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Author Topic: Secret copyright treaty leaked. It's not good.  (Read 39733 times)

alway

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Re: Secret copyright treaty leaked. It's not good.
« Reply #210 on: January 25, 2012, 11:14:24 pm »

The lack of coverage is intentional. In the US  the existence of ACTA was classified top secret for the longest time.
Or for more clarification:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Counterfeiting_Trade_Agreement
Quote
United States
Both the Bush administration and the Obama administration had rejected requests to make the text of ACTA public, with the White House saying that disclosure would cause "damage to the national security."[91] In 2009, Knowledge Ecology International filed a FOIA (Freedom of Information Act) request in the United States, but their entire request was denied. The Office of the United States Trade Representative's Freedom of Information office stated the request was withheld for being material "properly classified in the interest of national security."[92] US Senators Bernie Sanders (I-VT) and Sherrod Brown (D-OH) penned a letter on 23 November 2009, asking the United States Trade Representative to make the text of the ACTA public.

Apparently it's a state secret, so I guess if the terreris's got hold of it, they could turn it into a dirty bomb... or something. ಠ_ಠ
« Last Edit: January 25, 2012, 11:17:38 pm by alway »
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King DZA

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Re: Secret copyright treaty leaked. It's not good.
« Reply #211 on: January 25, 2012, 11:20:02 pm »

Has anyone told you your continued role playing of this Character you pretend to be even during serious subjects is a tad annoying?

I save my roleplaying for the board dedicated to such a thing, thank you very much.

Or did you mean my seemingly exaggerated, egotistical, and deluded perception of how amazing I am? If so, I could certainly try toning it down a bit, but that would be a bit like lying.

This is definitely a serious subject, and I intend to fully treat it as such. So, it would be appreciated if you could keep your personal opinions about me out of it, especially considering just how little you know about me to begin with.

Luke_Prowler

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Re: Secret copyright treaty leaked. It's not good.
« Reply #212 on: January 25, 2012, 11:20:32 pm »

Well ACTA is a treaty, right? Then SOPA/PIPA was mearly an attempt to enforce it, which failed and we can give resistance to any other attempt anywhere else

Until something fundamental changes, this means making a massive push every few months for the foreseeable future to remind everyone in our government that we'll make hell if they actually do something like this.  We fail once, and it's time to make good on that threat.  If we fail to make good on the threat, then we've simply lost.

Personally, I don't think there's enough attention span in the public to fend this off forever.  The law will come down on the internet eventually, and our reaction at that point will be what determines the final outcome.
Oh ye, of little faith. Politicians are people too (though you personally seem to think them of some kind of black monolithic entity), therefore they will take the path of least resistance. They not going to risk getting kicked out of their money train by being hated.
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Nadaka

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Re: Secret copyright treaty leaked. It's not good.
« Reply #213 on: January 25, 2012, 11:21:07 pm »

Well ACTA is a treaty, right? Then SOPA/PIPA was mearly an attempt to enforce it, which failed and we can give resistance to any other attempt anywhere else

Partially, ACTA is also the lock that (in the US anyway) would prevent SOPA/PIPA from being ruled unconstitutional or revoked by congress. Once the law is passed, ACTA comes into effect, then the law that brings it into effect can not be removed. It is probably even protected from a constitutional amendments intended to remove it. That is how deeply it goes, that is how serious it is. It completely subverts the intent of democracy and good governance.
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darkrider2

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Re: Secret copyright treaty leaked. It's not good.
« Reply #214 on: January 25, 2012, 11:37:58 pm »

In general most laws are almost impossible to remove unless it comes before the supreme court and gets redefined, which don't happen often.
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Nadaka

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Re: Secret copyright treaty leaked. It's not good.
« Reply #215 on: January 25, 2012, 11:42:45 pm »

In general most laws are almost impossible to remove unless it comes before the supreme court and gets redefined, which don't happen often.

Congress can submit a law that rewrites the previous law, the supreme court can strike down a law as unconstitutional. The constitution can be changed to invalidate a law.

With ACTA in place, SOPA/PIPA are immune to all of those because in the US treaties supersede the constitution.
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SalmonGod

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Re: Secret copyright treaty leaked. It's not good.
« Reply #216 on: January 25, 2012, 11:44:47 pm »

To put this in perspective, I've been paying attention to internet freedom issues for a long time now.  I've been watching it very closely since the height of the RIAA's frivolous lawsuit spree against thousands of random people for downloading music.  Since just before ACTA, I've been on various activist groups e-mail lists.  For at least four years now, I've been getting a few e-mails a week on the subject, and every few months they will come in flurries of several e-mails a day.  There's always new timetables on renewed legislative pushes to kill the internet spurred by lobbyists.  This has been going on non-stop for a long time now.  I'm fucking burned out on it.  I don't even read the e-mails anymore.  I just know that it's ongoing, and every once in a while I'll click a petition link. 

The issue got a huge public spotlight this year, but I can already tell that people are starting to look away.  Most people think that SOPA is a recent thing.  It reared its ugly head and it was slain by the scorn of the internet masses.  Hooray. 

What they don't understand is that our government is swarming with people for whom it is literally their full-time very-well-paying job to push this stuff.  Most people go to work every day to serve food or clean buildings or design products or operate machinery.  They read about this stuff at home on their free time, or when they should be working (like me).  It's unfathomable to most people to imagine there are people who go to work to  look for weaknesses in public opinion and the integrity of congressman and senators (if they aren't themselves congressman and senators) to exploit so they can push through laws that destroy our freedoms for the benefit of their employers.  All day.  Every day. 

We are going to constantly be in danger until we do something to change this.
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mcclay

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Re: Secret copyright treaty leaked. It's not good.
« Reply #217 on: January 25, 2012, 11:47:06 pm »

Ohhhhh fuck, who wants to join an information summgling business with me. We'll deal primarly in hard drives, CD's and floppy discs.
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SalmonGod

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Re: Secret copyright treaty leaked. It's not good.
« Reply #218 on: January 25, 2012, 11:55:12 pm »

One thing to note:  There have been pushes now and then for an Internet Bill of Rights.  There are several various drafts out there.  The idea has been around for almost 15 years.  If it were ever an idea to take seriously, now would be the time.  It wouldn't be a final answer to the problem, but it would be an extra line of defense.  Instead of clawing directly at the heart of the internet, there would be an outer shell they'd have to chip away first, the same way they're doing with those rights that we wrote for ourselves in meatspace.
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In the land of twilight, under the moon
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In the land of twilight

Maybe people should love for the sake of loving, and not with all of these optimization conditions.

Angel Of Death

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Re: Secret copyright treaty leaked. It's not good.
« Reply #219 on: January 25, 2012, 11:58:15 pm »

Oh, fuck me. Not again. The internet's fucked if this gets in  :'(
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mcclay

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Re: Secret copyright treaty leaked. It's not good.
« Reply #220 on: January 26, 2012, 12:04:33 am »

Ohhhhh fuck, who wants to join an information summgling business with me. We'll deal primarly in hard drives, CD's and floppy discs.
I was being fucking serious about this, now who wants to help me or do  have to get my IRL friends to do it with me?
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SalmonGod

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Re: Secret copyright treaty leaked. It's not good.
« Reply #221 on: January 26, 2012, 12:10:43 am »

If things get that bad, I'll just boycott everything that isn't offered under some alternative copyright license.  The biggest distribution channels for such material might get torn down, but there still won't be any legal grounds to prevent people from making their own content from scratch and offering it for free... and I would expect the number of people doing that to increase.
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Powder Miner

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Re: Secret copyright treaty leaked. It's not good.
« Reply #222 on: January 26, 2012, 12:55:21 am »

... ... ...
Oh God. This is unconstitutional in so many ways. Then again with the laws being passed nowadays unconstitutionality is nothing new but what the h!@# is this?! This is just friggin moronic. And to think we introduced this? God. Libertarian Rage mode.
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Luke_Prowler

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Re: Secret copyright treaty leaked. It's not good.
« Reply #223 on: January 26, 2012, 12:56:57 am »

One thing to note:  There have been pushes now and then for an Internet Bill of Rights.  There are several various drafts out there.  The idea has been around for almost 15 years.  If it were ever an idea to take seriously, now would be the time.  It wouldn't be a final answer to the problem, but it would be an extra line of defense.  Instead of clawing directly at the heart of the internet, there would be an outer shell they'd have to chip away first, the same way they're doing with those rights that we wrote for ourselves in meatspace.
Hmm. Would it actually be possible to have the internet be legally considered a nation?
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Max White

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Re: Secret copyright treaty leaked. It's not good.
« Reply #224 on: January 26, 2012, 12:59:55 am »

I don't think that is possible...
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