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[Pnx]

Problem being, one of the frequent things you find with mental illness is an aversion to therapy. Because that means admitting there's something wrong.

Okay, first up. Two problems here. Aversion to therapy is in most cases not a case of pure personal pride. It often comes from how looked down upon those with any kind of mental illness are. Even depression since often times they get told by very close friends or family just to get over it and nothing is wrong. It's that attitude that needs to go, since people with mental illness or other issues that need therapy need nothing but support and kindness from friends, familys and the healthcare system. Pushing for some form of acceptance would be the first step here. Not some kind of backdoor to more crimes committed by the mentally ill. Actively punishing the mentally ill would be the first step in completely, totally removing any hope at all of proper care being given to them.

I will definitely 100% back Janet up on this one, the way in which our society views and deals with mental illness is pretty horrible.

(Or if you're paranoid schizophrenic, it gives THEM a chance to implant tracking devices in your teeth.)

Would you mind not saying this kind of bullshit? Some of us (Me for example) have our symptoms under control, and definitely don't like being things to point and laugh at for whatever amusement that gives you. This crap is no laughing matter, and bullshit like the above just stigmatizes things even further. And I suppose as long as TV keeps telling people it's okay to laugh at people with mental issues (Like Monk for OCD, or how people think that one guy in The Big Bang Theory is autistic and laugh at him too) this is just gonna keep repeating itself.

Anyway with that I'm out of this thread for the most part I think. That was just really bugging me.

But this one I'm a little 50/50 on. I've never really had a problem with shows making fun of autism, OCD, etc. But then again I tend to view dark humour as a kind of coping mechanism for dealing with the more depressing stuff this world has to offer. I've generally got no problem with people making fun of serious issues, as long as they keep in mind that it's a serious issue.

[RedKing]

I apologize if the dark humor didn't go over well, but I was making the point that there are certain conditions that are inherently an obstacle to treatment in and of themselves. Social anxiety disorder, for example. If you're too fucking uncomfortable talking to people to leave your house, that kind of makes seeking treatment difficult. Paranoid schizophrenia that makes you distrust medical professionals is a barrier to treatment.

I'm not speaking from some disdainful podium here. I've been on antidepressants before. My wife has been on them for years and still is. Her brother needs treatment BADLY and frankly, needs to be medicated. He won't seek help, he won't get medication, and in his case it's a mixture of pride and fear masquerading as pride because he won't admit to the fear. He also has anger management issues, and he's exactly the type of person who SHOULD NOT HAVE A FIREARM.

It's not about demonizing the mentally ill, but it is about recognizing that mental illness and firearms are two variables which have the potential to mix rather badly. We haven't even looked at how many suicides are linked to mental illness and carried out with firearms.

[Gunner-Chan]

He won't seek help, he won't get medication, and in his case it's a mixture of pride and fear masquerading as pride because he won't admit to the fear. He also has anger management issues, and he's exactly the type of person who SHOULD NOT HAVE A FIREARM.

See this is the part I agree with. But the problem here is it can't focus on specifically mental illnesses. Backround checks need to tighten up and we need to keep a better hold on knowing as a country the overall mental state of our citizens. Since ugly as it is, if we limit the restrictions to those found with forms of hard mental illness then we Are demonizing the mentally ill. It puts them legally on a different category than those who are not. And simply put, when we start restricting one thing to them, it's likely that other restrictions would be pushed out by people with an actual agenda to punish the mentally ill or handicapped.

So really I think the better option is to stop assuming someone is level headed and responsible from the get go, everyone should be monitored and treated carefully. Not just the mentally ill or those that already snapped.

Though as is, I personally think handguns being legal in the state they're in is bullshit. Rifles have sporting and target uses. Handguns are quite simply meant only to harm other human beings, plain and simple. Not to say rifles can't be abused, they were in this case. But they're much harder to conceal and move at least.

[palsch]

I had meant to make a similar post to Janet's but it seems it didn't go through. Basically what she said. I do not feel comfortable sharing other people's stories online, especially those I'm not in touch with any more, but my experience has always been the biggest factor in not seeking or accepting help for mental illness has been cultural and social baggage. Even if that is sometimes enhanced by the illness it tends to come back to the cultural perception of being mentally ill rather than inherent to the disease.

But this one I'm a little 50/50 on. I've never really had a problem with shows making fun of autism, OCD, etc. But then again I tend to view dark humour as a kind of coping mechanism for dealing with the more depressing stuff this world has to offer. I've generally got no problem with people making fun of serious issues, as long as they keep in mind that it's a serious issue.

The problem comes when dark humour and other problematic, stereotypical depictions ("all schizophrenics are violent killers", "depression is something you can just snap out of", etc) are dominant in popular culture. You might get sensitive, realistic depictions of mental illness in the occasional independent film or even rarer documentary. But the vast majority of popular culture goes for the cheap laugh or the harmful stereotype, perpetuating them, ingraining them deeper into the social perception.

If there was enough visible and prominent outreach being done to change the dominant stereotypes (there are plenty of activists but rarely visibility outside the community), if there were cultural awareness of the realities of these illnesses beyond the stereotypes, then I wouldn't have a problem with the dark humour. I truly don't have a problem coming from shows that have good, non-problematic depictions injecting humour into them; that's actually a damned good thing and part of making the depictions well rounded and realistic^*. But we aren't there yet.


On the gun control side, I still don't believe there is a realistic path to legally denying the mentally ill guns that doesn't make matters worse. On the practical side you have information sharing and enforcement issues. On the cultural side you are further demonising mental illness and discouraging people from seeking treatment. Again, most of the potential issues can be better addressed by working to improve mental health care and removing the barriers to treatment. Including (especially) the cultural ones.

Spoiler: *Cut something that might cause a digression. (click to show/hide)

I was trying to think of an example and came up with Toph from Avatar and the humour around her being blind. I realised later that this is a good example of general disability but not mental illness which was at point. I usually discuss these issues in terms of marginalised groups in general or ableism as a whole, accounting for both physical and mental disabilities.

The fact that this was the first example I jumped to (and easily the strongest I've been able to think of) probably says something about both me and pop culture, but I don't want to dwell on this.

[rutsber]

He won't seek help, he won't get medication, and in his case it's a mixture of pride and fear masquerading as pride because he won't admit to the fear. He also has anger management issues, and he's exactly the type of person who SHOULD NOT HAVE A FIREARM.

See this is the part I agree with. But the problem here is it can't focus on specifically mental illnesses. Backround checks need to tighten up and we need to keep a better hold on knowing as a country the overall mental state of our citizens. Since ugly as it is, if we limit the restrictions to those found with forms of hard mental illness then we Are demonizing the mentally ill. It puts them legally on a different category than those who are not. And simply put, when we start restricting one thing to them, it's likely that other restrictions would be pushed out by people with an actual agenda to punish the mentally ill or handicapped.

So really I think the better option is to stop assuming someone is level headed and responsible from the get go, everyone should be monitored and treated carefully. Not just the mentally ill or those that already snapped.

Though as is, I personally think handguns being legal in the state they're in is bullshit. Rifles have sporting and target uses. Handguns are quite simply meant only to harm other human beings, plain and simple. Not to say rifles can't be abused, they were in this case. But they're much harder to conceal and move at least.

Handguns can be useful for other things. My dad traps animals, and he uses a handgun because it's easier to carry than a rifle.

[Leafsnail]

So really I think the better option is to stop assuming someone is level headed and responsible from the get go, everyone should be monitored and treated carefully. Not just the mentally ill or those that already snapped.

There'd be pretty severe surveillance issues in having to monitor everyone carefully.  The amount of people you'd need to do it would probably make it impractical, even if you ignore privacy concerns.