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[Vgray]

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

and he only does 1 hp easiest enemy in the game

Spoiler: Genocide Final Boss (click to show/hide)

Hate you >_>

But Sans needs to calm down, like what's wrong with save points and resetting time? Silly time travelling skeleton.

AND THE TEXT EVERY TIME YOU START OVER IS INFURIATING. "Oh wait, you don't have any friends..."

I love the game over screen, though. "Stay determined!" is like the best message that they could put there for the bad times.

EDIT: Get dunked on...

Super-meta discussion:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

The reason why Sans acts like he does is several-fold.

1. The reason for his laziness is actually directly caused by you. It's implied that because he's gone through so many save-resets he doesn't even care any more. In his own words, why even bother doing anything in life if at any moment some arsehole can completely reset everything you've ever done arbitrarily. Also, it seems that while he knows the world is being reset, he doesn't seem to actually know how far back it's being reset to. So while you are resetting the world only 5 minutes back, it's quite likely Sans doesn't know that and only knows that the world has been reset... but no idea how far in the future he was supposed to be. The reason I say this is because unlike Flowey, he doesn't know any specifics about what you've done or what you've undone. In fact, most of the time he himself has to take guesses about what happened (e.g: if he dunked you or if you can time travel). Additionally...

2. I also believe that you are only playing the timelines that are only relevant to you. Sans seems to imply that the world and the timelines have been altered many more times than what you probably actually did yourself. He says this even if you did an entire genocide run without saving. Not to mention, if you remember when he tells you "you'd be dead where you stand" if it wasn't for Toriel, doesn't this seem to imply that he was fully aware of your ability the moment you left that door? Possibly prior? After all, what concievable reason would he have for killing you? He states himself he doesn't give a crap about breaking the seal or trying to reach the surface. Prior to this he never even met you either. Additionally, he seems very jaded straight from the get-go, like he knows everything that's going to happen already even if it's your very first game. I think this came around because...

3. I believe what Sans is capable of doing isn't simply being capable of knowing when the world has been reset or teleportation. I think he is also aware of all the other "dimensions" so to say.

Think of it this way:

a. A copy of Undertale is a "dimension". The copy and all the saves and information on your personal hard drive is a single dimension.
b. What you do in your dimension only affects yours. So if you save everyone in your dimension, only your dimension got saved. Similarly, if you killed everyone, your dimension got destroyed and is floating in the void.
c. Sans is able to collect information regarding dimensions separate to his own, games played on other computers by other people, but is currently experiencing your effects on himself in your current dimension.
d. Basically, he's seen how all the other games of Undertale have been played, and it's now his turn. He essentially read the Prima Games Guide Book for Undertale before playing the game.

Lastly...

4. Sans is probably not aware that there is someone other than Frisk that he's talking to. Not once does he refer to you like Flowey does all the time. I don't think he knows what is actually going on. He only sees the consequences of the actions but not the root cause. In his fight he talks at length about trying to figure out your motivations but he very obviously is trying to apply rational thought to what is essentially a player playing a game with the goal of killing everyone because of completion. It doesn't make sense.

In his eyes, there's kid capable of transcending time and space visiting dimensions. This kids actions are so completely random and arbitary it doesn't seem logical. Sometimes it kills everyone. Sometimes it saves everyone. However, when it comes to his world, it's killing everybody. He knows what happens if it succeeds. He needs to stop it. But how do you stop a god?

That's basically why he's being a dick.,

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I've never had a bad time before, but is it specifically us who made Sans jaded and not Flowey?

[Putnam]

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I think there's a good chance that sans doesn't know whoever's doing that.

EDIT:

Spoiler: Spoilers up through Waterfall (click to show/hide)

so uh can anyone tell me why people complain about the piano puzzle?

They say the "notes aren't the same"

but the song you're imitating is playing a couple rooms ahead, "memory"

and it's exactly the notes you play on piano?

E B A E G# G# A

1 5 4 1 3 3 4

[umiman]

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

and he only does 1 hp easiest enemy in the game

Spoiler: Genocide Final Boss (click to show/hide)

Hate you >_>

But Sans needs to calm down, like what's wrong with save points and resetting time? Silly time travelling skeleton.

AND THE TEXT EVERY TIME YOU START OVER IS INFURIATING. "Oh wait, you don't have any friends..."

I love the game over screen, though. "Stay determined!" is like the best message that they could put there for the bad times.

EDIT: Get dunked on...

Super-meta discussion:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

The reason why Sans acts like he does is several-fold.

1. The reason for his laziness is actually directly caused by you. It's implied that because he's gone through so many save-resets he doesn't even care any more. In his own words, why even bother doing anything in life if at any moment some arsehole can completely reset everything you've ever done arbitrarily. Also, it seems that while he knows the world is being reset, he doesn't seem to actually know how far back it's being reset to. So while you are resetting the world only 5 minutes back, it's quite likely Sans doesn't know that and only knows that the world has been reset... but no idea how far in the future he was supposed to be. The reason I say this is because unlike Flowey, he doesn't know any specifics about what you've done or what you've undone. In fact, most of the time he himself has to take guesses about what happened (e.g: if he dunked you or if you can time travel). Additionally...

2. I also believe that you are only playing the timelines that are only relevant to you. Sans seems to imply that the world and the timelines have been altered many more times than what you probably actually did yourself. He says this even if you did an entire genocide run without saving. Not to mention, if you remember when he tells you "you'd be dead where you stand" if it wasn't for Toriel, doesn't this seem to imply that he was fully aware of your ability the moment you left that door? Possibly prior? After all, what concievable reason would he have for killing you? He states himself he doesn't give a crap about breaking the seal or trying to reach the surface. Prior to this he never even met you either. Additionally, he seems very jaded straight from the get-go, like he knows everything that's going to happen already even if it's your very first game. I think this came around because...

3. I believe what Sans is capable of doing isn't simply being capable of knowing when the world has been reset or teleportation. I think he is also aware of all the other "dimensions" so to say.

Think of it this way:

a. A copy of Undertale is a "dimension". The copy and all the saves and information on your personal hard drive is a single dimension.
b. What you do in your dimension only affects yours. So if you save everyone in your dimension, only your dimension got saved. Similarly, if you killed everyone, your dimension got destroyed and is floating in the void.
c. Sans is able to collect information regarding dimensions separate to his own, games played on other computers by other people, but is currently experiencing your effects on himself in your current dimension.
d. Basically, he's seen how all the other games of Undertale have been played, and it's now his turn. He essentially read the Prima Games Guide Book for Undertale before playing the game.

Lastly...

4. Sans is probably not aware that there is someone other than Frisk that he's talking to. Not once does he refer to you like Flowey does all the time. I don't think he knows what is actually going on. He only sees the consequences of the actions but not the root cause. In his fight he talks at length about trying to figure out your motivations but he very obviously is trying to apply rational thought to what is essentially a player playing a game with the goal of killing everyone because of completion. It doesn't make sense.

In his eyes, there's kid capable of transcending time and space visiting dimensions. This kids actions are so completely random and arbitary it doesn't seem logical. Sometimes it kills everyone. Sometimes it saves everyone. However, when it comes to his world, it's killing everybody. He knows what happens if it succeeds. He needs to stop it. But how do you stop a god?

That's basically why he's being a dick.,

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I've never had a bad time before, but is it specifically us who made Sans jaded and not Flowey?

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Sans doesn't seem to know Flowey exists from what the game says but if I remember correctly he's suspicious about a flower talking to his brother. Either way Putnam is on the money in that Sans doesn't really know what exactly is going on. He's just deducing and piecing the facts together. Or maybe he saw the events in different timelines and it's always some arsehole with a striped shirt doing shit in them.

[Leafsnail]

Spoiler: Spoilers up through Waterfall (click to show/hide)

so uh can anyone tell me why people complain about the piano puzzle?

They say the "notes aren't the same"

but the song you're imitating is playing a couple rooms ahead, "memory"

and it's exactly the notes you play on piano?

E B A E G# G# A

1 5 4 1 3 3 4

People are less good at memorizing tunes than they think they are.

[TempAcc]

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

There's a theory going around that the fallen child, with or without flowey's direct or indirect help, may be the cause to the constant timeline resets. After all, if you do a genocide run, Frisk eventualy gets possessed by the fallen child, and by the end of the run, the child gets all other souls, becomes a god, breaks the barrier then destroys the rest of the world, and then resets the world to do it all over again, for SOME reason.

As sans implies, the world has gone through an indefinite number of destructions/resets, and while he's somewhat aware of it, he's unable to do anything to change it, since he's a part of the timeline still. This is where Gaster comes in.

Since Gaster isn't part of the timeline anymore, he persists and can maybe do something to stop it, and maybe he has done something to stop it already, by bringing in a variable that the Fallen Child can't possibly do anything about, which is YOU, the player. The Fallen Child can't just possess Frisk anymore now because Frisk is already possessed... By you, the player, who can decide to do a pacifist run and end up saving everyone. Even Sans is somewhat surprised about everything thats happening when you take a pacifist run, just as you can just say fuck it and kill everyone because it makes you more powerful, eventualy inadvertely allowing the Fallen Child to gain more and more control and then getting powerful enough to significantly weaken your ability to change history, as shown when you do a pacifist run after having concluded a genocide run.

This would be why the boatman tells Frisk to "beware of the man from the other world", IE you, the thing that came from somewhere else and that is practically unstoppable.

[Sonlirain]

Sooo... question. How flowey acts after you do a genocide run?
I mean he does appear to remember reloads and the previous game so he should remember a complete genocide as well.
Is he terrified of the player when you start a new game or acts smug as always?

[Putnam]

are we just not spoiling things anymore

just in case

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

AFAIK he doesn't show up at all

he whines at you if you reset before the finish of a genocide run, though

[Sonlirain]

Well i'll do the spoilers as well then.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

So does that mean he does not appear at all thorough the entire next playthrough or only the begining where he's usually being a smartass?
And if he's totally nowhere to be seen then how does it affect post genocide playthroughs?

[Moghjubar]

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

[Leafsnail]

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

You need a "hard" reset after a True Pacifist or Genocide run, which resets Flowey.  I'm not sure if he still remembers some stuff though.  Sans can potentially remember stuff through hard resets because he relies on amazing intuition to work out you've seen things before.

[Putnam]

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

He also knows about the resets explicitly. Maybe that's his intuition, maybe it's his relation to Gaster.

[Egan_BW]

I love this game, but I have one problem.
Is the Steam cloud save keeping thing working for anyone else? It would be nice to be able to play on the other computer.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

And thanks for the spoiler tags.

[Leafsnail]

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

He also knows about the resets explicitly. Maybe that's his intuition, maybe it's his relation to Gaster.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Yeah his speech at the start of the Genocide fight seems to suggest that whoever "we" is has some way to detect or track timelines, but the rest of his dialogue suggests he has no direct way to retrieve information about what happened in those timelines.  Since Sans and Papyrus showed up suddenly according to a Snowdin native I think they may be some kind of "time police" that came due to all the timeline fuckery going on.

[Vgray]

Interesting. You know how the game comments if you try to name the fallen child after a main character? It also comments if you name them "Bratty" "Catty" "Gerson" or "Temmie" but gives you the usual yes and no instead of go back.

[Qmarx]

Interesting. You know how the game comments if you try to name the fallen child after a main character? It also comments if you name them "Bratty" "Catty" "Gerson" or "Temmie" but gives you the usual yes and no instead of go back.

Try gaster