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[TricMagic]

I'd pick Vector, outside of them giving me my freaking hat back so I can actually do stuff. Use your own actions.

[NJW2000]

Interesting. So no nightkill was performed other than a vig one?

Well, well, well. Compiling readslist laboriously, but it's worth saying this in the meantime:

If you haven't figured it out yet, scum didn't kill anyone last night. I believe they targeted either Vector or the Masons, both of those players had protect actions that night.

Another possibility is that the scumkill was blocked during the night. FoU was blocked, for one (though unlikely to NK, fries nonsense kinda sets up what their night has to be?), and Vector for another (again, I think unlikely - Vector was confirmed? Might not have caught up on thread properly.)

[Luckyowl]

Also, let's not forget LuckyOwl saw that IcyTea has a Hydra-flavored ability, which he then denied.

IcyTea31: Could you explain what your Hydraform ability do? You don't have to go in details just give us a skeletal overview on it. You said it can help both Mafia and town. If that's correct, in what way can it help town? In what way can it help Mafia?

I don't have an ability by that name.

This also put you in a spotlight because I gave you a copy of my ability ontop of your 'hydraform' which I already said many post ago.

Ah, I see what's happened. You copied one of my abilities, but it was renamed in the process. "Hydraform" must be just some random name webadict gave it so you wouldn't get too much information about my role. Presumably, your version of the ability you gave me isn't named after song lyrics?

Hydras grow new heads; not sure if that means extra lives or no, but I'd feel way safer if we nipped the IcyTea problem in the bud right now.




LuckyOwl:  What can you tell us about this Hydraform?

Not much really. Webadict attached this weird flavor text saying something like. "Woah IcyTea31 has how many heads?"

[Toaster]

IcyTea:

Anyway, I'm 99% sure that flip is fake and we'll see the real of the flip whenever IcyTea dies.

Death millers are a bastard mechanic. In a non-bastard game, roleflips never contain false information (though parts may be obscured, as with Toony's first flip).

Sure, but we've already seen a flip-hiding role out of Juicebox.   4mask having a fake flip that reveals as true when you die is totally within the bounds of plausibility.  It could also be a secondary fake role that he's got to protect against investigation.  It obviously his true full role because it doesn't mention mason chat or anything else both of you have claimed, and you ignoring this is asinine.

Why hasn't ICT already claimed? If he's going to die tonight he should surely share all the knowledge he has.

Because you're not reading the thread?

IcyTea and I, collectively, are a Super-JOAT.

That's the part with the hydra

You mean the hydra thing you have denied that you have?




Heydude:

If you haven't figured it out yet, scum didn't kill anyone last night. I believe they targeted either Vector or the Masons, both of those players had protect actions that night.

How do we know you didn't perform the Mafiakill?  You've been noticably thinking of teams so I can't rule out the possibility in my head.  I had considered inspecting you, in fact, prior to the Mason claim.

Anyway, I'm putting my vote on Toaster now. If he's town, then two scum are going to be dead so I don't mind one mislynch. If he's wrong, then he's almost certainly scum instead.

If I hang, will you shoot IcyTea (assuming he doesn't also die) when I flip town?




LuckyOwl:  Did you see the text of the ability or just the name?

[FallacyofUrist]

Interesting. So no nightkill was performed other than a vig one?

Assuming that heydude is actually a vigilante and not mafia trying to disguise their mafiakill. I mean, they seem pretty townie to me as mentioned in my reads list, but we do have to keep in mind all possibilities here.

Sure, but we've already seen a flip-hiding role out of Juicebox.   4mask having a fake flip that reveals as true when you die is totally within the bounds of plausibility.  It could also be a secondary fake role that he's got to protect against investigation.  It obviously his true full role because it doesn't mention mason chat or anything else both of you have claimed, and you ignoring this is asinine.

All it takes is something like IcyTea being a masonizer with a heavy drawback instead of someone who starts the game in a mason chat, and your point is moot.

You're tunneling hard onto the masons, and as far as I can tell your case is solely based around mechanical theories and information, without analyzing their behavior at all. If you want me to give you credibility, do a read of their behavior based on their day activity in addition to mechanical information.

Speaking of behavior reads, I'm digging through your posts now.

[TricMagic]

Toaster, those two links together contradict your argument. Hydraform was a renamed ability apparently. Right now you are doing your best to lynch Icytea for whatever reason, but as it stands your argument that 4mask was mafia was blatently untrue. And you know the old saying.

Lynch the Lier.

[FallacyofUrist]

I severely doubt that 4mask's role has a death miller component (falsifying a role flip is a completely different beast than obscuring it). More likely we're dealing with a scum Toaster who knows he's up for the lynch and has decided to drop everything and go on an all out attack, a desperate offensive gambit. But his arguments feel more like a conspiracy theorist's ramblings than a reasoned attack.

Interestingly though, as I mentioned earlier, TricMagic used a No Bonk Badge on Toaster, so it can't have been Toaster to perform that daykill, it have to had been someone else (unless Toaster had some sort of immunity). Lends a bit more credence to the idea that he has a team. Since Toaster's so obviously scummy, we're probably going to see some bussing here.

Alright, time for my vote history read.

Spoiler: Toaster's Day 1 Votes (click to show/hide)

LuckyOwl:  Did you kill and eat IronyOwl?  I keep getting confused.

If you killed and ate a player N1 and could blindly swap into their alignment, would you?

IcyTea, IcyTea, IcyTea. Why did you reveal your nefarious plot now? Luckyowl hasn't even posted yet. Why should town listen to anything an unjustified self-voter has to say?

Because not listening to people is how one loses this game as town, and I have knowledge town doesn't have. It seems to me that the only reason you'd have no reason to listen to me is if I don't have knowledge that you don't as well.

Hey, you know who has information town doesn't have?

Scum.

IcyTea31.

I was going to go back and get a feel on who was just coasting, but it turns out the list of people who are just coasting is pretty long; too long for it to be useful D1.   I'm pretty confident that TricMagic isn't town; he's way too self-interested for it to be the case that he's town, and I don't care for his current vote on LuckyOwl; he quickly jumps from not having LuckyOwl on his scumreads to voting LuckyOwl for a claim of inconsistent logic, which I don't follow at all.

TricMagic.

I'm voting them over Leafsnail cause I believe he is mafia. Leafsnail doesn't give me any real info. Or anyone else. Trying to shift the vote to them is suspect as Day 2 is going to be nearly as exhausting as day 1. I'd take a self-lynch over a leaf-lynch. At least town would get info out of that.

I'd love to hear development on why it's scummy, and specifically who is scummy in this instance.

That said, fine.

Leafsnail.

He's had his chance to post.  I'd still rather hang Tric but I'm obviously not getting my way there.

Okay.

TricMagic.

No way Mafia NQT blows a LYLO breaker for no real reason on D1.

Spoiler: Toaster's Day 2 Votes (click to show/hide)

Speaking of IcyTea and 4maskwolf, IcyTea and by extension 4maskwolf are mafia.  I have reason to suspect we should lynch 4maskwolf first and IcyTea tomorrow (or better yet someone shoot him at night.)

Given that IcyTea is the #2 head, I assumed it'd be wiser to hit the main body first.  I don't have any actual confirmation of that, but with 4mask claiming as such, I was only ever more sure.  Again, I don't have any actual confirmation of that, so I still say we lynch IcyTea to be sure.

Day 1 Toaster votes for LuckyOwl once (an RVS vote), IcyTea31 once (for the nebulous 'I have knowledge town doesn't have' sentence), TricMagic twice, and Leafsnail once.

Day 2, Toaster votes for 4maskwolf, and once 4maskwolf gets day killed, IcyTea31.

It's not much better than Jim Groovester's vote pattern. Speaking of that, you know what those two have in common? Going on TricMagic, who I find increasingly town at this point. Additionally, there's not a hint of in-depth case building for any of these votes at all. You know what TricMagic and Leafsnail have in common? Perceived easy lynches. Come day 2, he claims a fake cop result in an attempt to form a bandwagon against the mason pair, trying to bring back up earlier suspicions by other players. Then the daykill comes out, and he's suddenly utterly convinced there's a death miller effect with basically no evidence of such? This is a mafioso throwing himself under the bus. Doesn't mean we shouldn't lynch him, though.

Toaster.

[notquitethere]

Fallacy

It's ridiculous that Toaster is pushing to lynch IcyTea. I'm going to trust we're not dealing with a death miller 4mask after all this. I think notquitethere, Toaster, and Jim are three of the scumteam. That still leaves an unknown fourth member, though, which concerns me.

You don't put any store in 4mask's inspect result? Or the fact Jim didn't confirm my night action (a scum buddy surely would have done so, no?)? I dunno man, I know you want me to be scum but try to think clearly about these team ideas your building.

[FallacyofUrist]

With regards to his team? The fact that he went on Leafsnail with NQT and refused to see NQT as scummy, and the fact that he and Jim went together on Tric makes me think that that's three of the mafia - and yeah, IcyTea, I know you inspected NQT and cleared him, but the behavior they've been exhibiting doesn't match up with that. That leaves one more mafia player... and that's what I'm scared of. Where is the fourth mafioso?

Fallacy

It's ridiculous that Toaster is pushing to lynch IcyTea. I'm going to trust we're not dealing with a death miller 4mask after all this. I think notquitethere, Toaster, and Jim are three of the scumteam. That still leaves an unknown fourth member, though, which concerns me.

You don't put any store in 4mask's inspect result? Or the fact Jim didn't confirm my night action (a scum buddy surely would have done so, no?)? I dunno man, I know you want me to be scum but try to think clearly about these team ideas your building.

Here you are, defending Toaster again. It may seem absurd of me in particular to say this, but night actions aren't everything. Results can be messed with or lied about or redirected or any number of other things. I'm looking the most at behavior, with night actions as a secondary thing influencing that.

To be honest, I didn't think I would be this competent at the mafia day game, or relying on it more than my role powers, but turns out some time to mature since the last time I played mafia makes a big difference.

[FallacyofUrist]

Okay sorry, I did misread your post. I thought you were defending Toaster, not defending yourself. But everything I said after 'defending Toaster again' is still valid.

[heydude6]

Can we have a votecount again Web?

Also, I'm moving mine back to Toaster

[webadict]

Vote Count
------------------------
dolores - 0 -
FallacyofUrist - 0 -
heydude6 - 0 -
IcyTea31 - 1 - Toaster*,
Jim Groovester - 0 -
Leafsnail - 0 -
Luckyowl - 0 -
Nirur Torir - 0 -
NJW2000 - 0 -
notquitethere - 0 -
Toaster - 6 - TricMagic*, Leafsnail*, notquitethere*, Vector*, FallacyofUrist*, heydude6*,
TricMagic - 0 -
Vector - 0 -
No Lynch - 0 -

Not Voting - 6 - Nirur Torir, Luckyowl, dolores, NJW2000, IcyTea31, Jim Groovester,

7 to Hammer. Day ends on January 03, 2021 at 19:00 CST (~50 hours remaining).

[4maskwolf]

I saw that web.

Bah.

[heydude6]

Unvote

I want to hear Nirur Torir speak before we hammer.

Also, isn't 4maskwolf supposed to be dead Web? Why is he in Not voting?

[TricMagic]

Mafia Town: Residents- Toaster, Vector, Jim, Leaf.

I would like the Dweller Mask back please Vector. No chance you can use it. And I still have 100 pons left.

Speaking of, how many people still have pons? Not letting a hammer come own quite yet.