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[hector13]

Basically at this point we have a guilty result and a person fighting against that.

RGU needs to stop taking the bait MaxSpin is pushing your buttons, the best argument you have is “I have a guilty result, unless you can prove otherwise, that’s it.”

[randomgenericusername]

I can prove it if I'm lynched. Which Maximum apparently doesn't want. This also makes him even more scummy than before. He says there's no hard evidence, but I have a PM with my night results which clearly states that he's scum and that's hard evidence agaisnt him. One of the biggest tells is the appeal to emotion, which is a commonly used scum tactic.

[hector13]

Well we’re 5 days from a deadline, we can figure things out in the interim, see where people stand.

[randomgenericusername]

Sure. It's always good to use day time for discussion. But I hope we lynch either him or me before this day ends, otherwise my claim would be for nothing.

[randomgenericusername]

Night.

[Maximum Spin]

This is just appeal to emotion, which only makes you scummier in my eyes.

Um, which part? I don't think I've made any appeals to emotion. I don't even have emotions.[/quote]

I don't believe there's a mafia framer because that would mean scum has two framers.

Okay, I mean, we'll see. I bet you're wrong.

FoU also confirmed that hidden modifiers are not included in the game. Those are mostly used in bastard games, while this is mostly vanilla.

Huh? I didn't say anything about hidden... ah, I see, when I said "unknown modifiers" I meant unknown to us, presumably known to the role holder.

I am a cop and have a scum result on you, which makes you confirmed scum from my point of view.

That's really bad and dumb! That's exactly why things like millers and framers exist, to trip up people who think that way.

I'm pushing to not be lynched. That's an outright lie. I said I'm pushing for one of us to be lynched. My lynch would confirm you as scum and your lynch would confirm me as cop, so town wins either way. So what if you flip town? Town will just lynch me and I'll die, simple as that.

You're not thinking this through. If, as you claim, you really are town, then you should be concerned that I might flip town, because then, "simple as that", you get killed too, and town loses two useful roles because you fell for a frame job. You're assuming that my flipping town could only happen that you're scum and lying, which... well, sounds exactly like how scum would act in order to imitate a naive townie and pull off an "oops, guess I screwed up" frame-up, to be honest, but it also sounds like what a really dumb town player would think, too, so it's a toss-up.
Besides, nobody really believes the "oh, I'm fine with being lynched, it'll show you for what you are" line. That's an old bluff very obviously used to try to get people to lynch the other guy instead of you. Which is perfectly reasonable, of course, if you are actually town and they really should lynch the other guy, but it's no evidence either way. Which is why I'm not voting for you, because I don't have any good reason to choose between "you're intentionally setting me up" and "someone else is setting you up". What I'm trying to explain is that you don't either.

But apparently "not wanting to be lynched" and "not wanting to lynch town for stupid reasons because of an emotional overreaction" is scummy. shrug

[Maximum Spin]

To add one more thing: The reason I don't want you to be lynched, RGU, is because I have had a gut feeling from the start of this discussion that you're town and have been misled. I've been trying to talk myself out of it this whole time, and I do still find your aggressive stance concerning on an intellectual level, but I still have that gut feeling, so I don't want you to be lynched, because A) if you're town and a cop, obviously I don't want you to be lynched, and B) on top of that, if you flip town, I'll probably get lynched just like you keep saying, and I don't want me to be lynched either. From my perspective, letting you get lynched will probably result in town losing two good roles, or at least there seems like enough chance that I don't want to risk it.

[IcyTea31]

Something's not right about this RGU-Max-Blurtle debacle. There's a certain defensiveness on every side. I'll need to think more before I can make a final conclusion, but I don't think it's a radical statement to say that at least one of the three is trying to deceive, maybe more than one.

[Starver]

All very interesting, and I'm just processing the arguments so far. Not sure I approve of the cop-claim, so readily. It's either a bit scum-desperate or a bit town-desperate (likely down to the real or contrived even-night impotance, which does explain the not sitting still on the claim - whichever is cause and whichever is effect), and I'm not sure which yet to most believe.

I could imagine a scum-on-scum coordinated "flip one to fake the other" scheme, but unlikely without a third partner handily staying out of it to act more conventionally shocked.

But I need to study the intermediate interactions more, see if/how this little throwaway rumour about me might yet be attempted to be justified and especially see how people react to what I'm saying it all.
Speaking of which, the first thing entirely of my own to say is that I think one person out there knows exactly my outcome last night (by lots of circumstantial knowledge). It doesn't necessarily flip me, nor them, in but it probably adds up. Still, if you think you recognise my initial announcement, it could be bracketted as layer on and might even help start a nascent web-of-trust. I'm already sure that all claims I've heard are unlikely to be from this person, but I'm open to alternate ideas.

[Starver]

EBWOP: "later on". And other typos, but that one stands out as making my nonsensical ramblings even less sensical.

[randomgenericusername]

I highly dobut that there is a second mafia framer. FoU also confirmed there aren't sanity modifiers and you claim to be a doctor (when we already had another one) and not miller, so my scum result is probably correct. When I say apeal to emotion is because your arguments are strongly based on convincing by use of emotions rather than use of logic. It's subtle, but noticeable. All you're saying is that I am wrong and that town shouldn't lynch you, but I don't see why. Not only would that mean that scum had a second framer, but that they also targeted you, which I find extremely unlikely. Since this is barely the second day and we already lynched a mafia-ally we can afford having mistakes, so I think it's worth the risk. After all, we have the advantage in numbers. We might lose a power role, but every player has a power role in this setup so it's not a big loss.

[TricMagic]

All right, fine, then I'm a serial killer.

But in-game, town.

I agree with your plan to vote for FallacyofUrist!

Quote the Joke.

What I Find Strange is that you never once question me while I was asleep. Not a single question for me to answer.

I also might have an idea Starver.


All that though, and bits and pieces leads me to believe that you are the killer, Spin. You can completely ignore the secondary kill because you are the secondary killer.

[hector13]

Do you not like it when someone else is the center of attention? ‘cause I think a claimed guilty and the guilty’s response is rather more important. You did also imply you were reading through things, saying you’d be about 12 hours for something.

Why so convinced there were two kills last night?

[TricMagic]

More the fact that Spin may be a secondary killer. Or simply Mafia, but I think it's more the Vig role.

[randomgenericusername]

I don't see a second kill so I don't know what youpre talking about. But there's the chance Spin was a third and was framed by mafia thinking they were town. As unlikely as him being town and framed by mafia, if there's even a second framer. Why do you think he's a serial kilker and not scum?