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[EuchreJack]

Thanks for the insight on scum!Toonyman.  100% agree.

[Jim Groovester]

would gladly take your bet to just Emperor NQT right on the spot now.

I wouldn't call it a bet, but, all right, anyone else willing to go for it?

I want to give FallacyofUrist's setup an honest shot but if we do get to Day 4 I doubt I vote anybody else besides notquitethere.

We could always just nominate me and declare me emperor as the compromise candidate.

I don't think this would lose the game for town.

If you want to know, that's precisely why I lied about being in a Sect. I understand that my being nominated turns the election into a two-person race, and not in a good way, so I have to rely on other people being able to be read better than me. Also, I'm trying to be a bit more malleable in my reading process, so it's a good challenge. If anyone thinks that's scummy, eh, whatever, don't vote for me then. But, if you think I am Town, ALSO don't vote for me. I am not going to be selected, and I will dilute the pool, and the chance of NQT and the other person being Onyx is nonzero (though, admittedly, pretty low), which basically fucks Town.

Couldn't you just say that instead of playing stupid mind games?

'NOOOOOO you don't understand I HAVE to DECEIVE in situations where being straightforward would work JUST as WELL'

2. They voted for Web end of D1:

What's wrong with voting for Web? I mean, I wouldn't, but come on, you didn't believe his weird sects thing, right?

I did actually believe his claim because I'm dumb. At the time it made sense to me that he was likely with Roden.

I believed it as well because I didn't have a reason to suspect that he was being deceptive.

'HAHA I said something perfectly reasonable that was ACTUALLY A LIE and EVERYONE believed it HAHA what a bunch of fucking morons'

EuchreJack's position on Toony doesn't seem to be well reasoned. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it was me who initiated voting for him today! How is that him jockeying?

Either this is a mistaken line of enquiry, or Jack is actually just scum.

NQT, I believe today may have revealed the Onyx team is Jack/Roden and either Egan or Max. Most likely Egan.

As aggravating as EuchreJack's reasoning (always) is giving absolutely abhorrent reads that aren't consistent with reads he may have made not even half an hour earlier is Signature Flavor town EuchreJack.

Speaking of work, I'm kind of swamped with a project this week so I'm not confident I can give a detailed explanation tonight of why I believe Jack and Roden are scum. I will try to at least have something tomorrow when I'm on a computer that doesn't block bay12forums...

I'm looking forward to this even though I don't agree with your read.

Toony's doing that scum thing again where he scrambles to change the status quo near the end of the day phase so that people panic and change up their vote without thinking it through.

Toony why did you wait until now to scum read me? Your reads in general seemed to line up with what other people were thinking, but now have taken a sharp turn with little explanation for it.

I'm wondering at this point if you want Knightwing nominated just because you know he's unlikely to amass votes in the election. If a Cabal member gets nominated, that's one less person to have to compete with for votes on Day 4.

Is there some recent example you're thinking of where he did this?

[webadict]

@Jim: It's actually harder to name a recent game where Toony doesn't do this as scum. Temple Mafia is the most obvious example, but it is a common tactic he employs. I can link when I'm not pfp half asleep.

Oh, and the lying thing is because... I don't have a good reason. It's just easier to defend if no one thinks about why too hard. Being roundabout is how I rationalize decisions without having to distract from more important matters, probably.

[FallacyofUrist]

@Fallacy: Can we get a poke on reina and Egan_BW? Having missing players only hurts us.

Sure thing. Sending pokes now.

[Knightwing64]

Eh, I’m not feeling Roden.

Knightwing64


Last game I was in with Roden they acted different when they were town, and the way Web has been driving this whole game puts a bad taste in the my mouth. Not only that, Web is normally less serious as town.

 Like, when he’s town you seriously suspect that he’s scum just because of how he acts. He hasn’t been doing that this game which is weird.

Just my two cents.

[webadict]

Knightwing, pick two more candidates that don't include you.

[webadict]

Last game I was in with Roden they acted different when they were town, and the way Web has been driving this whole game puts a bad taste in the my mouth. Not only that, Web is normally less serious as town.

 Like, when he’s town you seriously suspect that he’s scum just because of how he acts. He hasn’t been doing that this game which is weird.

Just my two cents.

Ah yes, the scumteam is simultaneously me, Roden, and I assume implicitly Jack and whatever else you want it to be.

Roden acted differently as Town? Differently how? How has your opinion of me changed through the game, since at one point you voted for me? Why not explain instead of vague illusions at the end of the Day to justify a self-vote in an attempt to get yourself nominated. I am ready for your answers to these and my previous question, but I am unlikely to get any because of school.

[webadict]

@Jim: Totem Mafia 3

This is the most blatant example. I could find a few more, if you like. How about the last King game where he shifted to me in the last day?

[ToonyMan]

Toony's doing that scum thing again where he scrambles to change the status quo near the end of the day phase so that people panic and change up their vote without thinking it through.

Toony why did you wait until now to scum read me? Your reads in general seemed to line up with what other people were thinking, but now have taken a sharp turn with little explanation for it.

I'm wondering at this point if you want Knightwing nominated just because you know he's unlikely to amass votes in the election. If a Cabal member gets nominated, that's one less person to have to compete with for votes on Day 4.

I disagree with your nomination. Flabbergasted "WTFs" and "huhs??" don't count as a defense.

Explain to me how my reads have taken a sharp turn.

@Jim: It's actually harder to name a recent game where Toony doesn't do this as scum. Temple Mafia is the most obvious example, but it is a common tactic he employs. I can link when I'm not pfp half asleep.

Oh, and the lying thing is because... I don't have a good reason. It's just easier to defend if no one thinks about why too hard. Being roundabout is how I rationalize decisions without having to distract from more important matters, probably.

How is this the same?

Why do you trust Roden?

[ToonyMan]

I'm multitasking on a phone so I can't be as elaborate as I want, but I want to say something at least. Some of these are repeats because I wish to say them again.

1. Roden admitted to lurking on purpose and nobody called him scum for it (except Knightwing, which everyone ignored).
2. Jack wants Roden and Max elected, but doesn't want Max to be Emperor should a D4 pass, which is a strange strategy.
3. Jack claims they voted me on D2 to find my true nature, but they were harping how I was desperate for candidacy before D2 even started. And like NQT points out their accusations of me are erroneous if you actually read D2, I didn't push for my candidacy. I've shot down Jack's slander constantly this game.
4. Jack convinced Jim to vote himself on D1, which then Egan joined as well. NQT points out right after how suspicious this looks and it ruins Jim's candidacy chances. I think this was intentional. Egan hasn't been involved on D2, but Jack pulled a similar stunt on me D2. I think it's actually quite a smart strategy.

I feel that Reina's lack of presence on D2 has significantly hurt us. Also NQT as well, so I'm hopeful they can shed a light today.

I will try to be present in this thread as much as possible, at least on a phone anyway. I don't want there to be any misunderstandings.

[EuchreJack]

...about Toonyman being scum. 

[ToonyMan]

I will vote anyone who isn't Roden, Jack, or Egan. Max is likely fine.

[ToonyMan]

...about Toonyman being scum. 

A convincing argument.

[webadict]

I disagree with your nomination. Flabbergasted "WTFs" and "huhs??" don't count as a defense.

Explain to me how my reads have taken a sharp turn.

Hey, hope you don't mind me stepping in for Roden here, since I'm not in the mood for this. Why haven't you pushed forward cases on why reina or Knightwing are Town? You seemingly skipped over reina, even though they were absent. Knightwing has been here and you've been pushing that case, but you haven't really defended that choice. I've pointed out that Knightwing hasn't been the same type of poster as he usually is as Town. I usually expect posts like this:

Dunno, this just felt kinda scum to me, and I went off of just gut instinct. I’m not exactly Sherlock Holmes 

Knightwing has a certain style for when he's Town, and this doesn't feel like that style:
Knightwing64 - 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 Last post was 3 hours ago.
Honestly, pick a post. #2 is the one that really felt the most off to me, as I replied to it shortly afterward, but it ALSO implies that Knightwing sorta believes everything ToonyMan says without having checked it out thoroughly.

How is this the same?

Why do you trust Roden?

Because Roden feels very similar to Totem Mafia 3. EuchreJack feels Town, and you're not asking why that is, but whatever. So, is the scumteam the three of us now? Even though I espoused support for Max? Heck... I'd even be willing to vote up Jim Groovester of all people, because he feels pretty genuine about his claims, even if I think he's scummy scum scum, sometimes.

You seem to have a very narrow scope for Town. It appears to be you or Knightwing. reina doesn't really factor in because no one would be willing to vote them in, but you also haven't really given good reasons for reina anyway. You seem to only give good reasons for why someone SHOULDN'T be picked. And the fact that you're pushing for yourself at all is concerning, because you're a much better Town supporter.

As a fun exercise, notice that I've been setting this up since the beginning of the game. The goal was ALWAYS to leave Day 3 to be fought over. This will force you to push me into the scumteam, and if that's the conclusion, Toony, then I will absolutely gladly switch my vote to Maximum Spin. Then, we will vote for Jim on Day 3. I will get Roden and Jack to do it, which appears like that'd be an instant loss for us as scum, no?

So, I'm gonna propose a trade with Maximum Spin. Max, I will be willing to nominate you Today or Tomorrow (preferably Tomorrow, because then the council is set for me and I won't have to redo this argument where ToonyMan pushes for Knightwing or himself.) The catch is that you vote anyone except ToonyMan, Knightwing, reina (even though reina is probably Town, they're a bit of a liability), or Egan_BW Today and Tomorrow. Pick Jim. Pick Roden. Pick EuchreJack. Pick me. Pick yourself. I will follow that vote. I am sure that Roden and Jack will follow that vote, too. I'm doing my dumb dump truck of trust, but there's a lot of evidence showing that ToonyMan is probably scum, which leaves you as very likely Town, so... I'm gonna make a bit of the same mistake, but hopefully a bit better thought out this time. If I'm not thinking correctly, would someone mind short posting me out of it?

That's five people, Toony. They can't all be scum, and leaving it in the hands of a person you explicitly stated as being fine should be fine, no?

[ToonyMan]

I will vote anyone who isn't Roden, Jack, or Egan. Max is likely fine.