries of vote-splitting and handing the country over to Trump would be deafening.

Still better than "It's our time my turn" Clinton.

A Stein/Sanders ticket would possibly be more viable than Perot was. And at this point there are few things I want more than to give a titanic two-fingered salute to the center-right Democrats that wasted the last eight years and actively discourage support for real progressives.

Besides, I'm so damned fed up with our terrible electoral system that I'm willing to spend my votes gumming up the gears with the faint hope that someone in power will bother trying to reform it. I certainly don't intend to ever give a vote to someone beholden to corporate America.

[PTTG??]

Actually I'm starting to like this. If the Democratic party realized that they are so out of touch that they lost to Donald Trump, then they might actually get their shit together.