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[Lysabild]

Poor and desperate populations are usually more religious because they need the comfort more to not just snap and give up.

[MonkeyHead]

That, and a lack of education. Or, at least, a lack of Secular education, allowing people to challenge entrenched old thinking, be it for better or worse.

Cos, you know, the Taliban love schools dont they... [/sarcasm]

[Spinning Fly]

Even if a nonsensical concept like free will existed, it would not absolve God from responsibility. To excuse God’s neglect by saying that God wanted us to make our own choices is to tacitly imply that crimes are committed between consenting adults. If a woman is attacked, or, for that matter, anyone is attacked, she certainly isn’t being given a choice. No one chooses to be raped or murdered. If God is willing to permit a malevolent power to impose his will over another, why would it be worse for God to intercede? Either way, someone is having a particular circumstance forced upon them, so why not make it a good one?

Further, he has already impinged upon our free will. I want to fly under my own power as easily as I run. Can I do that? No. Strange how it was considered important for me to have the choice to murder someone, but he did not give me the choice to fly.

This is, of course, omitting all the torture and murder that God commits without people, unless someone wants to argue that cancer and tsunamis have free will.

Yeah, that's the double standard that's central to Christian dogma, which even the most rational of their believers has to ignore if they believe that God is caring.

But that's going away from religion towards sexism.

Sexism that's due to their interpretation of the Qur'an.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

To excuse God’s neglect by saying that God wanted us to make our own choices is to tacitly imply that crimes are committed between consenting adults. If a woman is attacked, or, for that matter, anyone is attacked, she certainly isn’t being given a choice. No one chooses to be raped or murdered.

It's not quite true.
1)No one chooses to be raped or murdered willingly, but no one said about mistakes. If you sin, then you suffer consequences. That may get you raped and murdered... What is even worse you can and will pay for  sins of the others
2) You somehow ignore a right for free will of murderer and rapist
3) Sufferings and death is not the most important God, he cares about immortal soul

Further, he has already impinged upon our free will. I want to fly under my own power as easily as I run.

Free will = right to make own decisions (and face consequences). You are talking about ability to do whatever you want and don't suffer any consequents.

You can use your free will to jump from a roof, will you blame God for your broken legs?

[Scoops Novel]

Ban ranger. He's not actually thinking, but ban him anyway.

[Thecard]

Wait... Did... Did you just say that rape victims are being raped because they're bad people?

Please tell me you did not.

[Dutchling]

Wait... Did... Did you just say that rape victims are being raped because they're bad people?

Please tell me you did not.

He says it's because someone was bad. Not necessarily the one being raped.

Basically, every time you steal something from the cookie jar, you're actually raping that cute girl from Biology class.

[Thecard]

Basically, every time you steal something from the cookie jar, you're actually raping that cute girl from Biology class.

So... I guess that's why she's been glaring at me.  Too many cookies...

Seriously though, UR, I'd really appreciate it if you could try to avoid the topic of rape if necessary.  Just say "killed" instead or something.

[MagmaMcFry]

To excuse God’s neglect by saying that God wanted us to make our own choices is to tacitly imply that crimes are committed between consenting adults. If a woman is attacked, or, for that matter, anyone is attacked, she certainly isn’t being given a choice. No one chooses to be raped or murdered.

It's not quite true.
1)No one chooses to be raped or murdered willingly, but no one said about mistakes. If you sin, then you suffer consequences. That may get you raped and murdered... What is even worse you can and will pay for  sins of the others

So you're saying that God doesn't care who gets punished, as long as somebody gets punished?

2) You somehow ignore a right for free will of murderer and rapist

Now we have two options.
Option 1: The rape is a punishment for somebody's crime (not necessarily the victim's). Then the rapist was somehow forced to do this by higher powers and therefore doesn't have free will.
Option 2: The rape happens because of the rapist's free will. Then it cannot be a punishment, since the rapist could have decided otherwise.
You hold two mutually exclusive worldviews at once. Doesn't that make you wonder?

Option 3: The rape is a punishment for another person's sin, specifically the rapist's sin of raping the victim. Then God has nothing to do with that.

3) Sufferings and death is not the most important God, he cares about immortal soul

What exactly does he care about? Which properties does he like in an immortal soul? How does he strive to make immortal souls have these properties?

EDIT: If you're Thecard, just read "kill" instead of "rape".

[MonkeyHead]

"The immortal soul" appears to suffer when the bag of meat it is contained within goes through unpleasant events. Any God that allows suffering as some kind of test is cruel and not one I wish to belive in.

[Thecard]

McFry, it isn't necessarily the word.  I just find he would have been able to make a much less offensive argument if he used almost any other crime instead.  Mainly because from what I've seen of UR, he doesn't see rape as a big deal.  I could be wrong, but... It gets to the point where I am a little creeped out by him.

[Ukrainian Ranger]

Wait... Did... Did you just say that rape victims are being raped because they're bad people?

Please tell me you did not.

1) If you are a Christian you should admit that there are no good or bad people. Sins are bad, not sinners.

2) I don't know why, but the world is clearly made in a way that people have to pay for the sins of the others. For sins of parents, sins of friend, sins of the nation, sins of the whole humanity.
It's just a law. Like gravity. Every body influence gravitational field of the whole universe. Every sin influence the whole humanity.

3) As awful it sound, in most cases, being raped is a consequence of woman action(s). Her own decisions led to that in some way or another. It's sad, but it is a fact. No I don't say that she have done something to deserve that. I only say that she got a result of her own mistakes.

[MonkeyHead]

UR, just so you know, I have reported that post - the concept that women can be responsible for being raped is disgustingly offensive, and just plain wrong.

[Scoops Novel]

Toady, please don't close the thread. After all, we're going to get it anyway, so we might as well confine it here.

[Thecard]

3) As awful it sound, in most cases, being raped is a consequence of woman action(s). Her own decisions led to that in some way or another. It's sad, but it is a fact. No I don't say that she have done something to deserve that. I only say that she got a result of her own mistakes.

Oh.  Okay.  So you did say it would be her fault.

Y'know, in America we have a saying about rape: the victim is never at fault. 
It is a result of no one's actions but actions of the rapist.