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[kaijyuu]

*quote pyramid*

This sort of thing really depends on context. If the RTS in question has an unironic depiction of a "righteous" ethnic faction violently obliterating an "evil" ethnic faction to prove their superiority, then yeah there's problems here. If there IS intended irony, then there's not (except maybe being heavy handed and obvious with its message).


I played Grand Theft Auto 3 and enjoyed it (though I didn't play any of the games after that since they all felt samey). The game never depicted the murder sprees and crime in a positive light, though. I played as a crazy mass murderer and critically, both the game and player knew it.

[Yoink]

I whole-heartedly approve of violent power fantasies.
Whichever way you look at it, they mean violent-type-people have less reason to enact such "violent power fantasies" in real life.

[misko27]

Spoiler:  Best pickup line ever! (click to show/hide)

Oh Lord that is wonderful. I would love to see that asked in real life.

Spoiler:  Best pickup line ever! (click to show/hide)

North Korea.

Beat me to it. Damn it.

And that is the perfect comeback.

I whole-heartedly approve of violent power fantasies.
Whichever way you look at it, they mean violent-type-people have less reason to enact such "violent power fantasies" in real life.

I am going to go and support this.

[Akura]

Today seems like a good day for physical activity. Managed to ride my bicycle much harder than normal, and it feels great.

...It is a good thing if your heart's beating fairly hard but doesn't hurt in the slightest, right?

Spoiler:  Best pickup line ever! (click to show/hide)

I want to try this on my girl... but then again I actually want to go out with her.

[Yoink]

I remember watching a friend of mine once use an amusingly meta pickup line: "What's the worst pick-up line you've ever heard?"
Unfortunately, the girl he chose to use it on didn't really speak English, and the whole thing fell hilariously flat.

[Frumple]

And power fantasies are pretty disgusting, particularly violent ones. That's a level of immaturity we should be trying to move away from, not foster.

I'd pretty strongly contest both those statements. Power fantasies include pretty close to every bloody video game that's ever existed -- almost anything that exceeds the limits of the human body, and even more specifically the current capabilities of the individual player, falls under that purview to some degree. I would say, very strongly, that there is absolutely nothing disgusting about wanting to experience, even at the fairly distant level that games allow, more than one is capable of -- to want to have power, even by proxy, and exercise it. The violence porn that characterizes certain genres could be labeled as disgusting, sure, but stuff like freaking ToME? Mario? The brush strokes of that statement is entirely too broad.

And immaturity definitely isn't the word I'd use to describe an enjoyment of power fantasies. Immaturity comes from letting some of the themes involved with them influence other action, not the enjoyment itself. Level of maturity doesn't have a bloody thing to do with what is or isn't enjoyable. What is fun at five is fun at fifty, physical limitations and potentially moral considerations notwithstanding. If "maturity" shrinks what you're capable of enjoying instead of expanding it, something has gone wrong.

[MagmaMcFry]

Wait a moment, are you claiming that power fantasies are a thing we should move away from? On the Bay12 forums, of all the places to do so? If the upper boards ever hear of this, they will happily mod in a race of scrivers and make alcoholic midgets pour magma on them forever.

[Mictlantecuhtli]

Wait a moment, are you claiming that power fantasies are a thing we should move away from? On the Bay12 forums, of all the places to do so? If the upper boards ever hear of this, they will happily mod in a race of scrivers and make alcoholic midgets pour magma on them forever capture them in increasingly sadistic ways to harvest for their prized horns

[Bauglir]

Material value 20!? Lets get these automated butcheries fucking started, people. There's gold in them thar horns!

[SomeStupidGuy]

And power fantasies are pretty disgusting, particularly violent ones. That's a level of immaturity we should be trying to move away from, not foster.

I'd pretty strongly contest both those statements. Power fantasies include pretty close to every bloody video game that's ever existed -- almost anything that exceeds the limits of the human body, and even more specifically the current capabilities of the individual player, falls under that purview to some degree. I would say, very strongly, that there is absolutely nothing disgusting about wanting to experience, even at the fairly distant level that games allow, more than one is capable of -- to want to have power, even by proxy, and exercise it. The violence porn that characterizes certain genres could be labeled as disgusting, sure, but stuff like freaking ToME? Mario? The brush strokes of that statement is entirely too broad.

And immaturity definitely isn't the word I'd use to describe an enjoyment of power fantasies. Immaturity comes from letting some of the themes involved with them influence other action, not the enjoyment itself. Level of maturity doesn't have a bloody thing to do with what is or isn't enjoyable. What is fun at five is fun at fifty, physical limitations and potentially moral considerations notwithstanding. If "maturity" shrinks what you're capable of enjoying instead of expanding it, something has gone wrong.

Spot on, Frumple. Power fantasies aren't inherently a bad thing, even if they're not portrayed in an especially moral light.
And yeah, there're few video games that aren't a pow- wait I'm pretty much just restating what Frumple said.
Onto stuff that hasn't already been said...
Really, though, what we need to do, isn't get rid of the more questionable power fantasies(such as CoD or other games where you murderate piles of faceless mooks) - we can and should keep them around - but introduce more games that make people acknowledge the unpleasant parts of these. Games like, as others have mentioned, Spec Ops: The Line and hell, even some of the CoD games have acknowledged this. The first MW game had some rather hard-hitting moments in that vein.
We shouldn't be generally eliminating things based on the arguably negative content, we should encourage more people to think and reflect on these instead.
So... uh, yeah. Er... feel free to tell me if my opinions are dumb...

[Descan]

I'm pretty sure by "faceless mooks" kaikai meant the practice of hiding peoples' faces behind masks or full helmets when they're "evil" mooks to dehumanise them and make the viewer not feel conflicted when the "hero" mows down person after person wihout guilt or even reflection. It's even more grating in modern movies as "heroes" can cause any destruction that would logically kill and injure dozens or hundreds of people but it doesn't matter because it's happening off screen.

It's particularly hilarious when the hero then spares the head villains life, because "I won't stoop to your level!"

Nevermind the thousands of guys you just killed to GET here, who were probably just doing a job to support their families. No, they don't deserve to live, but the actually-probably evil guy totally does.

Good job.

[alway]

It's particularly hilarious when the hero then spares the head villains life, because "I won't stoop to your level!"

Nevermind the thousands of guys you just killed to GET here, who were probably just doing a job to support their families. No, they don't deserve to live, but the actually-probably evil guy totally does.

Good job.

So much this. A really heinous example of this exists in the attempted Wonder Woman TV reboot that (mercifully) got shut down before it was ever aired. (The footage of the pilot was leaked online or something, and was reviewed by SFDebris.)

The main character breaks into a facility, then literally impales a terrified security guard through the throat with a steel pipe.

[Gunner-Chan]

You know guys, I don't see how his discussion is even on topic anymore. I'd drop it and move it to another topic if it's really that important to keep discussing, which... Honestly it isn't.

[SealyStar]

Now, beating the game will depend on how I play to Ivy League politicians who think a gun is something you hang over your mantlepiece to be occasionally dusted by the maid in your Connecticut summer home. And, when it comes to that point in the game where this panel demands the truth (and says they're "entitled" to the truth) I want a little drop-down menu that will let me tell them that they, in fact, can't handle the truth.

With a couple of clicks (or maybe a hotkey), I'll tell them that we live in a world that has walls and that those walls have to be guarded by men with guns. I will tell them that I have a greater responsibility than they can possibly fathom. They weep for mistreated prisoners and curse the military. They have that luxury. They have the luxury of not knowing what I know, that the naked human pyramid and homoerotic torture, while tragic, probably saved lives. And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to them, saves lives.

I'll tell them that they don't want the truth, because deep down, in places they don't talk about at parties, they want me on that wall. They need me on that wall. I'll tell them that I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to men who rise and sleep under the blanket of the very freedom I provide, then question the manner in which I provide it.

I'd rather they just said "thank you" and went on their way. Otherwise, I'd suggest they pick up a weapon and stand a post. Either way, I don't give a damn what they think they're entitled to.

This made me laugh uncontrollably.



Like, seriously, hahahah

14. I want fat, left-wing documentarians carefully editing the only the most incriminating footage, countered only by low-IQ country music singers crooning my praises while in American flag-colored cowboy hats.

[Flying Dice]

This might be giving up information on my location, but totes worth. Going to see Bill Nye speak, so hyped for it.