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[Jim Groovester]

Day 2 proceeds...

[2] 4maskwolf: TheDarkStar, LARD
[1] mastahcheese: Persus13
[2] LARD: mastahcheese, 4maskwolf

[3/3] Extend: 4maskwolf, LARD, Graknorke

Day 2 has been extended to Tuesday 12:00 PM MST. There will be no more extensions.

darkpaladin109 is up for replacement due to poor activity.

[4maskwolf]

You've covered your tracks well, but the kill on Tiruin is, as you said, a beginner mistake.  One that a beginner would make.  You're a beginner.  A savvy one, but still a beginner, and this is where you slipped up.

[1]This, is not that sensible an argument to make. First, I cunningly and ruthlessly bus my scumbuddy, them I stupidly and inexperiencedly nk Tiruin, then I stupidly am the first to point out that an NK on Tiruin is a bad mafia move because it puts the blame on me.  If that's what you're claiming, okay, but even from your end, it should seem a little unlikely.

4. 4mask It's true that I didn't know which of you to lynch, and therefore I didn't really care. As you said, "Lynch one and powerrole the other." I just wanted to avoid a tie.  I wasn't very invested in the game because no one else seemed to be. Now, however. . .

How about another challenge. I had tried to lay another trap. This one involved making myself suspicious, and the first person to jump on me is mafia, because the mafia want me gone. It was a stupid plan. But now we have a new scenario. [2]We have a bandwagoner on me, where only a bit before, he was [3]buddying me and asking, "Who do you want to lynch first?"  Thank you mastahcheese, for bringing my trap to fruition, although not in the way I had intended, but we have a telling bandwagoner. How helpful that this bandwagoner was one who was one of the two to [4]vote me after Tiruin died, and then [5]panicked and flipped out.  I apologize for flip-flopping.  [6]I will tell you 4maskwolf, you are the person I want to lynch first."

Cheers, more to come

LARD:
[1] Everyone makes mistakes.  Yes, you are a savvy player, but goodness knows I screwed up as scum in the Good the Bad and the Ugly.  I just managed to avoid the notice of the most experienced players.
[2] Explain how the second vote, for a different reason than the first vote, is a bandwagon.  You're jumping to conclusions as usual, and they make no sense at all.
[3] Buddying?  Really?  You should know better than that.  I asked you to vote, yes, because the game was STALLED.  I was prodding you to get some action out of you.  At the time, you were posting but basically just sitting back and saying "well, let's let these two duke it out".  Pass the popcorn moment, no?
[4] Really?  Yes, I voted for you, and that makes me scum, no?  because of course, you're confirmed town.  Of course you are, and anyone who says otherwise is obviously scum.  RIGHT.
[5] Panicked or retaliated too harshly after a bad week?  Get your facts straight before you make accusations.
[6] Get some better evidence other than a panicked OMGUS and vague accusations of bandwagoning and I'll listen to what you have to say in your own defense.  Until then, my vote stays.

[mastahcheese]

LARD

5. Mastahcheese. I make a few passing remarks about how I have a bit of evidence on my side, you ask persistent and repetitive questions about my (nonexistent) claims to be, "In the clear" and then you accuse me of being obsessed with it when I respond to your questions. What the hemorrhaging deuce.

I, as the most likely town, (I think)

you missed the (I think)

Few passing remarks? Missed the "I think?"
Thank you for cropping your own quote, let me provide you with the actual one.

See, here is my conundrum.

I am almost certain that one of 4maskwolf and TDS are mafia. But things just don't add up.

The mafia plan went as follows: Tiruin and LARD are fighting, so we kill the IC and blame it on the newb who is less able to defend himself. Then in the morning, declare it by voting him. As I have said before, it would have been a better idea to kill Graknorke or Mastacheese, so the mafia is probably more of a new player.

4maskwolf is a more experienced player, so why would he nk Tiruin and blame it on me, who is basically in the clear. (assuming that fact. We don't have to, but it might be a good idea) That would be a huge mistake for the mafia, although a normal townsperson could still make that mistake.

TDS seems a bit more likely to be mafia as he looks like he is panicking at this point, but he seems to be a thoughtful player and I can't see why he would try to pull a dumb mafia stunt like that.

I, as the most likely town, (I think) would like to request protection during tomorrow night. That should give the mafia a WIFOM to deal with at least. (I don't know if that was a good idea)

And thank you, 4maskwolf, for this. It's not original, but it made me laugh too.

Also, LARD, your sig made me laugh.

Added the bolded bits. Why did you not include the first one? After all, you even included a nice little fallback phrase on that one, as well?

Here, let me look back a bit and find some more.

Quite important
Thank you for acknowledging that I am most likely not scum. It would have been an absolutely awful move for me to bus solymr when nobody else suspected him.
-snip-

Oh look, you did again. Once again, with a fallback phrase to protect yourself. You sure are trying hard to look town.

4maskwolf I agree that the mafia logic is flawed, that's my point. Tiruin was probably the second worst person to NK because his death would cast suspicion on me, who is standing pretty well. Thanks for admitting that you're not that experienced, but it doesn't help your case because the NK was probably and evidently by a inexperienced scum. I had forgotten about the scum IC. That changes things. Hmm, I'll have to think about that.

mastahcheese [1] I agree that I am not confirmed town. But nobody else was attacking Solymr until he subbed and I didn't have much to go on.  It would have been a terrible idea to bus on the first night, especially for someone prone to being suspicious like me.  I'm a new player, so even though I know about bussing, I wouldn't have tried it on my first round. You'll have to take my word for it . I understand your suspicions on me for saying, "I would never do that." But I will emphasize in my defense that I went for Solymr without any pressure or instigation from anyone else, and I didn't push that hard even when everybody was jumping on EHF.  In short, I believe that the two votes on me right after the death of Tiruin are far more suspicious than my possible bussing, but all suspicions should be acted upon, so I encourage you to dig deeper.

I don't have any reason to believe that there is a jailkeeper, my post only will make the mafia think twice about who they attack and it should also confuse them.

Oh look, you forgot your fallback phrase that time.
[1] I find it ironic that you say this right after proclaiming your townieness to 4mask.
You are also assuming that you must be so town that scum must clearly want you dead, even to the point of confusing the possible power-roles to screw with their aim.

Sorry about that Tiruin.

If I am not scum, I was saying that I would be the mafia's target because people have behavioral reasons to believe I'm not.  A person who most people think is town is likely to get nightkilled (I think) because they are unlikely to get lynched. I don't know what kind of answers you are looking for, mastahcheese but if you ask questions I will answer them the best I can.  I haven't ruled out the possibility of you being mafia, mastacheese.
What happened to the discussion between mastacheese and Graknorke?

And here, you more cleverly reference it, whist attacking me subtly.

2. TDS, This looks like you are bandwagoning and when you give your reasoning, it is no more than anybody else's who posted before you. This seems like you were bussing when it looked as if EHF was going to get lynched regardless, therefore putting yourself in a good light.  I also want to know about your suspicions on me, in light of the fact that the others think I'm certainly not a confirmed townie.

Are you possibly slightly insulting those of us who are not convinced by your attitude of being confirmed town?

The FoS you had actually works against you in my opinion. A mafia would seek to distance himself from his mafia partner and if the partner started playing badly, or even slightly badly, a FoS would result in distancing yourself.  Then you jumped on him when it looked like he would be lynched anyway.  I think that looks extremely scummy. I am afraid TDS that you will have to answer to these, and other accusations, listed in my above posts and other people's.
In addition. It seemed like TDS was panicking during his argument with 4mask and now he seems to have almost given up.
TDS Do not lose hope! If you are town, give us info so we will have something to work with after you are gone. If you are mafia, do the same thing. This will make it look like you are town.

I like to not use questions when I push people because it makes it too easy for them to answer with ambiguity. Having to defend yourself from a statement is more difficult.

This. How much thought have you put into as to how to look "town"? It seems you're hitting it on the mark, in fact.

You know, this is starting to become a rather long post just to show you where you are lying, LARD.

[LARD]

I have no desire to carry on this discussion about confirmed town any further, but I have this to say. Lying? It just seems like semantics at this point. I don't like this branch of conversation, and although I still think you are repeating yourself, I will not rebutt, except to say that you are still picking and choosing in your bolded quotes, not picking all the relevant information. That's okay, though. You are scumhunting and I respect that.  I don't think Mastahcheese is scum, but 4mask seems like the most likely one to me. I'd rather this calmed down and we assigned it the importance it deserves.

As for my final statement on the matter, unless other questions provoke, I am not trying to prove myself in the clear. Only responding to you.  I don't think myself as confirmed, and it wouldn't matter if I did because nobody else does. All I meant was that I had a piece of evidence on my side
What do you want from me, Mastahcheese? Do you legitimately think I'm scum or are you just hunting?

I would apologize for the confusion, but I don't think it's mine to apologize for.

As for 4maskwolf's points, I thought I explained my reasoning for my vote flip-flop, but here they are again.
I voted TDS because he seemed to be the most suspicious and panicky at that time, (see other reasons, if you care)
I switched to 4mask because while TDS was giving us stuff to work with when he was gone (I thought it was certain at that time because I didn't know second extends were allowed), 4mask was preparing for how he would act when the person he was so sure was scum turned out to be town, and not probing about whether they were town, or scum, or whatever. 
I switched back to TDS because I thought things would result in a tie, and didn't want that.
Finally I switched back to 4mask because the tie turned out not to be happening, I saw him bandwagoning and we got an extend.

4mask I apologize, I didn't realize that you had had a rough week before the OMGUS. I will leave it be.
A vote on me right after Tiruin's death fits into the mafia's perceived (by me) plan.
Bandwagoning is a serious offence and I really would like to know why you didn't vote me before Mastahcheese did. I have already explained the voteswitching.
Your point #4 is, to be frank, ridiculous, irrelevant and seems to piggyback off what mastahcheese has been saying.

I sincerely hope whatever is wrong on your end clears up, 4mask . . . but my vote is staying on you. Cheers

[mastahcheese]

So, no comment on any of those quotes I dug up? No defending yourself from the *goes and counts* nine different things that I drew attention too? And if you seriously think that I am "picking and choosing" then why are you so quick to simply brush it off? You should attack the hell out of it if it seems scummy, but no, you're just passively sitting there making stories up to explain yourself. It seems like you're trying to simply draw attention away from my attacks on you, so that people will just listen to your theories, and ignore everyone else.

As for my final statement on the matter, unless other questions provoke, I am not trying to prove myself in the clear. Only responding to you.  I don't think myself as confirmed, and it wouldn't matter if I did because nobody else does. All I meant was that I had a piece of evidence on my side

Then why did you feel the need to mention it six damn times!
That is lying. You say you're not doing that, when I just showed up with ample proof that you did and all you try to do is ignore it and act like it never happened.

What do you want from me, Mastahcheese? Do you legitimately think I'm scum or are you just hunting?

What do I want? I want for you to stop lying, and stop treating us like fools that can't see through you. I think that you are most definitely scum.

[Gentlefish]

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I'm willing to replace if needed.

[LARD]

MastahcheeseI never made the point of me having evidence on my side for it's own sake until you requested it.  All of those comments I was using it to add weight to something else I had to say.  Yet you consider that completely irrelevant.  I don't think you are scum, but If this is your version of scumhunting at this stage in the game, I would raise the possibility that you have the IQ of the common pencil sharpener that you haven't thought enough about the significance of things other than what you are pressing.  If you want me to flip out, you are going about it the wrong way. Unless you have a bigger plan, in which case I applaud you and I hope to go along with it.

Oh and the subtle attack was my way of attempting to be suspicious and lay a trap. It was a bad trap, but there you are.

[4maskwolf]

Bandwagoning?  I gave you my reasons.  I had been suspicious for a while, but the way you acted in the post responding to cheese's vote sealed the deal.

[Jim Groovester]

Day 2 proceeds...

[2] 4maskwolf: TheDarkStar, LARD
[1] mastahcheese: Persus13
[2] LARD: mastahcheese, 4maskwolf

Day 2 ends on Tuesday 12:00 PM MST. There will be no more extensions.

Pufferfish is replacing in for darkpaladin109.

[4maskwolf]

HI Pufferfish.

What do you think of the game so far?

[Gentlefish]

HI Pufferfish.

What do you think of the game so far?

I think it's time for me to now catch up.

[LARD]

What part of my response to mastahcheese do you find suspicious. I find mastahcheese's accusations kind of pointless.

[LARD]

I also like to attempt to prove I am town, or at least cite evidence, because it gives weight to my words.

This is my reasoning for wanting people to think I am town, in essence, and that is generally the way I play. I believe that I shouldn't try to mimic everybody else's style, so that it will bring up interesting conversation.

On a side note, I am getting my laughs reading Kingmaker IV. Great game, eh Jim?
Sorry for the double post.

[mastahcheese]

-snip-I find mastahcheese's accusations kind of pointless.

Pointless? Would you prefer me to just not attempt to hunt, since clearly it will offer up nothing? I suppose me saying that you're trying to brush off everything I accuse you of, which of course, is an argument that is only strengthened by your repeated attempts at deflecting/ignoring/outright insulting me, is just a waste of time?

Fine. If that's the way you want it, then fine. Consider your damn time wasted.

[Jim Groovester]

On a side note, I am getting my laughs reading Kingmaker IV. Great game, eh Jim?

Yes.

The greatest.