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(option for non-playas so they can see votes too ;v)

[IamanElfCollaborator]

oh
so cecil could've jav'd the skeleton
>.<

[Swordstar]

You likely wouldn't have done a lot. Lance vs axe and he has heavy def. Plus dude is dead now anyways!

For real this time!

... We hope

[Mopsy]

Quoting levels that have happened has nothing to do with levels that will happen. It's too early to use current levels as a trend to indicate future levels is all I'm saying.

No, but it has a lot to do with the stats that will happen. Statistically, if two players start out equal and one of them is P points behind after N levels, then it is more likely than not that they will still be behind at the end of the game (in the absence of non-random interventions like Dragonshields). Just how likely they are to still be behind, and by how much, depends on P and N. Unless someone who has this stuff written on their retinas has done it for me by then, I might try working that out tomorrow. Tonight I'm too tired and likely to screw up.

This "law of likely preservation of point leads" is not the same thing as saying that current levels can ever be used to predict future levels (unless there's something wrong with the level generation). That doesn't work, just like rolling six sixes in a row doesn't make it any less (or more) likely that you'll roll another six.

The progression is a better argument, but is offset by the fact that I'm much more likely to be a front line fighter than she is, especially given she's progressing sidearm which has ranged options

I didn't think about the throwing knives, actually. That's a decent argument on your part, especially if Gaterhyme is into throwing things. Perhaps they don't want the shield cloth at all.

Edit: I made a too strong statement about the preservation of leads.

[Swordstar]

My point about the levels was that your overall levels aren't relevant especially to the specific stats being discussed. I'm 2 points ahead because I started 2 points ahead. We've both gained the same amount of hp. How many other stats I gained isn't relevant to the discussion.

[Mopsy]

How many other stats I gained isn't relevant to the discussion.

I say it is, potentially. It's not as simple as "you're 4 points ahead of Gaterhyme, thus you owe him 4 points", but if someone has had bad luck with level rolls, then I think it's reasonable to compensate for that with stat-boosting items. With a sensible build, a character's effectiveness will be roughly proportional to the total number of stat points gained. The fairness/balance of the leveling system depends on that assumption. I'm not saying that Iris' current 4-point lead is a decisive argument against giving her the cloth, but it's certainly no argument for doing it and increasing her lead to 7 points (which is slightly more than two average 3.3-point levels).

The stat boosts still need to be things that are useful to the character, of course. Dedicated sword fighters shouldn't receive MAG boosts just to even out the points.

[Blade Master Model 42]

I don't think bringing point discrepancies into this debate is very fair at this stage. We (normally) have potentially 38 level ups from this point, and basing who should get what based on how they rolled on 4 doesn't seem like sound logic to me, especially considering having an early lead doesn't guarantee you won't suddenly start rolling garbage right up to the epilogue.

As a Vantage mage who is going to be seeing a lot more EP combat than other mages, I would like Shaelynn to be considered for one of the items by the way. Just saying.

[Mopsy]

I don't think bringing point discrepancies into this debate is very fair at this stage. We (normally) have potentially 38 level ups from this point, and basing who should get what based on how they rolled on 4 doesn't seem like sound logic to me, especially considering having an early lead doesn't guarantee you won't suddenly start rolling garbage right up to the epilogue.

Giving one character what amounts to a two-level lead over another seems significant to me. If Iris starts getting garbage levels we can always give her the next Seraphic Towel we come across.

As a Vantage mage who is going to be seeing a lot more EP combat than other mages, I would like Shaelynn to be considered for one of the items by the way. Just saying.

We ought to be doing all loot management strictly IC, actually. There's potential for roleplay there, and if you won't RP you don't get any loooot, unless people are nice.

[Criptfeind]

So, my thoughts on this. Italics for maybe Bold for Sounds like a good idea and Bolded Italics for sounds like the best idea... Take it all with a grain of salt, since I obviously don't have much experience in the game.

Fredrick: Likey a tonky duder who needs tonky stats for the whole game. Unlikely to max out hp. Likely to max out defense. +hp would be good on him.
Arnold: We really don't want Arnold to be under heavy attack  since he's our main healer. Of course, if he does get attacked it'd be nice, but since it's worth planning around him getting only a little hurt and being careful, defensive stats on him are like planning for failure. Pass.
Gregory: Tankest mage against physical damage. If we end up in a situation were we need a mage tanking against a dude who's not easy to kill, gregory is the first choice, but that's a pretty niche situation. Ultimately my personal skills also need me to stay at high health, which like Arnold means defensive stats are nice but planning for failure. Pass.
Siegfried Von Fancyman: He's going to max out hp and defense almost certainly, and his personal skills incurage taking damage. Pass.
Shea: Vantage encourages us perhaps putting her in a bit of danger when a mage needs to be put in danger, since at least she'll get a shot off before going down. She's also very squish and could do with more defenses more then the other mages. Vantage isn't really a great defense against anyone who can't one hit, and although light magic might be the most damaging magic, it's via repetitive attacks that it's such, not single powerful strikes. Could probably do with ether or both stat ups.
Jann: He's a tonky duder and going to be front line for a while (although eventually promote to the furthest backline ) but he's not set to max out defense I'm pretty sure. Maybe a surprisingly good option, considering he's like, our third string tank and also our squishest mages bodyguard (which I mean idk if that'll show in combat much but I'd guess in maps where we don't start together means he's going to end up tanking a bit more then we might hope) Could do with shield.
Alissa: Her getting into dangerous combat could probably be regarded most of the time as a tactical failure. More planning for failure. Pass.
Cecil: He'll max out hp certainly and might just barely squeeze in a maxed out defense naturally, we could very well end up putting a dragon shield on him in 30 levels, but for right now, pass.
Flora: Well, I'm honestly not a fan of giving her stuff. Healing is probably higher impact then axing in a lot of cases (even with nerffed healz) so I'd expect in the future that we'll probably see more of the Arnold side of her then the Jann side of her, and even when swinging that axe or flinging that flux it looks like she's going to be trying to be at range, probably still avoiding damage. I mean, I can see the argument here if we didn't have a lot of better options for the stuff. But as is, I think it's a pass.
Altha: Another squishy mage. Never really going to be tanking physical damage and unlike Shea doesn't have the vantage to even be in such situations. So pass on the shield. BUT! Interestingly she's actually our highest RES growth character I think. In the future we could see her being our go to magic tank, and she could benefit from the hp cloth in that situation.
Iris: low health and defense on a melee character. Sure, she'll probably be dodgey, but it's still nice to be able to take a hit. Seems sorta like a natural fit for both items.
Suzanne: Same as Iris pretty much, lower health and higher defense, but only marginally on both. Biggest difference might be that in 20 levels Iris will become a ranged character and can avoid tough melees, whereas Suzanne is going to be ranged (sorta) right away, and probably trying to avoid the tough melees.

Honestly, I wouldn't hate giving both items to Iris. She needs both in a way that none of our other melee dudes do really (except maybe Jann with the shield.) and it seems like a natural conclusion to me to give defensive upgrades to melee characters. Giving them to the mages are all like, cute ideas? But feels less consistent to me (How often will we need to use a vantage sacrifice/magetank/whateverjustificationIcouldthinkfortogetgregorysomesweetstats? So far we've done it in 1/3 of our battles, whereas melee dudes are going to fight in melee in every battle.) Suzanne feels like she needs stats, and Jann and Fredrick could use some shoring up, but Suzanne and Jann can at least throw their weapons into melee and Fredrick is like, okay. Maybe an item on Iris and the other to Shea/Suzanne/Jann/Fredrick? If we want to be like, feels good and fair and not just build up one character into an opop god the carry the rest of us scrubs... Basically I guess what it boils down to is that I think Iris could do with one cuz her competitors are ranged.

So, das mien thoughters.

We ought to be doing all loot management strictly IC, actually. There's potential for roleplay there, and if you won't RP you don't get any loooot, unless people are nice.

I'm pretty sure if we do it strictly IC Shea just ends up with all the stat gain items. Even for stats she'll max out or like, strength. 
Edit: Also perhaps more seriously I have no idea how to even handle that IC. "HEY DUDERS! WHO WANTS TO RUB THIS ANGLE PELT ON YOUR FACE SO YOU CAN TAKE 10% MORE STAB WOUNDS BEFORE DYING?" Well, heh, I'm sure where there's a will there's a way. But eh...

[Blade Master Model 42]

Giving one character what amounts to a two-level lead over another seems significant to me. If Iris starts getting garbage levels we can always give her the next Seraphic Towel we come across.

We don't know how many cherubic dishrags we're gonna get. Stat boosters are about strength enhancement and/or weakness mitigation anyway, not making sure everyone has semi-equal statistics. Standout characters happen. FEF1 had Derrick for example, and I don't recall really feeding him any boosters.

We ought to be doing all loot management strictly IC, actually. There's potential for roleplay there, and if you won't RP you don't get any loooot, unless people are nice.

I'm not against RPing about loot management, but there are very clear reasons to construct arguments and make final decisions OOC, mostly because game mechanics are not a thing for our characters.

A lot of things COULD be addressed IC, but not all of them. And, for me at least, it'd seem more metagame-y than doing it here.

I'm pretty sure if we do it strictly IC Shea just ends up with all the stat gain items. Even for stats she'll max out or like, strength. 

"Honestly, if you're planning to try buying my hand with gifts, you may as well speak to my parents. Our house has had arranged marriages for generations."

[Criptfeind]

I was thinking more along the lines of

"Give me these trinkets peasants so that I may swell with the power of the angels and bring about a true reckoning to this world!"

[GiglameshDespair]

We ought to be doing all loot management strictly IC, actually. There's potential for roleplay there, and if you won't RP you don't get any loooot, unless people are nice.

Nah.

[IamanElfCollaborator]

I was thinking more along the lines of

"Give me these trinkets peasants so that I may swell with the power of the angels and bring about a true reckoning to this world!"

so she becomes the cecilized version

[Swordstar]

I would probably pass on getting both items lol though thanks cript.

I'm not a fan of deciding until we see after promo stats either cause hasp does them or someone goes through and figures it out. Promo will change things.

[Haspen]

The fast I get posts the faster that will happen I:

[Mopsy]

Yes. I think we're waiting for Gig and BMM now (because Alissa danced Shaelynn).