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[hector13]

He targeted the dead dude during the night,

He didn't target the dead dude on N1, though. Somebody else did. Not that anybody has acknowledged that, it seems.

I still feel Juice is the better person to flip. Even risking them being Jester. (Hector is more likely a subset of Jester, in my mind.)

There were more people in the scum team on N1, though, so that doesn't preclude him being scum

Hector then. Let's see it.

Let's see what?

[Starver]

There were more people in the scum team on N1, though, so that doesn't preclude him being scum

It does mean that if all these people who were otherwise busy (or/p proven incapable of killing) N1,and by extension N2, can't have made the actual kills, so there's at least one someone else involved.

I said this, ages ago, and nobody told me I was wrong.

[Starver]

In the very post in which I actually plumped upon Juice:

What it does mean is that we have a shorter short-list of killer-possibilities that we can lynch or at least force an explanation out of to show how it was an Odd Night Vig jumping to conclusions and getting it wrong, or somesuch (but make it a better claim than that, now that I've suggested it to you, or at least flesh it out more to show you're not just copying my suggestion).

The whole thing is rather long, but not so long as some of your screens-of-text argument with other people going all screens-of-text. Maybe I was being too brief?

[hector13]

MM, y'all missed these questions:

Thought occurred to me that I don’t think I asked about:

MM

Why did you redirect blueturtle onto IcyTea?

What made you choose to redirect blueturtle in the first place, what made you choose IcyTea to be his target?

Also, why did you not redirect Tric, whom you appear to think is scum?

And that quote also has a question Starver can answer, too:

MM didn’t perform the kill on N1, and he did admit to visiting the person who died during N2. Notable: confirmed scum thinks I’m an investigative role. What makes you so sure he didn’t do it N2?

Basically the shortlist of people who killed blueturtle is me, you (though I think this unlikely), MM, juicebox. Assuming the other claims are indeed what happened.

Consequently, I think the lynch pool today should be me, MM and juicebox. Amusingly, nobody has gone apeshit over juicebox's nurse/doctor claim.

[IcyTea31]

Something's not right here. I need to sleep on this, though it'll be a photo finish in the morning if I figure out what it is. Are Starver and Tric actually cleared? I understand that puts me on doubt as well, but I think either I've missed something or we've made an assumption.

[hector13]

Something's not right here. I need to sleep on this, though it'll be a photo finish in the morning if I figure out what it is. Are Starver and Tric actually cleared? I understand that puts me on doubt as well, but I think either I've missed something or we've made an assumption.

There's a lot I'm taking at face value, to be perfectly honest. The whole you and Tric backing up each other's claim re: RGU, and also Starver backing up his claim of being investigated by him, really.

Consequently, it's feasible that there are two remaining scum, and it's either you and Tric, or Starver and Tric.

Tric was delayed N1, and you blocked Starver. I find it hard to believe there's more than a 3-man team + ally (even then, I find it hard to believe there's a 3-man team + ally) so benefit of the doubt in those cases is MM's problem.

[Starver]

Basically the shortlist of people who killed blueturtle is me, you (though I think this unlikely), MM, juicebox. Assuming the other claims are indeed what happened.

I don't dismiss that a cleared person for N1 did 'the dirty' on N2. I said as such. I also don't think all those with non-fatal skills used (confirmed or highly corroborated) N1 have entirely Townly basis behind those skills.

Consequently, I think the lynch pool today should be me, MM and juicebox.

I don't largely argue with that, but I contest your exact prioritisation. Especially your self-sacrifice of putting yourself first (that's more like me than you!).

Amusingly, nobody has gone apeshit over juicebox's nurse/doctor claim.

Oh, I did, somewhere beyond the below handy Topic Summary. It was one of various factors that I saw everybody else ignore, until you just now. Strangely.


PPE for Icy: I don't think I'm necessarily cleared. I can see ways of Tric not being cleared, too, but it requires (at the last count) at least one additional remaining member of the Scumteam (or other Masonic/Cultish backchannel) to properly (mis)establish this semblance of mutual trust without a lot of luck. And I would say two scum left is more likely, give or take a faint possibility of a final 3rd-Party (probably in the place of the penultimate official Mafiosa, leaving actually just the one).

(Not PPEing for Hector, or I'll probably never get this reply out.)

[Starver]

Actually, it looks like Hector has similar ideas, except for desperately trying to deflect away from my conviction that Juice needs targetting, and selectively  twisting the logic any which way to try to accomplish such deflections.

[IcyTea31]

The thing is, blocking Starver N1 only means that they weren't the killer on that night, while Max could have done it . And blocking RGU doesn't clear Tric; I was indeed hasty to call them so when they said the correct things that would actually be a safe lie.

[IcyTea31]

Unvote.

I'll clear this up in the morning.

[Starver]

Case in point:

Consequently, it's feasible that there are two remaining scum, and it's either you and Tric, or Starver and Tric.

And yet you seem to want to persecute MM.

[juicebox]

Basically the shortlist of people who killed blueturtle is me, you (though I think this unlikely), MM, juicebox. Assuming the other claims are indeed what happened.

Consequently, I think the lynch pool today should be me, MM and juicebox. Amusingly, nobody has gone apeshit over juicebox's nurse/doctor claim.

This. I was expecting to be barraged with questions about my claim, but it seems everyone's just accepted.

Something's not right here. I need to sleep on this, though it'll be a photo finish in the morning if I figure out what it is. Are Starver and Tric actually cleared? I understand that puts me on doubt as well, but I think either I've missed something or we've made an assumption.

I don't think anyone's really confirmed, except maybe RGU. Which is honestly one of the things bothering me about Tric and Starver's votes on me. Their cases are basically It must be me or Hector, because neither of us are cleared in their eyes, without really building on that at all.

[Starver]

In the absence of positive evidence, one has to rely upon gaps between the negative evidence. And I've already said I'd hope to hear things from you (and others) to shift my opinion, but everyone ignoring me leaves me where I am. Solving this Sudoku.

[Maximum Spin]

Regarding juicebox's doctor claim, I just want to throw in an interesting observation I've had before for you to reflect on for future mafia games. It has no bearing on this current game, really, or, more precisely, what bearing it has has already happened; so I feel justified in using my promised right to post mentorship from beyond the grave for it.

When there's only one of something confirmed to exist, the possibility of a second is usually met with skepticism: there's already one, why should there be another? But once a second is confirmed to exist, the human brain seems to accept the possibility of a third without much fuss: there are already two, why not three?

I find this interesting, and also useful.

[TricMagic]

Believe me, I know. There being 3 kill blocks of some sort does make sense. Lover Doctor, Jailkeepers, and framer/doctor. An additional though would bring kill blocks to 4, out of 11.

Assuming an even split, it would stand to reason that either Juicebox, or Hector, is scum.