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[scrdest]

Axl is truely robust. If it weren't for the shadow I wouldn't be stuck in the Captain's Quarters tough. I just hope that guy's a traitor too and not an admin deciding to fuck everyone over.

this is the guy who goes straight to the armory at the start of the round and prepares for ww3 for no reason, right?

I've never actually done that. Some odd round I might order a ballistics crate, but that's it.

I haven't done that either. I ended up giving all officers and a random assitant that was supposed to be AI laser guns because you stole all the regular energy guns. I don't think I even took anything out of the Armory at teh start of the round at all. I just had two energy guns. Mainly because I didn't notice that I spawned with one and ended up picking one from my locker. Later that round, my office was blown up.

Also: nerfs for tasers. Here's what I suggest:

Tasers stun people not wearing armor, but if they are wearing any sort of armor at all, there's only a 10% chance that they'll be stunned.
Energy guns set to stun stun people not wearing armor, but if they are wearing any sort of armor at all, there's only a 15-25% chance that they'll be stunned.
Energy guns set to kill have an 80% chance of knocking people down if they aren't wearing armor, and a 50% chance of knocking them down if they are.
Laser guns... Well, I guess 80% and 60-70%.

The numbers are pretty arbitrary, but I think a system like this would probably make it so an assistant wielding a taser won't win from a security officer with a laser cannon and riot gear.

Wait, energy guns knocking people down? If you want knockdown, have stun have slightly bigger chances, if not, you go for a kill. Changing the kill into a more effective stun than stun itself is not the best idea.

I also think that there is a simpler way of nerfing Tasers and Stun Lasers: maximum range. Right now, you can literally Stunsnipe across the entire FOV. Leave kill as it was, but Stun is literally MORE POWERFUL than Kill, because Stun+Kill combo is impossible to defend against, while Kill+moar Kill is.

Also, I don't really think it is security that needs help, they have superior manpower, equipment and, sometimes, AI surveillance to help them, while J.Random Traitor has just his 10 crystals to work with. J. Random Rev is even more hopeless by default.

[TheBronzePickle]

I know on the Goon servers they give (or at least used to give) the Rev Heads the same Syndicate gear options that the traitors got, just to make their lives a little less hard.

The fact they didn't care about lolflash probably helped, too.

[Hanslanda]

I'll let someone else explain Khan's actions because I don't understand.

I joined in late in the round as security.  Apparently Khan killed the clown.  So I was told to arrest him. I slap on the cuffs, then kaboom, he blows up a bomb, gibs me and himself, and kills a bunch of other people.  In deadchat, he says, no he wasn't traitor, but he's really drunk.  He thought it was really funny though.

This... Has absolutely no bearing on the round of which I was speaking. And also this:

In deadchat, he says, no he wasn't traitor, but he's really drunk.  He thought it was really funny though.

 

Is not a good fucking reason. In fact, that's a terrible reason to kill several people in game. That is griefing, just like suddenly and with no prior warning, completely out of character, shooting me into critical then drilling me into gibs. It is griefing, and I'm not going to fucking play if that's how this server is going to be. "Well, I enjoyed it." Is not a good fucking reason, or am I somehow mistaken in that I shouldn't be running around blowing people up and shooting them whenever I want?

I play by the rules, and if I'm going to kill someone in game, and make them sit around and be fucking bored for the rest of the round, I make good god damn sure I have a good fucking reason. If, perchance, this server isn't like that, would someone kindly explain that to me, so I can join in on the bombing-everyone-for-shits-and-giggles thing.

I understand that someone might be upset over my graphic language and aggressive manner right now, but I'd like you to look at this from my perspective: I had a fantastic round going. I was role-playing a character, and the actions I took were ones my character would have taken. Not only that, I was the only antag in the round, and I wasn't just randomly murdering people. Then, right as I had basically won the fucking round, someone else comes up, and completely out of character murders me (Regardless of whether I told them to finish me off, they put me into critical and didn't attempt to revive me or give me any hint that they weren't just going to let me gasp to death for the rest of the round.) The whole rest of the round, when I was like, "We're gonna raid these guys." He was like, "Fuck yeah, let's go kill Axl." So don't try and tell me his character was like, "Oh no, the bad security man made me do all that." Because that's bullshit. Plain and simple. Like I said in round, I had transcripts of these conversations. It ruined all the fun I had in that game and I'm quite upset over it.

So now this is the part where someone else gets mad at me for being upset over getting griefed, and tells me to stop talking about it so the thread doesn't get locked, so go ahead and do that.

[Freshmaniscoolman]

I don't really think the thread would be locked because you're discussing a ban about the server, but if you're arguing about a ban about another server, yeah. So no.

[Morrigi]

I wonder why you heff to be mad. It is only game....

People take SS13 way too fucking seriously.

[Freshmaniscoolman]

There's something frustrating in SS13. I don't know what but there's just something.

[Hanslanda]

I don't really think the thread would be locked because you're discussing a ban about the server, but if you're arguing about a ban about another server, yeah. So no.

I'm not really in it to argue so much anyway, it just frustrated me quite a lot and I wanted to get that off my chest. I actually feel a good deal better now that I've said it.

I wonder why you heff to be mad. It is only game....

People take SS13 way too fucking seriously.

... The things I could say to you. Let's start with this: Soccer (European football, whichever) is just a game. Yet (and I'm guessing here) people DIE over it every year. Just because something is a game doesn't mean you can't derive serious enjoyment from it, and conversely, serious frustration.

I don't have to be mad, but I take the game kind of seriously. I play a character. I roleplay, quite deeply in fact. If Kilakan were in my house right now, I wouldn't be punching him or anything, but I would say, "What the fuck man?"

Anyways, I've got to go to work now, I'll see what ya'll say when I get back later.

[Damiac]

Well, SS13 needs pretty rigid rules to work at all.  If people discuss IC stuff in OOC, antagonists simply don't work. If people discus OOC stuff in IC, it ruins the RP environment.
If anyone can just kill anyone else, it's just random chaos.
Most games rules are self enforcing. Play a game of chess on the computer, you really can't cheat, the game knows not to let you move your knight 5 spaces horizontally.
The rules of SS13 are not so easily enforced. 

So I think it becomes very frustrating to people when the rules are broken because we rely completely on the people playing the game to follow the rules.  If you let rule-breaking go, it can quickly spiral out of control.  As Hans said, if people can just do whatever they want because it's fun for them, the people at who's expense the fun is had are going to stop playing.  I was trying to point out how ridiculous his reasoning was, but of course, sarcasm doesn't translate well over the internet...

All that being said, I don't know what the admins have or haven't already done about it. 

[BigD145]

I wonder why you heff to be mad. It is only game....

People take SS13 way too fucking seriously.

It's a multiplayer role playing server. Not a heavy one, but still meant for RP. It's a shared experience, so if only one person is having fun then that means other people are not and it's not much of a game anymore.

We need a "n strikes and you're permabanned" list.

[Kaitol]

So basically, any antag that has armor would be all but immune to security? Yeah no. Its hard enough chasing down a runner as it is, let alone hitting them, you would almost never be able to take down someone in armor unless they were stupid enough to stand still. Ablative armor already makes you practically immune to tasers. Leave it at that. If you nerf stun, WE CAN'T TAKE YOU ANTAGS ALIVE. Then everyone will whine because shitcurity killed them because they shrugged off tasers like flies. Besides, the entire security force starts with armor. You'd be making us ten times more deadly because right now the only reliable way to stop US is a taser.

Antags shouldn't be trying to take on the entire security force in open combat anyway. If you're doing that and losing, its your own fault.

[Damiac]

Yeah, that's basically how I feel about it.  If you get shot with a stun weapon, you're done for.  If you're antag, and security is after you, you're in trouble. 

I do wish cyborgs were less resilient though.  In a game where one stun ends the fight, robots with infinite stun and immunity to stun weapons are a bit OP.  I know you can flash them, but then what?

I think it should be possible at least to flash, screwdriver open the cover, flash again, pry out the battery.  So then they're as vulnerable to everyone else, except instead of stun/handcuff, they get stun, battery removal.  It seems silly that you need the proper ID to open them.  It should just be one of those timed things, so you can't just instantly disable them.

[FritzPL]

oi, Hans, get your shit together.
This is B12.
People die.
And everyone else is okay with it, as long as it's not prolonged trolling.

[Fayrik]

Let's start with this: Soccer (European football, whichever) is just a game. Yet (and I'm guessing here) people DIE over it every year. Just because something is a game doesn't mean you can't derive serious enjoyment from it, and conversely, serious frustration.

I don't have to be mad, but I take the game kind of seriously. I play a character. I roleplay, quite deeply in fact. If Kilakan were in my house right now, I wouldn't be punching him or anything, but I would say, "What the fuck man?"

Anyways, I've got to go to work now, I'll see what ya'll say when I get back later.

Just a quick thing to add, this brings up something I was sort of hoping to say for awhile.

So, like two weeks ago, it was a pretty average round, until the shuttle got called, at which point everyone on security went nuts and setup a checkpoint and welded all the escape pods shut. So, when I get there, a security officer looks at me, turns around and gets on the shuttle. So, I was left to die with absolutely no explanation of anything.
The only reason I'm posting this is because that's been the only "What the fuck, man?" moment I've had with this community and it really got to me.

Anyway, rant over!

If you nerf stun, WE CAN'T TAKE YOU ANTAGS ALIVE.

Well, actually, if you nerf stun then you're basically destroying the very foundation of the combat system.
I'm loathed to post combat tips in case I have to fight someone and my tips get used against me. Anyhow...
Stun -> Incapacitate -> Kill.
If you're not doing it like that you're not doing it right at all.
You might be able to skip the stun step if you surprise someone, but I've not managed to see that work in action, yet.

I do wish cyborgs were less resilient though.  In a game where one stun ends the fight, robots with infinite stun and immunity to stun weapons are a bit OP.  I know you can flash them, but then what?

Flash -> Wrench/Crowbar/Hammer/Anything.
Cyborgs are tougher, yes, but liberal application of any blunt force can disable them so long as you keep them flashed.
That said, I have to point out that doing this to a janitor bot is completely immoral and if you were to do such you would be an absolute monster.

[Morrigi]

oi, Hans, get your shit together.
This is B12.
People die.
And everyone else is okay with it, as long as it's not prolonged trolling.

But this game IS prolonged trolling, not necessarily because of anyone in particular.

[Bdthemag]

oi, Hans, get your shit together.
This is B12.
People die.
And everyone else is okay with it, as long as it's not prolonged trolling.

If someone gets killed for absolutely no reason by someone who isn't a traitor, than they have a right to be pissed off. The person who got killed would then have to spend the rest of the round doing jack shit, which isn't exactly fun.

I wonder why you heff to be mad. It is only game....

People take SS13 way too fucking seriously.

Please don't use the "It's only a game" argument again or I'll have to resist the urge to strangle you.

Regardless, I'll talk to Khan when I get the chance. What he did only deserves a warning at the moment, so don't expect me to go ban happy on him. Don't ever expect me to ban people unless they're consistently griefing, because I really hate banning people.