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Author Topic: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?  (Read 12797 times)

Sam Polson

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #45 on: September 30, 2014, 09:30:17 pm »

My outlook is not rooted in... whatever you mean. I just live in human society, I see what humans do, what they tell, what their outlooks and points of view are. People are just... messed for, for the lack of the worst word.
Humans were always fighting for dominance, power and money. It's not going to change, because it is their nature. They are agressive and violent, because it's who they are, from the very beginning. Civilization doesn't mean anything for them.
And you know what? People justify everything they do, up to the worst actions they are capable of. They can even justify a rape. They treat kindness as a weakness. When I saw it, I understood that I don't want to have anything in common with these... pests.
Evil is nherent to human nature, because of evolution that went wrong and choose apes to evolve.

I don't have any hope in the good of humanity. Humanity doesn't have anything good. And blessed will be the day when all humans will die. By war, global pandemy, lack of resources or whatever. We deserved it.
« Last Edit: September 30, 2014, 09:33:02 pm by Sam Polson »
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Cheeetar

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #46 on: September 30, 2014, 11:36:01 pm »

When you say 'humanity doesn't have nothing good', what do you mean by that? Are there no good humans (me, the people trying to help you, you) or good human creations (education, healthcare, my little pony the television show)?
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I've played some mafia.

Most of the time when someone is described as politically correct they are simply correct.

Orange Wizard

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #47 on: September 30, 2014, 11:37:08 pm »

Quote
My outlook is not rooted in... whatever you mean.
She means that you see in the real world what you've been through in the past. Or thereabouts.

Quote
Evil is nherent to human nature ... I don't have any hope in the good of humanity. Humanity doesn't have anything good.
It might be human nature to do Bad StuffTM, but another part of human nature is the potential to do Good StuffTM.
For example, lots of people on this thread have taken time to talk to you, with exactly 0 chance of getting anything out of it. They're not doing this because of some kind of selfish agenda, they (me as well, but I haven't really done much) are doing it because of a very real desire to help you.
How can that possibly be bad?
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Please don't shitpost, it lowers the quality of discourse
Hard science is like a sword, and soft science is like fear. You can use both to equally powerful results, but even if your opponent disbelieve your stabs, they will still die.

Sam Polson

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #48 on: September 30, 2014, 11:46:12 pm »

When you say 'humanity doesn't have nothing good', what do you mean by that? Are there no good humans (me, the people trying to help you, you) or good human creations (education, healthcare, my little pony the television show)?

Education doesn't change anything and doesn't help anybody. Healthcare meant to make as much money as possible. So as MLP, actually. They made it as a commercial to their toys, to sell it.
I'm not a good human, you know. A good human is the one who lives by social standarts -- make more money, walk over corpses and live like an animal with corrupted mind.
I'm not like this. Some people aren't, either. And this is why we're losers, in this world.

@InsanityIncarnate

This bit about good humans and losers could be an answer to you question, too.
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Orange Wizard

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #49 on: September 30, 2014, 11:55:33 pm »

My country has a (partially, at least) state-funded healthcare system, which is by definition incapable of making money. So, no. Healthcare is about keeping people healthy.

A good human lives by social standards, sure. But a good person isn't afraid to break those standards to help people.
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Please don't shitpost, it lowers the quality of discourse
Hard science is like a sword, and soft science is like fear. You can use both to equally powerful results, but even if your opponent disbelieve your stabs, they will still die.

Cheeetar

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #50 on: September 30, 2014, 11:55:47 pm »

So you see helping people as bad? When I ask you if YOU see any good humans, I'm not asking you for what you think 'society' the vague entity would see, I'm asking what you yourself would see- are not these people and things good in your eyes?
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I've played some mafia.

Most of the time when someone is described as politically correct they are simply correct.

Sam Polson

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #51 on: October 01, 2014, 12:02:54 am »

My country has a (partially, at least) state-funded healthcare system, which is by definition incapable of making money. So, no. Healthcare is about keeping people healthy.

A good human lives by social standards, sure. But a good person isn't afraid to break those standards to help people.
Eeyup. You know why? To keep cattle healthy to make more money by taxes, buying stuff and such. Also, cannon fodder. Don't fool yourself, please. It's obvious.
And a good person would help others just for their own benefit. Not because they really want it or doing it just for help's sake.

@Cheeetar

In my eyes they are good, but in society's eyes -- they aren't. Quite opposite, actually.
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Cheeetar

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #52 on: October 01, 2014, 12:03:50 am »

So you disagree with your earlier conclusion that humanity has nothing good?
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I've played some mafia.

Most of the time when someone is described as politically correct they are simply correct.

Sam Polson

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #53 on: October 01, 2014, 12:10:56 am »

So you disagree with your earlier conclusion that humanity has nothing good?
No, I don't. Humanity has nothing good to offer. Nothing that I want, too.
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Cheeetar

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #54 on: October 01, 2014, 12:12:03 am »

You're contradicting yourself. Humanity contains that which you claim to see as good (for example, the people trying to help you) but you also claim that humanity has nothing good to offer.
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I've played some mafia.

Most of the time when someone is described as politically correct they are simply correct.

Darkmere

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #55 on: October 01, 2014, 12:12:53 am »

Alright, then. Here's the facts from someone with a history of escapist addictions, depression, and sometimes emotional self-destruction:

The pony fantasy isn't the problem. It's a symptom. There's an unfortunate fact that's pretty easy to miss if you haven't been in the same shitpit. Here's the fact:

The problem is you.

No, NOT that you're a bad person, or that the world is bad, or that a cartoon escapist reality is better. Your worldview is an outward projection of yourself, your image of where you fit and why. The problem is your willingness to give in to doubt and listen to that fucking moronic voice in your head that says you aren't good enough, or smart enough, or hot enough, or skinny enough, successful enough, greedy enough. I'm guessing somewhere there's people in your life who have told you that before. Probably many times. If not specific people, some culture, or situation, or life circumstance. Well fuck them. Fuck it. You're YOU and you captain your own destiny.

You are good enough.

There's something else you also seem to miss. Lots of other people feel pretty shitty too. Most of the time, actually. The difference between you and them is lots of them are too afraid to admit it to themselves, especially in public. You're stronger than them already, so you've taken the first step.

I'm not going to tell you to take the next one now. Change is really damn hard and sometimes it just takes a while to process. One day you may wake up ready, or life can punch you in the ego and kick your ass until you have no choice. But it will happen. You'll still hear the same old voice telling you how bad you suck or how pointless the world is, but there's another that quietly says "wait, maybe I really can change things for the better." If you hear nothing else from me, remember this when that day comes:

Damn right, you can.
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And then, they will be weaponized. Like everything in this game, from kittens to babies, everything is a potential device of murder.
So if baseless speculation is all we have, we might as well treat it like fact.

Sam Polson

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #56 on: October 01, 2014, 12:20:23 am »

You're contradicting yourself. Humanity contains that which you claim to see as good (for example, the people trying to help you) but you also claim that humanity has nothing good to offer.
No, I'm not contradicting myself. Yes, people are trying to help me, here and yes, humanity has nothing good to offer. It is not a contradiction. Just think about it.

@Darkmere.

It's not the voice or whatever. I just don't fit this world, like I said. I'm too soft, too weak, too sappy and too kind for it. I'd fit much better in Equestria, far less harsh world than this one. And there I'd be somebody I always wanted to be. I'd be helping ponies and be kind to them. Because they are ponies. One word tells everything.
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Darkmere

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #57 on: October 01, 2014, 12:24:48 am »

*shrug* My point remains whether you consciously process it or deny and repress it. It's a personal truth that will be there for you when you're ready to accept it.
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And then, they will be weaponized. Like everything in this game, from kittens to babies, everything is a potential device of murder.
So if baseless speculation is all we have, we might as well treat it like fact.

Sam Polson

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #58 on: October 01, 2014, 12:31:21 am »

Fine by me.
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Tiruin

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #59 on: October 01, 2014, 01:30:28 am »

Let me make an educated guess about why you view humanity as such, Sam. (correct me if I'm wrong, ok? :O)

You say that Humanity, with its inherent nature, is doomed to failure (or at least that's what I get in paraphrasing it) as those who strive for success are stamped down and corrected in the wrongest way ever. This has a term in my society (crab mentality ._.).

My guess starts here.
My outlook is not rooted in... whatever you mean. I just live in human society, I see what humans do, what they tell, what their outlooks and points of view are. People are just... messed for, for the lack of the worst word.
Humans were always fighting for dominance, power and money. It's not going to change, because it is their nature. They are agressive and violent, because it's who they are, from the very beginning. Civilization doesn't mean anything for them.
And you know what? People justify everything they do, up to the worst actions they are capable of. They can even justify a rape. They treat kindness as a weakness. When I saw it, I understood that I don't want to have anything in common with these... pests.
Evil is nherent to human nature, because of evolution that went wrong and choose apes to evolve.

I don't have any hope in the good of humanity. Humanity doesn't have anything good. And blessed will be the day when all humans will die. By war, global pandemy, lack of resources or whatever. We deserved it.

This post, connected mainly, to this post.
He was driven to attach himself to MLP this strongly mainly because of his being bullied at a young age (he hadn't found the show back then, though), domestic problems of the worst kind with his father, and the all-around sense of absolute backwardness, uncaring, and anger that he had to deal with in his community over the years -- which has shown little to no signs of getting better.
Pertaining, to your childhood.

Now, this is where my guess on the root of your outlook comes from--at an age wherein knowledge is accepted, yet personal emotions are in play. Childhood. You wonder why such acts were committed to you, perhaps in the way that when you did right, it was not acknowledged; there lacked a sense of 'being' or connection between you and those society notes as the basic block of a community. While a single person, even a figure which has much respect as a personal relation ascribed to it may be faulted like this, it was deeper. Your community had that attitude, and as far as you could see during those early years, it was an attitude which was prevalent, continuous and ever-present.

Mayhap, I guess, this is what you question. Why they were like that. Why were they acting like such, when you did not share their ideas, or something parallel to that idea.
You know you weren't, and aren't like them or share their manners of attitude, despite its prominent existence around you. You are not like them, despite how mostly everyone shared or revolved around the aspects of the same character. Which belies how you see people now.

My outlook is not rooted in... whatever you mean. I just live in human society, I see what humans do, what they tell, what their outlooks and points of view are. People are just... messed for, for the lack of the worst word.
Humans were always fighting for dominance, power and money. It's not going to change, because it is their nature. They are agressive and violent, because it's who they are, from the very beginning. Civilization doesn't mean anything for them.
And you know what? People justify everything they do, up to the worst actions they are capable of. They can even justify a rape. They treat kindness as a weakness. When I saw it, I understood that I don't want to have anything in common with these... pests.
Evil is nherent to human nature, because of evolution that went wrong and choose apes to evolve.

I don't have any hope in the good of humanity. Humanity doesn't have anything good. And blessed will be the day when all humans will die. By war, global pandemy, lack of resources or whatever. We deserved it.
Which leads to this kind of narrow outlook--it is a whole outlook, judging those people around you. But primarily, it was shaped because of what you saw empirically in your environment, right?

Because its pretty plaintive when we ask about your outlook.
You're contradicting yourself. Humanity contains that which you claim to see as good (for example, the people trying to help you) but you also claim that humanity has nothing good to offer.
No, I'm not contradicting myself. Yes, people are trying to help me, here and yes, humanity has nothing good to offer. It is not a contradiction. Just think about it.

@Darkmere.

It's not the voice or whatever. I just don't fit this world, like I said. I'm too soft, too weak, too sappy and too kind for it. I'd fit much better in Equestria, far less harsh world than this one. And there I'd be somebody I always wanted to be. I'd be helping ponies and be kind to them. Because they are ponies. One word tells everything.
There are no distinct examples, but generalizing. There are no specifics, but statements about 'this is, what is'.

Your narrowmindedness presented here seems very much as an offshoot of those around you.

Again, represented in that link I forwarded.
Basically, a note in psych. Here.
Wherein my guess is whatever affects your environment gave you, was the only thing to latch on--as if that wasn't a valid option, then you'd actually put some merit into humanity, no matter how little it is--leading to how you differentiate moral constructs and ethical measures...a very blurred line.
When you say 'humanity doesn't have nothing good', what do you mean by that? Are there no good humans (me, the people trying to help you, you) or good human creations (education, healthcare, my little pony the television show)?

Education doesn't change anything and doesn't help anybody. Healthcare meant to make as much money as possible. So as MLP, actually. They made it as a commercial to their toys, to sell it.
I'm not a good human, you know. A good human is the one who lives by social standarts -- make more money, walk over corpses and live like an animal with corrupted mind.
I'm not like this. Some people aren't, either. And this is why we're losers, in this world.

@InsanityIncarnate

This bit about good humans and losers could be an answer to you question, too.
Like what you define 'good', here. That is not good...nor is that the standard of society.
Good == corrupt?
You need to do some self-assessing there.  :-\

Because nobody can help you if you keep a closed ear, and further yet a closed mind.
« Last Edit: October 01, 2014, 01:42:43 am by Tiruin »
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