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[LemonFrosted]

I dont think DF has a very steep learning curve. Apart from UI, for lots of things, one can use his head (and Google search... or wiki) to solve things out. The challenge of survival depends mostly of the embark's position, I think, and much less of knowing how the game mechanics work beyond the basics. Building a Fort that can produce everything it needs for its citizens to live, and then seal off the exits, is not too difficult. That is, if you dont want it to be difficult.

I think there are lots of simulators and strategy games (and I dont mean "real time "strategies""..) that are much more difficult to learn and become good at. In DF, the player decides the challenges he wants to take on. Usually at least! 

"I don't think DF has a steep learning curve, you just need to figure out a good place to embark which requires knowing what things make a good embark in terms of terrain, surroundings, stone layers, supplies, dwarf skills. And then you have to figure out how to build things, which isn't THAT hard, aside from workshops, walls, and digging being handled separately. Then you need to know what to build and where to build it and why your dwarves are starving and they're thirsty but there's water right there WHAT'S WRONG WITH YOU ASSHOLES?! DRINK THE WATER! WHY IS THERE NO FOOD LEFT? I MADE A FARM! PLANT ON THE F***ING FARM!"

All in al I agree. DF is not that hard to learn once you've learnt it.

[lanceleoghauni]

I never had a problem with the ASCII. I thought it was a very clean and intuitive interface.

[Internet Kraken]

But I love the ASCII graphics!  And I can make sense of them, it just takes an hour of paying attention and liberal ue of [k].

I've never understood why people think the ASCII graphics make DF hard to learn. They're not really that ugly. And unlike many tilesets I've seen, they're nice and simple as well. Most tilesets put to much detail into each little sprite. That sounds good in theory, but the result of everything being so detailed is that it looks cluttered and messy. ASCII doesn't have that problem.

The graphics aren't what make DF hard to learn. It's hard to learn because it is a bloated, unoptimized, glitchy mess of a game. Tilesets don't solve that problem.

[gtmattz]

The main thing that I, personally, cannot stand about the default tiles is that THEY ARE FREAKING RECTANGLES!!

Other than that, I can play with ASCII just fine (and at times, do so, with a SQUARE ascii tileset from the wiki of course), I just happen to prefer my trees to look like trees and what not so use a graphics pack.

[LemonFrosted]

The main thing that I, personally, cannot stand about the default tiles is that THEY ARE FREAKING RECTANGLES!!

This si the big reason I use a graphics pack. My rooms were always ending up 4x3 so they'd be square on my screen.

[nbonaparte]

The main thing that I, personally, cannot stand about the default tiles is that THEY ARE FREAKING RECTANGLES!!

This si the big reason I use a graphics pack. My rooms were always ending up 4x3 so they'd be square on my screen.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

[WINDOWEDX:80]
[WINDOWEDY:25]
[FONT:curses_square_16x16.png]

[FULLSCREENX:0]
[FULLSCREENY:0]
[FULLFONT:curses_square_16x16.png]

[LemonFrosted]

The main thing that I, personally, cannot stand about the default tiles is that THEY ARE FREAKING RECTANGLES!!

This si the big reason I use a graphics pack. My rooms were always ending up 4x3 so they'd be square on my screen.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

[WINDOWEDX:80]
[WINDOWEDY:25]
[FONT:curses_square_16x16.png]

[FULLSCREENX:0]
[FULLSCREENY:0]
[FULLFONT:curses_square_16x16.png]

That font looks seriously weird.

[krenshala]

The main thing that I, personally, cannot stand about the default tiles is that THEY ARE FREAKING RECTANGLES!!

This si the big reason I use a graphics pack. My rooms were always ending up 4x3 so they'd be square on my screen.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

[WINDOWEDX:80]
[WINDOWEDY:25]
[FONT:curses_square_16x16.png]

[FULLSCREENX:0]
[FULLSCREENY:0]
[FULLFONT:curses_square_16x16.png]

That font looks seriously weird.

There is a reason its known as the 'curses' font. 

[geoduck]

I've never understood why people think the ASCII graphics make DF hard to learn. They're not really that ugly. And unlike many tilesets I've seen, they're nice and simple as well. Most tilesets put to much detail into each little sprite. That sounds good in theory, but the result of everything being so detailed is that it looks cluttered and messy. ASCII doesn't have that problem.

That's why I made my tileset (see below); the ASCII was too abstract, and most sets lard on too many details.

[Crifmer]

"I don't think DF has a steep learning curve, you just need to figure out a good place to embark which requires knowing what things make a good embark in terms of terrain, surroundings, stone layers, supplies, dwarf skills. And then you have to figure out how to build things, which isn't THAT hard, aside from workshops, walls, and digging being handled separately. Then you need to know what to build and where to build it and why your dwarves are starving and they're thirsty but there's water right there WHAT'S WRONG WITH YOU ASSHOLES?! DRINK THE WATER! WHY IS THERE NO FOOD LEFT? I MADE A FARM! PLANT ON THE F***ING FARM!"

All in al I agree. DF is not that hard to learn once you've learnt it.

This is EXACTLY what I went through my first time playing, even after watching all the wonderful tutorials on YouTube.  I love it.

I've got three forts going currently, and each one benefits from what I learn as I play the others... which means a lot of rebuilding.  But like Skelodwarf said below, it's more like a never-ending curve.  You just keep learning.

Now I know enough to know that I don't really know what makes a good embark, so I just do what I think is good enough and hope for the best.  Part of the fun for me is figuring out how to make do with what you've got rather than looking for that perfect embark location.

But man... once you hit that first plateau - "Hey, this game isn't actually that hard... I've got this... WHAT THE HELL JUST HAPPENED?!?!?!?!?" - that's when the real fun starts.

[Emily]

Honestly, a lot of games have the same sort of learning curve as dwarf fortress.  ASCII graphics don't help matters much, especially with no prior roguelike experience, but if you get used to using L and possibly a graphical tileset that largely goes away.

The real reason it seems hard is because there's no ingame help--or what there is is more or less useless--and there's no tutorial.  A game like Civilization is really pretty much just as complicated if you aren't allowed to look at the help files.  With the wiki and video tutorials or the like, it became pretty simple for me.  (The worst that happened in my first fort was a kobold stole some stuff and stabbed a dog, I accidentally flooded a small section of the fort that I wasn't using, and a miner killed himself by channeling off the ledge he was standing on and causing a cave-in.  And then I decided to try a different site and abandoned.)

(There's also the fact that almost every first person shooter is really pretty much a variant on the same game, so like, all the controls you'll know going into the game.  Which means the first and probably steepest section of the learning curve you've already shaved off.)