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[redwallzyl]

http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/05/12/528068500/dhs-considers-carry-on-laptop-ban-on-flights-from-europe

I'm sure this will go over fantasticly with passangers. /S

[Starver]

So "Mr Comey declined a request to pledge loyalty to Mr Trump, but said he would be honest with him."

That sort of comment doesn't go down well with the King Joffrey types. It's a good job it was said to a well-balanced individual with no reputation for instability...

[Rusty Shackleford]

I would hope that the parents are teaching their own children that stuff. I understand that not all parents do that, but it is kind of sad.

Trusting parents to be competent is at least as naive as trusting the government to be competent. All education should be done via youtube.

Man, isn't that the truth? Who else is going to show you basic adulting like how to tie a double winsor besides some guy with a youtube tutorial?

[MrRoboto75]

I would hope that the parents are teaching their own children that stuff. I understand that not all parents do that, but it is kind of sad.

Trusting parents to be competent is at least as naive as trusting the government to be competent. All education should be done via youtube.

Man, isn't that the truth? Who else is going to show you basic adulting like how to tie a double winsor besides some guy with a youtube tutorial?

Worry not.

The mitochondria is the powerhouse of the cell.

[Descan]

I would hope that the parents are teaching their own children that stuff. I understand that not all parents do that, but it is kind of sad.

If the point is to teach kids things their parents won't... (like that you can be something besides a cis-straight person and That's Not A Bad Thing, or the aforementioned molestation issue) I mean, kids kill themselves over this crap. I don't give a shit about a parents "right to raise their kid the way they want," the "way they want" *literally kills people* so I'm gonna be "nope.jpg" over that. I'd rather kids get a baseline, fairly comprehensive and publicly known standard of knowledge from school, rather than hope that every single parent is good at being a parent and not gonna result in their kid feeling abject self-loathing and scarred for life with no recourse to asking for help. :V

Aaaand even discounting the whole "not every parent is a good person and we don't want people to fall through the cracks due to misguided senses of 'parents rights' superseding the childrens rights" issue, parents aren't supremely knowledgeable about everything. We don't expect parents to teach their kids entry level calculus, or world history, and sexual health is also pretty complicated and rife with misinformation and myths.

Like, a parent can go ahead and say "Yeah the school taught you that, but this is what *we* believe." I don't want to take that away and will argue and fight against taking that away. But I *do* want the kids to reserve their rights to actual, factual, verifiable knowledge to go with that.

[origamiscienceguy]

The problem is that nobody knows where to draw the line. Remember that story of the CPS taking two kids from their parents because the parents let them walk home from school by themselves? I think we all would agree that that is taking it too far, but in every situation, it is impossible to know where "too far" starts.

[sluissa]

If kids are killing themselves over something they learn in class or learn from their parents. (Assuming it's not something seriously out of the scope of normal behavior for parents or schools.) Then that says those kids need more attention from a mental health standpoint rather than the school or the parents changing to suit them.

[Descan]

I'm not sure I see what overzealous child services in a different country has to do with an education curriculum that went through expert review and public comment, and was known about months or years before going into practice.

also, pretty sure that's a fallacy. "we can't figure it out perfectly so do nothing."

like even if we can't figure out the fine line in the middle ground, that shouldn't stop us from doing things or not doing things definitively on either side of that line.

E: Seriously? Queer kids kill themselves *all the fucking time* because their parents rail and rave against anything not cisgender or straight, and with no outside knowledge from school or friends (we're talking average people as young as 10 or 11, or even younger) they feel like they're fuckin' monsters. That's basic human psychology, dude, not "mental health issues." Or feel like shit because they were molested and think it's all their fault, and they can't tell anyone because they're freaking 6 years old and no ones taken the time to tell them what the bloody words are.

Like, for trans teens, the suicide attempt rate is 20%. 1 in 5. And 47% for suicidal ideation. This is in Ontario, the same place this is talkin' about.

Bah.

That's not even taking into account the potential lessening of bullying by teaching their peers about the issues, either.

[penguinofhonor]

snip

How are those two things opposed? We can give suicidal students psychological help and change the school environment so fewer people get to that point.

The only reason I see to downplay the latter is if you want to focus more of the blame for LGBT suicides on LGBT people for being "too sensitive."

[ChairmanPoo]

What's your favorite Trump bodypart?

[Dunamisdeos]

Trusting parents to be competent is at least as naive as trusting the government to be competent. All education should be done via youtube.

Funny, but also actually true. Having the government choose what my kid must learn from a moral/ethical standpoint is way, way creepier than the idea that a parent somewhere might not do a good job. The gov can't even write standardized tests coherently.

Also, there is no flipping way that a twenty percent suicide rate could be directly blamed on 20% of all parents being the kind of monsters that drive a kid to suicide. That's is logically absurd. You're claiming that 20% of a random subset of all parents would drive their kid to suicide. A 1 in 5 rate of suicide amongst any group whatsoever absolutely has some kind of mental health issue contributing, which needs to be addressed in addition to educating their/our peers.

I completely agree that kids need to be taught about those subjects and why it's not ok to hate a person based on the choices they make in that regard.

How are those two things opposed? We can give suicidal students psychological help and change the school environment so fewer people get to that point.

This seems like the best solution. There's no reason to downplay either.

What's your favorite Trump bodypart?

Chin #3

[sluissa]

snip

How are those two things opposed? We can give suicidal students psychological help and change the school environment so fewer people get to that point.

The only reason I see to downplay the latter is if you want to focus more of the blame for LGBT suicides on LGBT people for being "too sensitive."

Maybe that is what I'm getting at. It certainly seems a possibility, given anecdotal experiences.

[Descan]

It's not just "any group" it's a group defined by the shared trait, a trait still seen as an abomination in a plurality or even majority in some places. Like, LGBT teens? Not a huge percentage of the population. Recent research indicates the latest generation is the queerest in a while, and even then, it's a well shy of 20%, and usually the number given is around 7%.

Meanwhile, 40% of homeless youth are queer or LGBT in one way or another. Twice the rate, or possibly 4-5x the rate.

The "mental health issue" they share is, probably and I'd even bet money on it, induced depression from being told directly or indirectly (would you come out to your parents if you weren't sure they'd even let you live in that house anymore?) that you and people like you are an abomination, and with no one telling you otherwise (or at least, no one in authority; the internet still exists but people on a screen don't trump authority figures who are *supposed* to love you and care for and about you) I don't see how it's a stretch to think that it's not something inherent to the group that's causing these numbers.

[nenjin]

I hate child politics. There's plenty of times it's legit to bring it up but most of the time it's one of those sacred cows you can't touch with a 10 foot poll because people get hysterical. Or people use their kids as a shield for their political views, since it's a time honored tradition in America to raise your kids with a dictatorial level of brainwashing. See: Bathrooms.

[origamiscienceguy]

It's a time honored tradition anywhere in the world. You spend all that time, money, love and energy making and raising the child, you don't want someone else to tell you how to do it.