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[Andres]

As for my character... I don't know.

Your character is a slime. Forgetting that it CAN'T be a part of the Emperor of Humankind, why is it an 'I don't know' instead of a definite 'no'?

[SOLDIER First]

I would like to point out that our characters include a hivemind of cats, a sapient giant spider, and a sapient nanocloud. As well as a transhumanist pseudofurry and a member of an uplifted alien race that has been waring itself for a long time.

"pseudofurry"

[IcyTea31]

Still not sure how it crosses any kind of moral event horizon.

• Going on a scientific endeavour specifically to fight against another species indiscriminately.
• Forgoing individuality.
• Forgoing individuality to an even greater degree than the opposing force.
• Large-scale transhumanism.
• Deliberately creating an uncontrollable being with a massive amount of power.
• Granting said being dictatorship.
• Calling said dictatorship voluntary.
• Changing the nature of human civilization forever, with unforeseeable risks.
• Not thinking what will happen when the being is no longer necessary.
• Crossing the above lines while more moral options are available.

And those are just some from top of my head. There are probably even more.

[Andres]

• Going on a scientific endeavour specifically to fight against another species indiscriminately.
• Forgoing individuality.
• Forgoing individuality to an even greater degree than the opposing force.
• Large-scale transhumanism.
• Deliberately creating an uncontrollable being with a massive amount of power.
• Granting said being dictatorship.
• Calling said dictatorship voluntary.
• Changing the nature of human civilization forever, with unforeseeable risks.
• Not thinking what will happen when the being is no longer necessary.

*Technically it's fighting against three other species - one of which is actually aggressively assimilative and the other which is giant cyborg spider kill-gods. Even then, said Emperor doesn't really have to go to war against them - just lead humanity into greatness so they can stand on the same level as the three majors.
*This is indeed bad. You're correct. It's also necessary to prevent further forgoing of individuality.
*To a greater degree, yes, but not to as great a scale. Instead of assimilating trillions of beings (like the KX9 or the Kirvek), it's assimilating somewhere between a million and a billion people, though the latter number is hugely optimistic.
*The KX9 are already doing it. This act of transhumanism is expressly for the purpose of preventing any further transhumanism.
*Uncontrollable? Uncontrollable by whom? By the rest of humanity? The only reason why humanity hasn't been controlled by the major civilisations is because they couldn't be bothered. It's really only a matter of time until one of them can be and then it's all over.
*More like a leader. The Emperor would have massive amounts of charisma and intelligence to just persuade people to join. Unless it's necessary for the survival of humanity (and he'd know if it was necessary), it's unlikely that any kind of dictatorship will be put into effect. If it is necessary, well, it's bloody necessary for the survival of humanity and therefore it must be done.
*Either the dictatorship is voluntary or it's flatout called 'the Imperium'. Either way, there's not really any real problem.
*Unless this is done, human civilisation will be eradicated entirely. It's better the short-term probable risk than the long-term certain risk.
*Either humanity dies at the end of its tenure or it doesn't. Without it, humanity is doomed for sure.

• Crossing the above lines while more moral options are available.

I believe this entire thought exercise lies on the idea that there are no other alternatives. Also, I've been thinking for days and talking to Kevak meanwhile trying to come up with a way to defeat merely ONE of humanity's overlords. This is the only idea that he hasn't shot down.

EDIT: BTW, 'Emperor' is just a working title. It doesn't necessarily mean that the new man will be the head of an empire.

[~Neri]

Aside from all the moral implications you're blatantly ignoring.

Why try to defeat them? it's not like the biggies are Trying to stop humanity from growing. Humanity simply is advancing slower then them. If humanity got its act together, it probably could at the very least, not fall further behind.

[Happy Demon]

As for my character... I don't know.

Your character is a slime. Forgetting that it CAN'T be a part of the Emperor of Humankind, why is it an 'I don't know' instead of a definite 'no'?

I meant in the voluntary sense. As in, IF she could.
She and her kind has a relation to Humanity, and would likely want to keep it away from being assimilated by the KX9.

[_DivideByZero_]

Kevak's list seems less a list of moral reasons and more a list of practical reasons.

Aside from all the moral implications you're blatantly ignoring.

Why try to defeat them? it's not like the biggies are Trying to stop humanity from growing. Humanity simply is advancing slower then them. If humanity got its act together, it probably could at the very least, not fall further behind.

If the KX9 know they are harming others through their growth then it's probably a moral evil on their part not to do anything about it. Industrial companies aren't trying to pollute African rivers, after all.

[Lenglon]

Kevak's list seems less a list of moral reasons and more a list of practical reasons. Meaningful, but not authoritative.

Aside from all the moral implications you're blatantly ignoring.

Why try to defeat them? it's not like the biggies are Trying to stop humanity from growing. Humanity simply is advancing slower then them. If humanity got its act together, it probably could at the very least, not fall further behind.

If the KX9 know they are harming others through their growth then it's probably a moral evil on their part not to do anything about it. Industrial companies aren't trying to pollute African rivers, after all.

I think you're conflating overwriting someone's culture forcefully, overwriting someone's culture peacefully, and outright genocide/xenocide.
three very different things.

[BlitzDungeoneer]

I was going to say that you probably meant 'confusing' but then I looked up 'conflating'.
In other news, I learned a new word today! Now, how best to use this to confuse my classmates...

[_DivideByZero_]

Kevak's list seems less a list of moral reasons and more a list of practical reasons. Meaningful, but not authoritative.

Aside from all the moral implications you're blatantly ignoring.

Why try to defeat them? it's not like the biggies are Trying to stop humanity from growing. Humanity simply is advancing slower then them. If humanity got its act together, it probably could at the very least, not fall further behind.

If the KX9 know they are harming others through their growth then it's probably a moral evil on their part not to do anything about it. Industrial companies aren't trying to pollute African rivers, after all.

I think you're conflating overwriting someone's culture forcefully, overwriting someone's culture peacefully, and outright genocide/xenocide.
three very different things.

I'm not. I'm saying that if overwriting someone's culture is harmful, then it doesn't matter if you do it forcibly or peacefully. You have to take into account the consequences of your actions.

Since the KX9 are amoral bastards it makes sense they'd try to justify it.

[IcyTea31]

Philosophical discussion aside, when will we actually begin? You said a couple of days, yet I'm already itching.

[~Neri]

Prolly in a few hours. Person I'm dogsitting for is coming back.

[Prophet]

I like how this turned into a debate about why making a god emperor of mankind may or may not be moral. If it was me then I wouldn't give up my individuality but I suppose if they wanted to combine into one being then it is their lives/individuality not mine so I probably wouldn't care.

[Lenglon]

I'm not. I'm saying that if overwriting someone's culture is harmful, then it doesn't matter if you do it forcibly or peacefully. You have to take into account the consequences of your actions.

Since the KX9 are amoral bastards it makes sense they'd try to justify it.

What makes it harmful or not?

[IcyTea31]

it is their lives/individuality not mine so I probably wouldn't care.

It is any of your business when they're planning to make the Emperor, well, an emperor. For all of humanity. Removing democracy like this most likely has unforeseen consequences everywhere, including your hypothetical life in this society.