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Author Topic: Adequate DF player cancels DF: asking question on forum  (Read 2170 times)

simonthedwarf

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Adequate DF player cancels DF: asking question on forum
« on: July 31, 2011, 06:40:31 pm »

Bonjour my dwarven friends! All Hail Armok, and stuff.

I have two questions for the legendary +5 DF'ers of the forum.

1) Pit fighting! Goblins are friends with each other. Putting them in a pit won't make them fight. I'm supposed to rectify Pit Peace by dropping angry animals down there, right?

2) WAR! What is it good for? No, actually, what is it good for? It seems much more beneficial to cooperate with the other races because they all bring good trade goods. Elves bring wood for carpentry, bolts and lye-making. They also bring the occascional cool caged creature. Humans and Dwarves bring steel. Conflict with the other civz seems counter-productive from my perspective, mainly because the loot from the creatures you kill is worthless (mostly).

I mean, how many troll fur coats do I need? And it piles up everywhere.
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Crustypeanut

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Re: Adequate DF player cancels DF: asking question on forum
« Reply #1 on: July 31, 2011, 06:57:38 pm »

For Pit fighting, I prefer to use dwarves and goblins.  Its good training, and good training for your doctors if you leave the goblins their weapons.  >:)

As for War.. it is good if you don't have iron in the area you embarked on, since you get loads of goblinite.  And for me, since I've modded sentient creatures to be edible by dwarves, war is more like a harvesting period.. a harvest of blood.  >:) I especially love elves.  They make great boots.

But, in an unmodded game, its generally not smart to piss off the humans (you can't piss off the other dwarves), since they generally bring useful stuff.  Elves on the other hand.. I find it preferable to simply sieze everything they bring.  Maybe use their merchants for target practice.. stuff like that.  I don't mind pissing them off.  They don't bring alot of useful stuff, just cloth, fruit, and wooden weapons and armor, along with the odd large creature. 
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Gergination

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Re: Adequate DF player cancels DF: asking question on forum
« Reply #2 on: July 31, 2011, 07:01:18 pm »

1)  Drop animals or your military down into the arena.  It's good practice.

2)  Many players simply hate elves as they generally bring useless junk such as 30 bins of base quality rope reed cloth and are extremely undwarven.  These elves aren't anything like your typical ones.  Think of them as a bunch of fanatical druids with a questionable stance regarding corpses.

Humans, I got nothing against really, they generally don't bring anything extremely worthwhile but more wood never hurts.

I think probably the main reason people do it is because it feels kind of dwarven to do so.  You don't care what the other races think of you or your fortress and you'll kill anyone that looks at you funny.  It also adds an extra challenge to people or fodder for an elaborate trap they've designed.
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ClkWrkJester

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Re: Adequate DF player cancels DF: asking question on forum
« Reply #3 on: July 31, 2011, 07:22:09 pm »

War is good for a challenge, really. Dwarf Fort just isn't as much fun without constant wars and chaos and death.

Also, the elves are so bloody stuck up it just feels RIGHT to massacre them while laughing.
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Carve out a massive pit and construct a copper block tower! Challenge those goblin bastards with your phallus of justice!

Buttery_Mess

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Re: Adequate DF player cancels DF: asking question on forum
« Reply #4 on: July 31, 2011, 07:31:01 pm »

Elves are really helpful in the early game, when you seem to need lots of wood and cloth for bags. They also help with food and bring seeds for overland crops. In the late game they are more of an annoyance and no trouble for your military, so it's more fun to kill them. Humans are more useful and drop less useful loot. but there's not much for a well-developed (say year ten) fort to do save rack up legendary body counts, so there's that too. A well developed fort has too much stuff; you don't need to trade later on. Sieges are more interesting.
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Crustypeanut

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Re: Adequate DF player cancels DF: asking question on forum
« Reply #5 on: July 31, 2011, 07:33:28 pm »

War is good for a challenge, really. Dwarf Fort just isn't as much fun without constant wars and chaos and death.

Also, the elves are so bloody stuck up it just feels RIGHT to massacre them while laughing.

The Fortress Defense Mod fixes that oh so well.  I just had a group of nightwings OWN my fort.  My militia commander, who was decked in full steel plate, legendary axedwarf + fighter and a few high skills, got wrecked by their macemen.  She had over 100 kills to her name too.  I think the main probably was that she was missing her left arm at the elbow.. oh and most of those kills were after she lost her arm :D
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franti

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Re: Adequate DF player cancels DF: asking question on forum
« Reply #6 on: July 31, 2011, 08:24:41 pm »

Humans bring cool shit like Black Bronze Face Masks and Steel Mauls.
Elves bring bears. BEARS. I had a Bearsplosion once: 50 adult bears, god knows how many cubs.
Be nice to others.
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Oliolli

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Re: Adequate DF player cancels DF: asking question on forum
« Reply #7 on: August 01, 2011, 02:11:49 am »

I had a Bearsplosion once: 50 adult bears, god knows how many cubs.

I had the same situation once... WITH ELEPHANTS!

Not from the elves though, my fort was in a place in which elephants used to live. For some reason I no longer see any of them.
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CriticallyAshamed

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Re: Adequate DF player cancels DF: asking question on forum
« Reply #8 on: August 01, 2011, 05:29:08 am »

I seize elf stuff because I'm a cheap bastard. Kind of depressing when I think about it. Humans are cool though; they're like oversized dwarves without as much talent. Plus they're too much trouble to fight.
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ledgekindred

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Re: Adequate DF player cancels DF: asking question on forum
« Reply #9 on: August 01, 2011, 01:17:43 pm »

1) Pit Fighting - as others have said, make your dwarves fight the goblins.  Put the animal stockpile 3-4 levels above your barracks.  Channel a drop from the animal stockpile to the barracks ceiling and assign it as a pit.  Drag gobbo prisoners over and drop them down to be stunned for a moment before getting dwarf-piled by your military.  Give your military wooden training weapons and imagine the carnage of the equivalent of an unarmed goblin getting beat to death with baseball bats.

2) Trade goods!  You don't have to piss off the humans or elves if you don't want to.  But you piss off the goblins by not being goblins, so they will attempt to slaughter you whenever possible.  Assuming you keep the peace with humans and elves (*spit*) , you can use all those troll fur robes for trade goods and buy out entire caravans of more useful stuff like metals, food, wood and cloth.  Even if you decide to tell the elves and humans to "stuff it" and let them attack, you can ask your liaison to bring all sorts of steel items that you can melt down for weapons and armor yourself that you will be able to afford with several crates worth of cave spider silk socks.

As others have said, though, there's a certain "Dwarfiness" associated with Dwarf Fortress that involves catching goblins in cage traps and pitting them against your fighters for training, pissing off elves by slaughtering the lot of them and cutting down every tree in sight, and chuffing off the humans just for the sake of seeing if you can withstand a human siege.

In Dwarf Fortress, you really can play any way you'd like, but for one reason or another, the community has developed along with the feel of the game such that we very much approve when your dwarves sieze caravans full of useless wooden stuff, drop the elven traders into magma, then piss off the next elven caravan by trying to trade them all the crappy wooden junk you just stole from the last caravan.  And raze the surrounding forests for good measure.

And human sieges are a true trial of dwarven fortitude, since they actually siege and don't just rush your fortress entrance to blunder into all your carefully-planned traps.  If the human diplomat has been in your fort, he knows where all the traps are, so tough luck trying to get the army to stand on them.  Plus, they will sit outside your fort for seasons, not doing anything, until you finally do something to break the siege.

There's no reason to play like that if you don't want though.  There's nothing wrong with building an entirely above-ground fort out of stone so you don't have to clearcut entire forests for the wood to build the little cottages and trade peacefully with everyone you can.  (Goblins will still attack you though.)  Nothing at all.  Nope, nothing horribly, awfully elven (*spit*) about that at all.

And we won't point and make fun of you.

Most of us anyway.

Much.
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I don't understand, though that is about right with anything DF related.
I just hope he dies the same death that all dwarfs deserve: liver disease.
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thegoatgod_pan

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Re: Adequate DF player cancels DF: asking question on forum
« Reply #10 on: August 01, 2011, 01:41:26 pm »

One solution to pit fighting is to bring in goblins and megabeasts--there is no peace between the goblin and forgotten beast. I was once lucky enough to get a cavern with an island in a lake.  Obviously it was used as a natural arena whose primary combatant was an amber scarab beetle with noxious secretions.  He lived in the lake an emerged when I dropped a goblin down.

I never attack elves--they don't put up a fight and you are forced to spend a year disposing of their stupid wooden flutes.  I always kill the human diplomat--humans are all shite anyway and their sieges are fun to dismember. (the light a fire and decide to wait you out, you dig under and pop out underneath them chopping legs and chewing bubblegum.
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Triaxx2

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Re: Adequate DF player cancels DF: asking question on forum
« Reply #11 on: August 01, 2011, 02:15:18 pm »

Dorf boxes make even human sieges pieces of cake. 3x3 box, hollow in the middle, with a roof and raising bridge as a door. Your military can pop out of them into the middle of the human siege, and wipe them out without them being able to see you coming.
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crekit

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Re: Adequate DF player cancels DF: asking question on forum
« Reply #12 on: August 01, 2011, 02:18:24 pm »

2)  Many players simply hate elves as they generally bring useless junk such as 30 bins of base quality rope reed cloth and are extremely undwarven.  These elves aren't anything like your typical ones.  Think of them as a bunch of fanatical druids with a questionable stance regarding corpses.

I find that elves are pretty generic everywhere. Magma is a good generic response to a generic problem.
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He likes gold, native gold, trees that are made of gold, and tungsten. He likes cats for their haunting meows. He needs dwarf fortress to get through the working day. When possible, prefers to consume Potatoes, cheese, cow milk. Absolutely detests elves. And spiders.