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No (flat 0.3E/T/u, break-even times 3T, 5T, 8T, 13T, 19T) (pro: Balances T4-based agents, contra: Takes forever to break even)

6 (33.3%)

Yes (1/3 creation cost/T, break-even times 3T, 3T, 3T, 3T, 3T) (pro: 3x break-even ratio preserved, contra: Low-tier races useless)

2 (11.1%)

Yes ((tier + 1)/3, break-even times 3T, 6T, 8T, 10T, 12T) (pro: Maximizes above two's strengths? contra: Maximizes above two's weaknesses?)

9 (50%)

Yes (other scale posted in thread)

1 (5.6%)

Yes (another scale posted in thread)

0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 18

[tntey]

Price Check$$$

Spoiler: Carriers (click to show/hide)

Description: Human like creatures with incredibly harry bodies and incredibly active sweat glands. Their immune system works in an incredibly complex way. When their immune system destroys or weakens a disease, it is placed into the creatures sweat and hair, letting the disease grow back to full health. Because their bodies are covered in disease, they spread a ton of disease to other creatures. There skin is filled with nutrients for diseases to feed off of.
Traits
Disease Immunity
Any others that I missed but are in the description.

Price Check$$$

Spoiler: Stranger's Throat (click to show/hide)

A bacteria that eats away at it's host's vocal cords until there is nothing left.

[hector13]

I actually quite liked the Don and his speech!

Edit: someone's kinda stealin' from MGSV

[tntey]

I actually quite liked the Don and his speech!

I loved his newyork/chicago mafia speak!

[Andres]

Good lo'd Stirk, why did you have to RP an eternally positive character

All the exclaiming..!

Yeah, I quite like that about Phonoi.

EDIT:
$$$
Price check on Action cost of training with Flux

[Stirk]

Good lo'd Stirk, why did you have to RP an eternally positive character

All the exclaiming..!

Yeah, I quite like that about Phonoi.

EDIT:
$$$
Price check on Action cost of training with Flux

Flux no longer increases, Training with it would be pointless.

[micelus]

Spoiler: Elf FLuff (click to show/hide)

Elves can best be described as a tree in full bloom, both in appearance and personalities. They are humanoid, with thin branch-like arms and legs stretching out slightly longer than base. Their bodies are completely hairless, save their head. Their hair grows short, rarely making it past their chin even when they attempt to grow it long, as they are designed to work closely with animals. Their hair is naturally vibrant and colorful, each taking the characteristics of a blooming flower. This can range from subtle whitish pink of sakura blossoms, to the yellow and orange coloration of a sunflower, to lily white, to whatever color violets are. Their bodies are sharp, fitting their branch-like quality. Sharp elbows, sharp fingers, sharp ears, sharp smiles, and especially sharp teeth. They are nearly completely carnivorous, using plants mainly to improve the taste of meat as a topping, spice, or side, or in emergencies where meat is scarce.

They are designed to Train animals, devoting much of their culture to this task. Often, their entire cities resemble the biomes of the animals they train. To outsiders, they have no different appearance than natural forest, wetlands, prairies, or whatever else they find themselves in. They typically build unobstructive buildings to keep this effect, such as hollowing out trees or building pits to live in, while molding their larger buildings to fit the area. Work-animals are extremely common for these tasks, and nearly every other one.

In general, they get along with people almost as well as they get along with animals. What is the difference, after all? Many leave their homes (often accompanied by an escort of beasts) to act as traders, or to capture new species, or to live among other races. The majority have a friendly disposition, helping them get along with both people and animals. Cheerful personalities are common, and Elves are often full of energy and life.

Spoiler: Elf Crunch (click to show/hide)

Tier 4
Attractive (2), Extremophile+1 (1), Animal Training+1?(1), Smarts +3, Persuasion+1 (1)

This is a recipe for plague. Add Immunity(disease) or they'll probably be hit hard by plague.

*Micelus frowns at the sight of GGS being used as a source.*

I don't see anything in Stirk's sheet that would expose them to the same problem as Native Americans.

[Andres]

*Micelus frowns at the sight of GGS being used as a source.*

They're not a reliable source?

I don't see anything in Stirk's sheet that would expose them to the same problem as Native Americans.

Not the same problems as the Native Americans - the same problems as the people of the Old World, i.e. having plagues but not getting wiped out because of them.


I think I found a case of contradiction within the rules.

        1 Advance = Gain a skill point xor double starting wealth (for starting equipment) (default/base: $500)

This quote says that an advance gives a skill point.

        Advances can be spent on the following, quoted from the book:

        Gain a new Edge.
        Increase one skill that is currently equal to or greater than its linked attribute.
        Increase two skills that are currently less than their linked attributes.
        Buy a new skill at d4.

This quote says that an advance gives a skill.

Step 4: Spend 15 points in skills:
        1 point for every skill die type increment below or equal to its controlling attribute (e.g. with an Agility of d6, raising a skill like Shooting to d6 or less)
        2 points for every skill die type increment above its controlling attribute (e.g. with an Agility of d6, raising a skill like Shooting to d8 or above)

According to the first quote, you getting a skill costs 1 Advance if it's lower than or equal to its controlling attribute or 2 if it's higher.
According to the second quote, an advance lets you get 2 skills if they're lower or equal to their controlling attribute or only 1 skill if it's higher.
You can get more skills per Advance going by the second quote than by the first.

[Stirk]

*Micelus frowns at the sight of GGS being used as a source.*

They're not a reliable source?

I don't see anything in Stirk's sheet that would expose them to the same problem as Native Americans.

Not the same problems as the Native Americans - the same problems as the people of the Old World, i.e. having plagues but not getting wiped out because of them.


I think I found a case of contradiction within the rules.

        1 Advance = Gain a skill point xor double starting wealth (for starting equipment) (default/base: $500)

This quote says that an advance gives a skill point.

        Advances can be spent on the following, quoted from the book:

        Gain a new Edge.
        Increase one skill that is currently equal to or greater than its linked attribute.
        Increase two skills that are currently less than their linked attributes.
        Buy a new skill at d4.

This quote says that an advance gives a skill.

Step 4: Spend 15 points in skills:
        1 point for every skill die type increment below or equal to its controlling attribute (e.g. with an Agility of d6, raising a skill like Shooting to d6 or less)
        2 points for every skill die type increment above its controlling attribute (e.g. with an Agility of d6, raising a skill like Shooting to d8 or above)

According to the first quote, you getting a skill costs 1 Advance if it's lower than or equal to its controlling attribute or 2 if it's higher.
According to the second quote, an advance lets you get 2 skills if they're lower or equal to their controlling attribute or only 1 skill if it's higher.
You can get more skills per Advance going by the second quote than by the first.

1. Not really a reliable source. I did discuss that a little before^. Reliable sources source reliable sources.

2. No, there are two different types of Advances. The first Advance is the one used when creating characters, the one you quoted for leveling them up.
Relevant quote:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

our character gains an “advance” for each Minor Hindrance
she takes (up to two), and two advances for taking a single Major
Hindrance. You’ll find a summary of core Edges & Hindrances
at the end of this document, and more can be found in your
setting book.
For 2 advances you can either:
• Gain another attribute point.
• Choose an Edge.
For 1 advance you can either:
• Gain another skill point.
• Increase starting funds by 100%

[micelus]

*Micelus frowns at the sight of GGS being used as a source.*

They're not a reliable source?

I don't see anything in Stirk's sheet that would expose them to the same problem as Native Americans.

Not the same problems as the Native Americans - the same problems as the people of the Old World, i.e. having plagues but not getting wiped out because of them.


I think I found a case of contradiction within the rules.

        1 Advance = Gain a skill point xor double starting wealth (for starting equipment) (default/base: $500)

This quote says that an advance gives a skill point.

        Advances can be spent on the following, quoted from the book:

        Gain a new Edge.
        Increase one skill that is currently equal to or greater than its linked attribute.
        Increase two skills that are currently less than their linked attributes.
        Buy a new skill at d4.

This quote says that an advance gives a skill.

Step 4: Spend 15 points in skills:
        1 point for every skill die type increment below or equal to its controlling attribute (e.g. with an Agility of d6, raising a skill like Shooting to d6 or less)
        2 points for every skill die type increment above its controlling attribute (e.g. with an Agility of d6, raising a skill like Shooting to d8 or above)

According to the first quote, you getting a skill costs 1 Advance if it's lower than or equal to its controlling attribute or 2 if it's higher.
According to the second quote, an advance lets you get 2 skills if they're lower or equal to their controlling attribute or only 1 skill if it's higher.
You can get more skills per Advance going by the second quote than by the first.

Diamond is well... Wrong. He tried to apply a general theory to history and history isn't a scientific field. It don't work. It sounds reasonable and its sounds like a really attractive idea, but you really can't apply a theory as to why history went as it did.

Also I still don't see the problem Andres; if they have plagues and aren't going extinct, what's the problem? Or do you mean the elves are supposed to be immune but lack immunity as a trait?

[Andres]

2. No, there are two different types of Advances. The first Advance is the one used when creating characters, the one you quoted for leveling them up.
Relevant quote:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

our character gains an “advance” for each Minor Hindrance she takes (up to two), and two advances for taking a single Major Hindrance. You’ll find a summary of core Edges & Hindrances at the end of this document, and more can be found in your setting book.
For 2 advances you can either:
• Gain another attribute point.
• Choose an Edge.
For 1 advance you can either:
• Gain another skill point.
• Increase starting funds by 100%

Please don't write the way you did in the spoiler. It's annoying to read. Aside from that, thanks for the explanation, but I still don't understand. How do I tell the difference between creation Advances and "level up" Advances? When does the "levelling up" happen? What are the level up Advances used for? Why is there a difference between level up Advances and creation Advances?

Also I still don't see the problem Andres; if they have plagues and aren't going extinct, what's the problem? Or do you mean the elves are supposed to be immune but lack immunity as a trait?

The point was that unless they had immunity to disease, the Elves would get occasional plagues like Old World humans did. They wouldn't go extinct but if the Black Plague showed up, that's 2/3 Elves gone.

[micelus]

That's true with every other race though lacking immunity.

[Andres]

That's true with every other race though lacking immunity.

*frustrated groan* Yes, but other races don't deal with domesticated animals as much as Elves, meaning they're less likely to come across a Black Plague and die. Do I need to continue to explain my previous reasoning for why Elves need disease immunity more than other races or is that enough?

[tntey]

That's true with every other race though lacking immunity.

*frustrated groan* Yes, but other races don't deal with domesticated animals as much as Elves, meaning they're less likely to come across a Black Plague and die. Do I need to explain my previous reasoning further or is that enough?

You're right.

[micelus]

Fluff wise, that's enough reasoning. Crunch wise, doubt anything is going to happen without some nudging.

Of course it might also just result in elves getting natural immunity over time.

[tntey]

Fluff wise, that's enough reasoning. Crunch wise, doubt anything is going to happen without some nudging.

Of course it might also just result in elves getting natural immunity over time.

You are probably right