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[MetalSlimeHunt]

Kind of like how at L+ animal rights you get canine heroes.

I mentioned this in the main thread, but apparently you don't actually need L+ to recruit Canine Heroes. I was able to bring one into my ranks at C+ Animal Rights.

[Kay12]

You need a lot of heart. I checked it at the source. IIRC 20 is the minimum heart to recruit dogs. Otherwise your Liberal will show inadequate taste when trying to talk to them.

[Servant Corps]

While in the past I think I agreed with the idea of the L+ world looking sane through LCS' eyes, I think we have to start corrupting that world for non-L+ players, or at least make the world more extreme. You could easily view anything utopian/dystopian if you are in the right mindset (the Wiki claimed that L+ pollution regs forces factories to produce sweet-smelling musk due to "zero-tolerance regulations" prohibiting any sort of pollution whatsoever while that L+ Flag Burning laws causes the US flag to be used as fuel) but I think the satire needs to be more blatant, otherwise people will miss the subtext.

It is true that what the LCS advocates are also what real-world left-wing extremist organizations also advocate ("All law enforcements subject to recall" for instance). So the LCS shouldn't be insane. But it does need to be extreme.

EDIT: I am in the process of committing changes in the hopes of fulfilling the goal of making LCS extreme, at least for Women's Rights, Civil Rights, Abortion, Free Speech, and Flag Burning.

EDIT2: Ugh, silksubversion isn't working. Likely for the best. Here's the ideas I had, tear them apart:
Women's Rights: Gender is an obsolete social construct.
Civil Rights: Racial equality is guaranteed and vigorously enforced by Political Correctness Pogroms.
Abortion: The government pays for all abortions, without any exceptions.
Free Speech: Free speech is universally supported through government subsidies.
Flag Burning: Flag-burning is regularly used in political protests.

[Jonathan S. Fox]

While in the past I think I agreed with the idea of the L+ world looking sane through LCS' eyes, I think we have to start corrupting that world for non-L+ players, or at least make the world more extreme. You could easily view anything utopian/dystopian if you are in the right mindset (the Wiki claimed that L+ pollution regs forces factories to produce sweet-smelling musk due to "zero-tolerance regulations" prohibiting any sort of pollution whatsoever while that L+ Flag Burning laws causes the US flag to be used as fuel) but I think the satire needs to be more blatant, otherwise people will miss the subtext.

It is true that what the LCS advocates are also what real-world left-wing extremist organizations also advocate ("All law enforcements subject to recall" for instance). So the LCS shouldn't be insane. But it does need to be extreme.

EDIT: I am in the process of committing changes in the hopes of fulfilling the goal of making LCS extreme, at least for Women's Rights, Civil Rights, Abortion, Free Speech, and Flag Burning.

EDIT2: Ugh, silksubversion isn't working. Likely for the best. Here's the ideas I had, tear them apart:
Women's Rights: Gender is an obsolete social construct.
Civil Rights: Racial equality is guaranteed and vigorously enforced by Political Correctness Pogroms.
Abortion: The government pays for all abortions, without any exceptions.
Free Speech: Free speech is universally supported through government subsidies.
Flag Burning: Flag-burning is regularly used in political protests.

Psychonauts is a great game. Early in development, it was about a crazy ostrich. Tim Schafer loved it. You had one control stick to move, another to peck. Your abilities came from being mentally imbalanced and having multiple personalities. But Psychonauts isn't about a crazy ostrich because nobody wants to be an insane ostrich. You want to be heroes. Even the later GTA games portray your murdering main character as the most balanced and good character around, someone just trying to get by, someone who tried to reject violence before getting drawn into it by circumstance and loyalty to family and friends.

There is little to no satire of the Liberal Agenda because the Liberal Agenda isn't being satirized. It's not that it's too subtle and hard to notice; it simply isn't there. This game is a Liberal fever dream. It's about frustrated Liberals getting to go out there, throw away their principles, and FORCE people to see their ways. If you change the goals, if you "corrupt the world" so that the win condition isn't likable, you undermine that. It would be about... what? People pursuing made-up goals with ridiculous methods? That's not wish fulfillment for frustrated Dennis Kucinich Liberals anymore, and it's not wish fulfillment for Conservatives either.

Hypocrisy. Naivety. That's the serious criticism of the LCS. The game almost never makes this specifically known. The overt digs against the left are all light-hearted humor. The heavy stuff happens when you walk away from the game knowing this would never work, and the LCS is delusional. The game doesn't have to acquit itself by reminding the player that it knows this. In fact, the game doesn't have to know that at all. It can be 200% on the side of the LCS. The satire will still work, because nobody in their right mind, including the players of the game, want people gunned down in the street because of their political views.

Please don't make changes to the tone of Elite Liberal issues. If you're worried that some people won't get that the game isn't meant to be taken seriously, just add the Bay12Games disclaimer as a splash screen.

[Servant Corps]

No changes will be made then.

[Lenin_Cat]

What if LCS members could rum for president? 

It could open a whole new window of gameplay, from proposing bills to pardoning Liberals from Conservative Warrants.

[Bdthemag]

What if LCS members could rum for president? 

It could open a whole new window of gameplay, from proposing bills to pardoning Liberals from Conservative Warrants.

This, but they'd have to have alot of heart and a hell of alot of persuasion. Or just alot of liberals.

[Kay12]

I can't say I haven't thought about it, but something I've been pondering about is what does the Liberal party (particularly the Ultraprogressive L+ wing) think of LCS? Are they heroes? People with the right ends but horrible means? Just another angry mob?

[MetalSlimeHunt]

I don't think we can really know. The Progressive Elite Social Liberal Party are everything the LCS loves and wants for the USA, so even if they issued daily statements of condemnations against the LCS they'd still rationalize it away somehow. That said, the ideals of the PESLP are opposed to how the LCS generally acts. The LCS actually does a lot of stuff that the Arch-Conservatives want to do. There's:

Killing people for being Conservative. (Free Speech)
"Enlightenment". (Human Rights)
Being armed to the teeth. (Gun Laws)
Prostitution. (Women's Rights [Sometimes])
Stealing and publishing people's secrets. (Privacy Rights)
Working their members to the bone. (Labor Laws)

[Kay12]

Yeah, that's the sweet irony of it. An example that is repeated quite often on this very forum: You shoot up a radio station in the name of free speech. You also install sleepers at various locations, a particularly nasty case being the Court House where you replace Conservative Corrupt Judges with Liberal Indoctrinated ones!

Think about what the judges do when they're advocating Liberalism. Maybe they're influencing obviously wrong death sentences to raise public concern, or something like that.

Could be because of the game's perspective, but I never saw LCS actually hurting their own in any way. From an objective viewpoint, the LCS may run a sweatshop, but for some reason I just think they're making those T-shirts for fun, maybe a bit of profit too.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

These are still people going out all day every day to raise money for the LCS. That can't be easy on them, juice or no juice.

[jasonred79]

Somewhat offtopic: My personal election reform system (IRL) would include that everyone who wants to vote should pass some exam of basic political knowledge. We had a survey here in Finland a few months ago that showed that Finns who know which are the 4 parties in the government and the 4 ones in the opposition are actually a minority.

LOL. Why not go one step further and insist that the CANDIDATES have to pass an aptitude test? (But that would end Sarah Palin's political career!)

Or go several steps further and abolish voting entirely! We'll follow ancient China and all government posts will be determined by sitting for an exam!

[Kay12]

^ We would need that here in Finland. One of our fresh MPs has received a lot of attention from the media because of his CONSERVATIVE immigration opinions. Well, mainly the backwards language associated with them, particularly using the word "nigger" which, I think, is way more offensive in America than in Finland but still has been considered rude for over 20 years. "I didn't know it was offensive, I live in the countryside!" he said, also angering the rural population. As the MP has not even finished comprehensive school, my 15-year old little brother has outstudied him. Curse you, Victor D'Hondt!

</rant>


LCS is guilty of most of the same crimes as the Conservatives. They have people work on them, have child workers and combatants, kill people to advance a political agenda...

I guess it's the same thing as in GTA, to once again compare LCS with another game where the good guys are, by most standards, bad. It's the subtle differences that make up a good GTA gangster and a bad one. Both kill people, innocent or otherwise, fight the cops and corrupt the justices. But the good gangsters never backstab their friends. The good gangsters are, except in tight spots, laid-back and friendly. The good gangsters have concerns other than wealth. Values, even!

[Elodie Hiras]

That said, the ideals of the PESLP are opposed to how the LCS generally acts. The LCS actually does a lot of stuff that the Arch-Conservatives want to do. There's:

Killing people for being Conservative. (Free Speech)
"Enlightenment". (Human Rights)
Being armed to the teeth. (Gun Laws)
Prostitution. (Women's Rights [Sometimes])
Stealing and publishing people's secrets. (Privacy Rights)
Working their members to the bone. (Labor Laws)

Depends on who plays the game, and some plain don't count.
Killing people for being conservative? What about pacifist runs?
Enlightenment? Possible to go through the game without it.
Being armed to the teeth? Pacifist/Melee run (melee weapons are still legal at L+ gun control laxs.)
Prostitution? You live without it without any problems.
Stealing and publishing people's corporate/police/justice/radio/TV/CIA/research secrets? That's not personnal datas. The COE documents might count, but most of the times, they blur the line between personnal data and professional ones.
Working their members to the bone? I always thought LCS members have decent living conditions. If not, they would lose juice.

[Kay12]

LCS in general does a lot of things they criticize the Conservatives for doing, but the sweet irony of it is intentional.