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[RangerCado]

...WEB YOU ALMOST MADE ME HAVE A HEART ATTACK!!! (not literally but still)

[webadict]

...WEB YOU ALMOST MADE ME HAVE A HEART ATTACK!!! (not literally but still)

My work here is done.

[RangerCado]

 

[Captain Ford]

Captain: look at it now, i just did a quick change

Awesome.

I can just see myself sitting there as the dust settles, blinking with an expression on my face that says "wtf just happened?"

@Flavor Stuff: This is easily the most lighthearted game I've been in. I love it.

[Teneb]

1. You have a protect. What makes you decide who to use it on? When? Why? What if it's a one shot?
2. Same thing with an investigate.
3. Same with a kill.
4. All of the above as scum.
5. As third party?

...Really? You really want me to waste the time to answer 12 different questions (some of which I've already answered) that seem to have been thrown together in less than a minute, and I'm not even on your scumpick list?  Explain yourself.

You're talking. I'm taking advantage of it. Now you're getting defensive. Interesting. You do know you can take liberties with questions... mix them up, combine some, take time on others... Whatever. Just take the time to talk to me, to us. Getting bitchy and voting for me because of it however is not helpful.

To me it looks like you are trying to taunt him into becoming angry and looking scummy. That, Zrk2, is a pretty bad move.

Tell me, have you got anything out of the "keep him talking" thing? Because according to what you said, it only achieved that: making him talk.

Zrk2: That is a bit much to ask of Griff, I think. Does he need to fill out his response in triplicate?

No, but some general rules would be nice.

We are clearly out of RVS. You ask Griffon a wall of RVS questions. Andd now you shrug it off by saying that?

Ford, how about you contribute to the game instead of just saying any random thing that crosses your mind? How about you question someone? How about more than one person?

Ranger: No Lynches are a pretty bad move for Day 1. It gives town zero information and scum have no danger to themselves. Sure, we may end up lynching a towny, but we can also lynch scum. If we no lynch, we won't lynch a townie, but neither will we lynch scum.


Deathsword conjures a deathsword
(because why not)

[RangerCado]

DeathSword: Because we have 3 people in some other dimension calling us with multiverse phones to stay in the game because Web hates me and/or kirby

[RangerCado]

From what i've seen now, unless something big happens tomorrow or monday morning, Zrk, Urist or I are getting lynched... not sure how i'm going to feel about this but i hope my suspicions are right. and if their wrong, i'll probably die anyway.

UI: Yes i do still see him the most scummy due to his reactions to others wondering if he was rolefishing previously, and his apparent anger towards those who wonder why he kept asking RVS questions at this point of the Day. It seems unnecesary for RVS questions during this time at all, and to get angry over those who question this makes it even more suspicious to me. Thats my case against him and i'm sure the others voting have their own reasons for going after Zrk. My only real concern right now is that i think i may be NKed if i'm wrong on this. Don't ask why i think it will work like that, i'm being paranoid.

[Zrk2]

I thought weekends were supposed to be slow...

Zrk: Your entire arguement against me has been that i started Day 1 wanting a no lynch. I have since then changed my opinion and your reasons for voting me up to this point have seemed retaliative in nature. (is that even a word?)

I'm pretty sure retaliative is a word. But you held to that position for as long as possible even after it was demonstrated to harm the town. You only gave it up when it began to look like you might get lynched for it.

Zrk2:

I thought a No lynch would help as we may have many Night based roles, both helpful and harmful, that everyone may get more information from rather than mislynching a townie.

Or maybe you're trying to fly under the radar and want to avoid the possible blowback from voting to lynch a townie. Either way you need to make a decision. You are either scum trying to ruin the lynch or a totally ineffective townie, and I think lynching either on D1 is tolerable.

This seems a bit rough for someone who's playing their first game. You seem to discount the ability for Ranger to see that a D1 lynch is better. In fact, almost all of your reasoning for your vote on him is for having a different idea. Do you see votes as a good way to pressure new players into learning? From your wording, this seems more like a lynch vote than a pressure vote.

Votes can serve multiple purposes.

That's a vague, unhelpful statement that doesn't really answer my question.

It's also true. Did you read my post? This isn't primarily a pressure vote. This is a you are scum vote. However, if someone scummier comes along I will move my vote.

Zrk2: I don't see the logic of lynching someone for being useless on the first day. I mean, that's usually why you get lynched on the first day, and surely you can see why it doesn't work all that well. (Or maybe you do. But that would be kind of sad)

re: Your sentiments on my play-style: That sounds accurate. I'm usually not very forceful, so I don't play terribly well here. My lack of questions once I pick a target is something I need to work on. It comes from my approach to the game. I try to keep on top of posts and answer all questions addressed to me until I think someone is scum, then I go back through their posts and look to see if anything supports that idea. If a sufficient amount of evidence does I compile my case and post it. By that point I'm not sure how I should work questions into it.

re: Quoted part: I find that lynches on D1 do not have enough information to find scum with any reliability. It always comes down to who looks scummy, which is usually synonymous with playing poorly, and with some meta mixed in, at least until there are inspects protects and all the other paraphernalia that accumulate in the night. Thus if lynches D1 are going to be based solely on ability to scumhunt one might as well be honest and cut right to the chase. Furthermore losing an unproductive townie isn't terrible and just ensures that the townies that are around later on are more likely to actually find scum. Is that clear enough?

Zrk

Scumpicks:
1. RangerCado, as explained above.
2. Hapah, for lurking.
3. TheWetSheep, also for lurking.

So lurking is the only other scummy thing you've seen so far?

I can hardly place everyone on my scumpicks list so I listed the biggest offenders.

So more than half of the offenders are lurkers. Explain why are they more suspicious than anyone else, and explain why lurking is a big offense in this context?

As I posted earlier lynching lurkers/bad scumhunters D1 sounds like a good idea to me, so they qualify for my scumlist. Furthermore they both have extremely few posts. At the time of that post They both had less than three posts since the game began. That's extreme and warrants punishment.

Zrk2

Speak now or die.

Desperate to get someone else lynched are we?

Of course I'm eager to see scum die. Why shouldn't I be?

Well there is always the obvious: you are scum.

How'd you guess? Of course I'm scum.

I have been busy responding to accusations of rolefishing, now we can get on with it.

Only I decided to call you out on role-fishing initially, both Sheep and TolyK were happy to answer, so why didn't you just shrug it off?  Nervousness caused by that accusation perhaps?

You are complaining that I made a point of countering your claim? That's a bad thing now? Did I miss the memo?

After the already doing so before? Yes.  If you read this you'll note I'd moved on.  Then you come back and say this:

I have been busy responding to accusations of rolefishing, now we can get on with it.

Note that this was almost a day later, and you'd been active in that time period.  Please also note that you unvoted me at the start of this post, meaning your "pressure" was still on me during the day.  Or should have been.  Yes, I messed up the formatting of my post, but if you actually cared about your vote on me you would have read the post and noted that I had responded to your question, as I was your target at the time.

It was a fucking RVS vote. I placed it because that's proper form. I wasn't particularly concerned with it. I've found someone I actually think is scum, now I care where it is.

So then you come back and seem to decide that by saying:

PPE Zrk2
Now you've got him talking, then what? Are you going to continue poking him, poking others, or just stating your reason henceforth?

Keep him talking of course.

you need to keep asking me questions despite: A) Your vote moving away from me, and B) not having questions that you hadn't already asked twice before.

So please tell my why you are asking me RVS questions when you already have a read on me?

To flesh it out.

Please respond or at least tell me why you won't respond.
Also: Why do your only two modes of action seem to be "defend against prods" or "ignore the attack and hope it goes away"?

For starters you missed "scumhunt." And furthermore, what modes are there other than "respond to an attack" and "not respond to it." They are diametrically opposed, so of course I will always be in one or the other.

Zrk2:

Scumpicks:
1. RangerCado, as explained above.
2. Hapah, for lurking.
3. TheWetSheep, also for lurking.

So lurking is the only other scummy thing you've seen so far?

I can hardly place everyone on my scumpicks list so I listed the biggest offenders.

I can't help but notice that you didn't actually answer that question. Have you seen anything scummy other than lurking and Ranger's nolynch suggestion?

Lurking of the magnitude seen by those to is very serious, so of course it makes it onto my list. I have had people rub me the wrong way, but so far I have not seen enough to place anyone else on the list. It's a work in progress.

1. You have a protect. What makes you decide who to use it on? When? Why? What if it's a one shot?
2. Same thing with an investigate.
3. Same with a kill.
4. All of the above as scum.
5. As third party?

...Really? You really want me to waste the time to answer 12 different questions (some of which I've already answered) that seem to have been thrown together in less than a minute, and I'm not even on your scumpick list?  Explain yourself.

You're talking. I'm taking advantage of it. Now you're getting defensive. Interesting. You do know you can take liberties with questions... mix them up, combine some, take time on others... Whatever. Just take the time to talk to me, to us. Getting bitchy and voting for me because of it however is not helpful.

To me it looks like you are trying to taunt him into becoming angry and looking scummy. That, Zrk2, is a pretty bad move.

Tell me, have you got anything out of the "keep him talking" thing? Because according to what you said, it only achieved that: making him talk.

That's a goal in and of itself. Why not get people worked up? It gives a different perspective on them. However, that was not my goal, I just wanted to draw him out and get him to answer the question. If he gets a little carried away so much the better. Why do you feel it is a bad move?

Whew... I suppose I'm going to have to go poke through the thread again and see if anyone sticks out to me. I'll do that tomorrow.

[RangerCado]

So potential lynch victims for D 1:

RangerCado: 3 votes

Zrk2: 3 votes

Urist Imiknorris: 3 votes
This is gonna come down to those three who haven't voted on us yet: Vector, Tolyk, and TheWetSheep. (someone correct me if i'm wrong here) We're all good lynch targets to be honest. I messed up alot in the beggining, while Zrk and UI have showed signs of scummyness as of late. All i can hope for now is the luck of the draw.

For what its worth, i enjoyed this game a ton so far, even if i get lynched you guys gave me a lot of tips and i think i'll do much better in later games. Good luck to my... opponents for lynching? yeah, good luck and lets cross our figures that we don't die. (unless your scum, please die for us)

[Tiruin]

>.>...


PFP Skim reading.

Ranger: Other than focusing on "Oh dear, votes and lynch! AHHH~", what are you doing in making your probable time left into some use? You're dumping every possibility (which segues into the realm of WIFOM) and then prodding at the votecount for added reference material.

Dude. There's really much something wrong with your focusing skills. Now, I don't believe Ranger is scum much that he's using relativism in in posts...pretty much in a way that denounced closed thinking, but as a major tip: You're posting it wrong.

First of all, if you know you're town and heading for the lynch - do it for the team. Begin prodding those you really suspect and get information to the utmost use of your linguistic skills. No info = Dead town, relating to your thoughts regarding the No Lynch earlier (which I presumed spoke about power role investigate/see-types and whichever counters scum moves...the reason this was denounced because of the utter entropy in its reasoning. We have no darn idea what'll happen until it happens, less so for them scumbags.)

This.

For what its worth, i enjoyed this game a ton so far, even if i get lynched you guys gave me a lot of tips and i think i'll do much better in later games. Good luck to my... opponents for lynching? yeah, good luck and lets cross our figures that we don't die. (unless your scum, please die for us)

Ain't a good way to die out :/ It goes best as a BAH post - people get a bah post to give in their thoughts/grievances.

You seem to be giving up already. What have you on the remaining people/your suspects; and regardless of "Oh dear, this person has the most votes. He's goin' down", Do you think the other two with the tied votes deserve the lynch? Do you think you deserve the lynch?

[TheWetSheep]

Zrk2: Is lurking no longer a cause for suspicion? Because UI only has 4 posts up till now, and a few others haven't posted much either.

Zrk2:

I thought a No lynch would help as we may have many Night based roles, both helpful and harmful, that everyone may get more information from rather than mislynching a townie.

Or maybe you're trying to fly under the radar and want to avoid the possible blowback from voting to lynch a townie. Either way you need to make a decision. You are either scum trying to ruin the lynch or a totally ineffective townie, and I think lynching either on D1 is tolerable.

This seems a bit rough for someone who's playing their first game. You seem to discount the ability for Ranger to see that a D1 lynch is better. In fact, almost all of your reasoning for your vote on him is for having a different idea. Do you see votes as a good way to pressure new players into learning? From your wording, this seems more like a lynch vote than a pressure vote.

Votes can serve multiple purposes.

That's a vague, unhelpful statement that doesn't really answer my question.

It's also true. Did you read my post? This isn't primarily a pressure vote. This is a you are scum vote. However, if someone scummier comes along I will move my vote.

I never said it wasn't true. Anyway, as I said before, this seems you're voting for him because he had a different opinion. I could see it being a pressure vote, but as a lynch vote it looks scummy. You accuse him of trying to fly under the radar, but fail to keep in mind that it's his first game.

I'm usually not very forceful

Why not get people worked up?

Are you acting out of character for yourself here, or is it something else?

Ranger: I echo Tiruin's sentiments. Calm down, you're tied with two other people. Oh, actually, I just broke that tie. Don't give up.

Tolyk:

Wow. I guess after typing my answer to the first part, I just forgot there was more. Sorry, TolyK:
I would use it on the person I found most scummy. I like to be sure before I lynch.

Hm, WetSheep, what if the person who you thought was most scummy was already being lynched big-time (by a large margin)? And would you use a role-inspect to see whether somebody is telling the truth (for example, NQT's bold post)?

For the first question, I'd probably inspect one of the most competent players, preferably one who I had a gut scummy feeling on. For the second, if it was one-shot probably not, since I like to conserve things, but if it wasn't then yes.

UI: Is there a reason you're not posting much?

[Griffionday]

Zrk2:

I find that lynches on D1 do not have enough information to find scum with any reliability. It always comes down to who looks scummy, which is usually synonymous with playing poorly, and with some meta mixed in, at least until there are inspects protects and all the other paraphernalia that accumulate in the night. Thus if lynches D1 are going to be based solely on ability to scumhunt one might as well be honest and cut right to the chase. Furthermore losing an unproductive townie isn't terrible and just ensures that the townies that are around later on are more likely to actually find scum. Is that clear enough?

There is a MAJOR problem here actually; if you make your vote entirely based on a set of rules day one and have no further reasons, you WILL hurt the town N1 & D2.  Vote by rule/meta is simplistic; the reasons for your vote are "Well, he was playing like he didn't know what he was doing and that warrants my vote."  The problem with this is when the person lynched flips we have no more information on you.  So we then have to waste roles N1 and precious time early D2 in trying to get some other way of reading you.  Which is a lot of trouble you'd save us by actually scum hunting and finding whatever information you can D1.

How'd you guess? Of course I'm scum.

Really? WIFOM?  I know you're joking, but I refuse to not use this sound byte.

It was a fucking RVS vote. I placed it because that's proper form. I wasn't particularly concerned with it. I've found someone I actually think is scum, now I care where it is.

Your vote has weight, no matter how little you cared about it.  proper form seems to me to be to change the vote when you stop questioning the first person your vote is on.  This would have been a good post to do this on.

To flesh it out.

No... that's not the goal of RVS questions.  At least not what I meant by it in that case.  A RVS question feeds you stuff to pull apart and over-analyze to see what they'll say about your reads into what they are saying.  A RVS question in and of itself probably won't cause someone to give up a read.  It's what happens when you pressure them a bit more that's interesting.

For starters you missed "scumhunt." And furthermore, what modes are there other than "respond to an attack" and "not respond to it." They are diametrically opposed, so of course I will always be in one or the other.

No I didn't miss that, that was the point.  And a combination of both lets you use your time more effectively, at the very least read into what they're saying and pressure them about it.  Unless you don't care about your hunt being effective, but only scum wouldn't want that.

Of course I'm scum.

Oh... Right.

Lurking of the magnitude seen by those to is very serious, so of course it makes it onto my list.

Out of sheer curiousity, what percent of games that you've been in/read have the scum lurking day one?

To me it looks like you are trying to taunt him into becoming angry and looking scummy. That, Zrk2, is a pretty bad move.

Tell me, have you got anything out of the "keep him talking" thing? Because according to what you said, it only achieved that: making him talk.

That's a goal in and of itself. Why not get people worked up? It gives a different perspective on them. However, that was not my goal, I just wanted to draw him out and get him to answer the question. If he gets a little carried away so much the better. Why do you feel it is a bad move?

Yes, keeping a player talking is a goal by definition.  But is it in anyway useful, or does it just create a smoke screen of noise that the scum can hide in?

And you missed this one.

We are clearly out of RVS. You ask Griffon a wall of RVS questions. Andd now you shrug it off by saying that?

So Zrk2, my vote is on you primarily because I feel the way you are acting in D1 is the most harmful to the town in the long run.  Yes you're playing qualitatively better than Ranger, but Ranger has been learning over the course of the game, and has expressed what felt like genuine concern that he doesn't have reads yet.  You on the other hand seem to be playing a self-fulfilling prophesy, if the only lynch we should do D1 is the weakest player, then the town will always be lynched D1.  Not [#mafia]/[#players]*100 percent of the time. ALWAYS.  Why you ask? the mafia have their chat, the strongest player can help the weaker players play better in the game, ensuring that if that rule is followed D1 will end in a town lynch.

But more than that, you deprive us of a valuable read on you as I mentioned earlier.  You're crippling the town N1 and early D2 by your vote for the weakest strategy.

Please tell me why you feel that this is an acceptable loss again? 
No wait:

I'm scum.

As you seem to miss questions, the ones I want you to answer are:

What percent of games that you've been in/read have the scum lurking day one?
Is it in anyway useful, or does it just create a smoke screen of noise that the scum can hide in?
Why you feel that this is an acceptable loss again? (read the post and make sure you understand all that I consider lost)

We are clearly out of RVS. You ask Griffon a wall of RVS questions. Andd now you shrug it off by saying that?

Solider:
It's been a LONG time since I've seen you around here.  You must have more to say/more to poke by now, please do so.

[RangerCado]

Tiruin: ...True, i'm being stupid again. lets list all suspicions then.

UI seems to be after me only for the fact that i started with wanting no-lynch and only gave one reason previously for going after Zrk. He has persisted with his vote despite an explanation of my continued vote on Zrk. If Zrk comes up scum, UI may be trying to save a scum buddy but i don't have any proof that UI would try that or has previously so i'm leaving that in the middle range possibility.

Zrk seems to think that i'm being scummy for stopping my no lynch idea even though that was about 40 hours ago give or take. The grounds are that people were thinking of lynching me for it... could be true, but its more that he started this scumminess campaign when he over-reacted to many thinking he was role-fishing. He then got angry at people questioning his reasoning for RVS questions about 2-4 pages ago. This leads me to believe that he's trying to save-face. (as i was trying before but got over it)

Vector hasn't posted in a while (i'm sorry for calling you a guy so many times) even though she has been active on other pages. I believe this is lurking and no activity for over 2 days is a bit ridiculous. If she does post before the Lynch, I would expect it to be quite a large post.

Gonna agree with DeathSword here that Captain hasn't posted much useful (or even of a decent length) in the last 14-20 hours or so. This seems odd as in that time you'd think you would have something to stat.

These are my current suspicions of those i think are Scummy or Lurky. Do with this what you will.

oh, more posts.

TheWetSheep: Zrk also claimed this when 3 people were interegating me. It seems as if he has been trying to lynch me from this point on. Although i haven't had much of a read on you yet, i think i can trust you for the rest of this day atleast as what i have investigated into your posts hasn't tipped me of anything scummy.

Griff: He has also begun lurking a bit himself, not posting as much as he used to be though it may be weekend related.

[Tiruin]

EBWOP-PPE'D by TWS and Griff. Fast typers you guys are.


Zrk: As TolyK is darn busy, and seeing the tie, you're my next pick as of late. WHile your playstyle does take getting used to, you're...somehow, lacking in your scumhunting.

Firstly, on your target picks, you're poking at them - believing lurking is a damnable offense on D1 (you didn't explain or expound this in much detail) - and focusing on Ranger for his...honestly, flawed way of logic; while it is flawed, it doesn't brush me in any malevolent way. Here I ask you this: Why do you lack faith in the lynch when it hasn't even happened yet? Do you think the other two beside you are more viable lynch-targets? If so, then what do you think about them. If not, can you summarize your case on Ranger and quote/link why? Lastly; do you really believe Ranger is scum, or 'unproductive' Town? If the latter, why unproductive? If he lives on, do you think he won't shape up?

Why are you using sarcasm by the way, regarding people suspecting you as scum? Do you think that's a good way to persuade others from lynching you?

Gah darnit Ranger D: PPE.


:/

It's interesting. Many people poking at lurking. Lurk lurk lurk, comprises most of what I read in some posts. Why do you people think lurking is an offense in DAY ONE? I mean, you can just log off, then bookmark the quicktopic link and/or view the thread whilst logged off. Do you people think Lurking = Laziness, or that lurking = lack of drive in scumhunting? Because classifying things as "LURKING" doesn't hold much water unless you back it up with the reasons behind it.

I mean really. He's lurking = he's scum for being online? For an extended amount of time, now that's where suspicion begins to grow. For...a few hours? Not that much in the way of conclusive evidence.

[Vector]

I was busy all day on Friday coming back from college (etc. blah blah blah) and today my family celebrated Easter.  Weekends count as zero time.  I will post tomorrow, but right now I have business to take care of.