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Author Topic: Paranormal 24 - Game over! Doppelganger Victory!  (Read 219694 times)

UXLZ

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Re: Paranormal 24 - Day 4 brings no hope
« Reply #1440 on: February 22, 2015, 08:15:06 pm »

If you're trying to imply that I wrote that up to condemn you and using that as a defense, are you saying you can't actually refute the arguments it presents? Whether it's from me or NQT (hint: It's from NQT) is mostly irrelevant. Besides, I am nowhere near that petty.

At least you managed to avoid the OMGUS, though.

Do note though, that he PM'd it to me last night. He may have changed his mind in some matters or come across new info

I've already posted all of the dead's scumreads. It was earlier. Do you want me to link you to it?
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Don't try to save yourself,
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Jim Groovester

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Re: Paranormal 24 - Day 4 brings no hope
« Reply #1441 on: February 22, 2015, 08:25:03 pm »

Jim: Any fishier than you complaining about people not following a plan that you had no intention of following yourself?

Doing nothing was always part of the plan, I just didn't tell anybody about it because that would defeat the whole purpose of doing nothing in the first place. If either Shakerag or Tiruin were fakeclaiming on N3 (and if everybody else had followed it) doing nothing would have caught them.

Why are you not worried about my 180 on Tiruin read?

It doesn't sound like a 180. It still looks like you suspect her to some measure.

Interest and curiosity--how did you take it?

Yeah, yeah, I'm a big fat jerk for not posting my reasons for suspecting you. Shame on me, etc. etc. etc.

Can you tell me why you're voting me?

Like this one. I want to see evident reasons on why you're thinking this, instead of making it seem like so.

I did post my reasons. Toaster hasn't done anything. Deus Asmoth's action is fishy. So is yours.

Considering how fast my reads (or anybody's by the looks of things) can change at this stage in the game building a full case on somebody would be a waste of time. I'll post reasons to convince people to lynch who I want lynched.

To put it another way, it's fucking Day 4 and I'm tired and annoyed by this game so I'm going to be lazy.

Next is the blue portion--if you're unsure, why aren't you asking him in full? I did not due to the somewhat annoying PM-game--why aren't you asking Persus, given that a recent post-track of yours only recounts DA?

I already asked Deus Asmoth those questions and it's unlikely he's going to change his story the second time around.

Persus13's choice of targets and actions seems more reasonable to me.

From memory, Cheeetar also said a plan, and you agreed in most part to it...

Nope.

That's leaving me to wonder why you're doing what you're doing. There's this bit on 'I didn't do anything last night so you should've gotten a Survive result'; on whose opinion did you take in the idea, that your TRACK/WATCH combination of powers as the press and paparazzi would have a much lesser basis, than how others would act? Did you compare your own abilities to others to determine efficiency?
Because its a bit more effective than a Telepath's...telepathy, in my case. You can WATCH someone act--and how many people do them. You can TRACK someone, and find who they do, as a general idea.

I have no idea what point you're trying to get across or what question you're trying to ask me here. Are you asking me why I didn't follow or watch somebody?

I already explained. It was to catch you fakeclaiming. It's a bad idea in retrospect since nobody else followed the plan, but in the context of the plan it's a great idea. It catches or confirms two roles at the same time; nobody would expect the reporter to do anything so if Shakerag was fakeclaiming he'd probably pick an alive target to guess as the player I visited; nobody would expect the reporter to do anything so if Tiruin was fakeclaiming she would mistakenly report a Find.

My belief on the scumteam is that they're the type who is lying low. Some team which has worked together, not overtly, that has caused such a fiasco in the lynching as of late. Specifically from D2/D2~end until now.

So we're looking for a scumteam? Because that's what it sounds like you're describing here.

How would a secret cabal of players covertly mislynch a bunch of people with their public votes? That seems like a pretty noticeable thing to do.

Speaking of players laying low, what's your opinion on Toaster and how he's basically done nothing at all since Day 2?

The plan is judged by efficiency, not by final results here. Still comparing the two proposed plans, but given everyone's such actions--there is ONE in the list that went off to KILL. I'm busy collating the claimed results of everyone's deeds of the NOW compared to those plans in seeing suspects.
Who are you to say that this is the concluding remarks? (pertaining to the orange bit) Yea, efficiency may have dropped--but that doesn't mean that there is lacking merit to it; I had the feeling that the scumteam would work along with either plan, as a only loophole that one would be a KILL rather than what was proposed.
Did nobody question that idea? (Italicized above)

You've said this before but you have yet to produce anything that would support your point.

Give me a list of people who are guaranteed not to have performed the night kill N3 that does not factor in your own alignment and role result, and I will admit to you that everybody doing whatever the fuck they felt like was worth it.

Goodness gracious arguing with you is so time consuming.
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zombie urist

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Re: Paranormal 24 - Day 4 brings no hope
« Reply #1442 on: February 22, 2015, 08:25:48 pm »

[spoiler=NQT]OK, you need to PM this to folk before you die and I can't contribute any more. Don't PM this to the suspicious players as they might act on the knowledge if they're scum.
So why didn't you PM this instead of posting it for everyone?

Urist, you're wrong, just gonna tell you now.
Did you even read the rules, man!? >_>
Quote from: Meph
Night Kill: Any kill that happens during the Night Phase. The Doppelgangers each get 1 Night Kill as a group, in addition to any allowed by Roles.
No. But reasonably scum will never have 2 nightkills and I don't think scum have any extra NKs this game otherwise we would have lost already.
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UXLZ

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Re: Paranormal 24 - Day 4 brings no hope
« Reply #1443 on: February 22, 2015, 08:32:11 pm »

I did PM it, just not to you. You're on the 'suspicious players' list.
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UXLZ

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Re: Paranormal 24 - Day 4 brings no hope
« Reply #1444 on: February 22, 2015, 08:40:26 pm »

Oh, as I mentioned, I received that last night which you may have missed.
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zombie urist

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Re: Paranormal 24 - Day 4 brings no hope
« Reply #1445 on: February 22, 2015, 08:44:41 pm »

Well one of the people you PM'd must have been scum since Cheeetar was killed last night and he was the top 'town' player according to that spreadsheet.
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Tiruin

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Re: Paranormal 24 - Day 4 brings no hope
« Reply #1446 on: February 22, 2015, 08:46:36 pm »

If you're trying to imply that I wrote that up to condemn you and using that as a defense, are you saying you can't actually refute the arguments it presents? Whether it's from me or NQT (hint: It's from NQT) is mostly irrelevant. Besides, I am nowhere near that petty.

At least you managed to avoid the OMGUS, though.
*cough* Petty (thinking)

Quote
Do note though, that he PM'd it to me last night. He may have changed his mind in some matters or come across new info

I've already posted all of the dead's scumreads. It was earlier. Do you want me to link you to it?
I'd rather like you to speak with the dead instead of for the dead. How active is the deadchat there? Are you primarily working by PMs? Is there anything stopping the use of deadchat? Because given how that seems, it looks like its an individualist-Medium instead of a Medium speaking for the whole, conglomerate dead.

Interest and curiosity--how did you take it?

Yeah, yeah, I'm a big fat jerk for not posting my reasons for suspecting you. Shame on me, etc. etc. etc.
@_@
You imply a lot, kuya.
I've never said anything there, other than...from how you take it.
Quote
Can you tell me why you're voting me?
I'm not--I voted you because...of that thing I did say up there. Interest and curiosity, because I'm curious about how your viewpoint is.
...Did other implications come to mind there?

Quote
I did post my reasons. Toaster hasn't done anything. Deus Asmoth's action is fishy. So is yours.

Considering how fast my reads (or anybody's by the looks of things) can change at this stage in the game building a full case on somebody would be a waste of time. I'll post reasons to convince people to lynch who I want lynched.

To put it another way, it's fucking Day 4 and I'm tired and annoyed by this game so I'm going to be lazy.
...You really are aware on how the wording here could be taken the wrong way right?
Given the last sentence, anyway.

I wasn't asking about your reads there--I'm asking about your consistency of judgment. Instead of how they acted all throughout, it seems that you're going with Occam's Razor because of why it seems these people did otherwise...on the implication that they are scum.
...Have you considered the efficiency of the scumteam? That's why I asked you about Persus--he's connected with DA and influenced his action, yet you haven't questioned him. I haven't corresponded at all with DA, and...I didn't ask him about that either -_-
Bloody net.
But what matters is as said before--the consistency.
Quote
I did post my reasons. Toaster hasn't done anything. Deus Asmoth's action is fishy. So is yours.
Its as if the perceived scumteam is a bunch of lazy people. And overtly fishy people.

Quote
I already asked Deus Asmoth those questions and it's unlikely he's going to change his story the second time around.

Persus13's choice of targets and actions seems more reasonable to me.
....Yet these are interconnected with each other, and Persus13 was not mentioned by you despite being in full accomplice-ish...state (my words are messy ok? :S) with DA.

Quote
Nope. {To Cheeetar's Plan}
Oops. :-X
I'll get a look back there.

Quote
I have no idea what point you're trying to get across or what question you're trying to ask me here. Are you asking me why I didn't follow or watch somebody?

I already explained. It was to catch you fakeclaiming. It's a bad idea in retrospect since nobody else followed the plan, but in the context of the plan it's a great idea. It catches or confirms two roles at the same time; nobody would expect the reporter to do anything so if Shakerag was fakeclaiming he'd probably pick an alive target to guess as the player I visited; nobody would expect the reporter to do anything so if Tiruin was fakeclaiming she would mistakenly report a Find.
Err, ok? I got it and understand the efficiency of it (as fakeclaim), but that implies that you think I'm scum firsthand--instead of using your powers; understandable, however, is the idea that I'm the killer. What's strange is that you haven't brought that up for consideration and...I seemingly had to dig it up for consideration (it wasn't mentioned before, though as an idea by Persus13 in his list of assumptions).

Why this is very important to me, is on why you didn't use your power to track me anyway, given that kind of logic. That would be a ton better to do, in all consideration.

I mean, really. If you did die and I killed you, you have UXLZ to poke as I do believe Meph does tell you that you died, and your result of tracking (before you died).
...I think.

Mephansteras: If a Reporter would track their killer (as in, killer > reporter), would they get the note that their killer did kill them? As in, who they are and what they did?

Quote
So we're looking for a scumteam? Because that's what it sounds like you're describing here.

How would a secret cabal of players covertly mislynch a bunch of people with their public votes? That seems like a pretty noticeable thing to do.

Speaking of players laying low, what's your opinion on Toaster and how he's basically done nothing at all since Day 2?
I've literally been letting him slide because from what I recall, he's had problems RL on connecting. Doing nothing == scum, here.
That's...basically it, really. ._.

Quote
You've said this before but you have yet to produce anything that would support your point.

Give me a list of people who are guaranteed not to have performed the night kill N3 that does not factor in your own alignment and role result, and I will admit to you that everybody doing whatever the fuck they felt like was worth it.

Goodness gracious arguing with you is so time consuming.
...Yeah. Exams and other fun, I should've went back to check the plans for empirical evidence, however that's my speculation on the matter.

And sure! DA is guaranteed not to have done it. Any comment on that, other than implicating him and me? (will resume later on)

Its not time consuming when it produces results, and its not an argument as we're...discussing this.


PPE *3
I did PM it, just not to you. You're on the 'suspicious players' list.
Didn't receive it either.
Oh, as I mentioned, I received that last night which you may have missed.
Not a PM by anyone, ever.

Like really--the only people I've ever talked to was Cheeet and NQT. That's why they hold a special place in my heart.


Well one of the people you PM'd must have been scum since Cheeetar was killed last night
and he was the top 'town' player according to that spreadsheet.
What brought about this idea? Cheeetar seems like a high-threat kill to me, given that NQT and Cheeet are very evident kill-targets given how they were doing their thing in the last 2 days.
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Tiruin

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Re: Paranormal 24 - Day 4 brings no hope
« Reply #1447 on: February 22, 2015, 08:50:53 pm »

If you're trying to imply that I wrote that up to condemn you and using that as a defense, are you saying you can't actually refute the arguments it presents? Whether it's from me or NQT (hint: It's from NQT) is mostly irrelevant.
Also for posterity, I am refuting it because...its really lacking. [It = activity judgement, especially when the argument in question does not fully represent the party in question] A person is most scummy due to lacking activity--ok, on what grounds is that reasonable?

Easily refuted because its a subjective case that does not factor in extremely pertinent variables, which leads to its faultiness. :v
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Deus Asmoth

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Re: Paranormal 24 - Day 4 brings no hope
« Reply #1448 on: February 22, 2015, 08:55:08 pm »

ZU:
No. But reasonably scum will never have 2 nightkills
Er... why? There are at least four roles that would give the scum team an extra night kill, though two of them aren't controllable by the person that possesses them. I don't really understand your reasoning behind thinking that because Cheeetar was killed, one of the PMed people must be scum.

Jim: it would only have caught them if people were more inclined to believe them than you, which they would have no reason whatsoever to do since you didn't tell anyone about this secret part of your plan. You couldn't PM a single person so you'd have some backup to your claim if you caught someone in a lie?
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UXLZ

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Re: Paranormal 24 - Day 4 brings no hope
« Reply #1449 on: February 22, 2015, 09:02:11 pm »

Of course you didn't receive one Tiruin, you're in the DEFINITELY LYNCH section. >_>
The people I PM'd it to were: Scripten, Cheeetar, Deus, Persus. I was originally going to send it to Jim instead of Cheeetar since I didn't like the way he'd been acting since D3 but NQT didn't want me to Looks like he was right, too.

@Tiruin: It's not only lack of activity that's making NQT condemn you so much, you know, Mrs Anecdotal Evidence.
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Ahhh~ She looked into your eyes,
And saw what laid beneath,
Don't try to save yourself,
The circle is complete.

zombie urist

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Re: Paranormal 24 - Day 4 brings no hope
« Reply #1450 on: February 22, 2015, 09:16:54 pm »

ZU:
No. But reasonably scum will never have 2 nightkills
Er... why? There are at least four roles that would give the scum team an extra night kill, though two of them aren't controllable by the person that possesses them. I don't really understand your reasoning behind thinking that because Cheeetar was killed, one of the PMed people must be scum.
The roles aren't distributed randomly. It's pretty overpowered to have 2 nks as scum and I don't ever remember a game where that has happened and I don't really count "aren't controllable" has having an NK.

Speculating too much on the NK can lead to WIFOM, but I can't really think of a good reason to kill Cheeetar as opposed to anyone else.
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UXLZ

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Re: Paranormal 24 - Day 4 brings no hope
« Reply #1451 on: February 22, 2015, 09:22:18 pm »

A theory that Cheeetar himself put forward was that people were being killed in order of experience with the game. Not sure how accurate that actually is, though.
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Ahhh~ She looked into your eyes,
And saw what laid beneath,
Don't try to save yourself,
The circle is complete.

zombie urist

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Re: Paranormal 24 - Day 4 brings no hope
« Reply #1452 on: February 22, 2015, 10:06:49 pm »

Then why aren't jim or toaster dead? That doesn't make any sense.
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Jim Groovester

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Re: Paranormal 24 - Day 4 brings no hope
« Reply #1453 on: February 22, 2015, 10:41:15 pm »

You imply a lot, kuya.
I've never said anything there, other than...from how you take it.

And here I was thinking you voted me because you thought I was scum and were withholding your reasons to make a point about how I shouldn't withhold reasons or whatever.

I'm not--I voted you because...of that thing I did say up there. Interest and curiosity, because I'm curious about how your viewpoint is.
...Did other implications come to mind there?

Why are you voting me then? You could've just asked me that stuff. I don't dodge questions.

...You really are aware on how the wording here could be taken the wrong way right?
Given the last sentence, anyway.

I also don't care.

...Have you considered the efficiency of the scumteam? That's why I asked you about Persus--he's connected with DA and influenced his action, yet you haven't questioned him. I haven't corresponded at all with DA, and...I didn't ask him about that either -_-

The what?

I have no idea what you mean by the efficiency of the scumteam.

....Yet these are interconnected with each other, and Persus13 was not mentioned by you despite being in full accomplice-ish...state (my words are messy ok? :S) with DA.

So? If they're PMing each other they're probably not both scum, because that's just redundant.

They're not conjoined at the hip so I don't have to question them like they are. At the end of the day they still have different reads, night actions, reasoning, justifications, etc., and I didn't see a problem with Persus13's so I didn't ask him anything.

I've literally been letting him slide because from what I recall, he's had problems RL on connecting. Doing nothing == scum, here.
That's...basically it, really. ._.

That's very generous of you to give a player a completely free pass at lylo. Suspiciously generous.

I am not remotely okay with this.

Jim: it would only have caught them if people were more inclined to believe them than you, which they would have no reason whatsoever to do since you didn't tell anyone about this secret part of your plan. You couldn't PM a single person so you'd have some backup to your claim if you caught someone in a lie?

If one of them was town (and followed the plan) they would confirm my action. PMing somebody else was unnecessary. Not every gambit needs a PM to somebody beforehand.

Looks like he was right, too.

Why don't you call me scum directly instead of beating around the bush like this all the time.
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UXLZ

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Re: Paranormal 24 - Day 4 brings no hope
« Reply #1454 on: February 22, 2015, 10:44:31 pm »

I meant about Cheeetar being town, not about you being scum.
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Ahhh~ She looked into your eyes,
And saw what laid beneath,
Don't try to save yourself,
The circle is complete.
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