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Author Topic: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?  (Read 12768 times)

Sam Polson

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #15 on: September 29, 2014, 09:12:15 pm »

Well, if it's a positive message, which means, a good one, why don't everyone follow it, huh? What's all the fuss?
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NullForceOmega

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #16 on: September 29, 2014, 09:27:41 pm »

There are as many opinions and messages as there are stars in the night sky, you will never find two human beings with the same world views.  It would likely be much easier for everyone if we could find a single message that had universal appeal, but that is unlikely.  Humans are deeply flawed creatures, and everything we create has flaws, from ethics to laws, from language to math, nothing humans make is perfect.  But perfection is a goal, one we can never reach, but we do in fact continue to strive for every day.

There will always be people who you disagree with you, and there will always be people you do not agree with, this very diversity of opinions is what leads to the creation of positive values such as cooperation.  I don't like MLP, but I do care about other people, so we are unlikely to ever agree on anything to do with MLP, but we can still have a meaningful dialog, that allows both of us to come to an understanding of each other.  This will be the same with every single person you meet, some things you will be able to share, and others you won't.
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Grey morality is for people who wish to avoid retribution for misdeeds.

NullForceOmega is an immortal neanderthal who has been an amnesiac for the past 5000 years.

Sam Polson

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #17 on: September 29, 2014, 09:32:17 pm »

I'm not talking about perfection. Equestria isn't perfect either. Even communism isn't perfect. But it has so, so many banefits and so little flaws that you might as well call it near-perfect. The same is with Equestria. There's a whole world, created by people. And if people can do something like this, then why don't they follow it? It's their ideas after all. just follow the right ideas. It's so easy. Even I understand it.
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NullForceOmega

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #18 on: September 29, 2014, 09:42:12 pm »

It's never that easy.  You see, you just brought up another point that we will never be able to agree on, that you believe that communism has many benefits and few flaws, but that discussion is for the politics threads, this is about helping each other deal with the world.

You want to know why people can't just follow the concepts they created?  It's called human nature, and it is the single greatest flaw AND strength of the human being.  Humans are greedy, they horde resources for their own use, why?  It's a survival mechanism, by controlling resources the person can increase their ability to survive and procreate  (by the way, this ties into why communism is not viable as a large scale system).  Humans are violent, why?  Survival again, nature is harsh, very, very harsh, and you have to be able to aggressively act to survive against the elements, other life-forms, and other humans.

We can go back and forth about the specifics, but the truth is that the world is exactly as terrible a place as you allow it to be in your own mind.  I believe that the world is a good place filled with stupid people, who don't have the ability to see eye-to-eye, you are free to believe as you choose, but you still have to recognize that this is the world, and it's not going to change unless you try to make your place in it better.
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Grey morality is for people who wish to avoid retribution for misdeeds.

NullForceOmega is an immortal neanderthal who has been an amnesiac for the past 5000 years.

Sam Polson

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #19 on: September 29, 2014, 09:51:16 pm »

There were people who tried to make this place better. Lots of them. And where are they now? And where are results of their actions? They are laughed on, mocked, treated like freaks or even turned into monsters from kids' books, like Joseph Stalin.
People who tried to build a better society, or at least improve it are doomed to faillure, as we've seen it in human history.
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NullForceOmega

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #20 on: September 29, 2014, 10:12:13 pm »

That is a fairly good point, but the fact is that society has grown and improved due to (most of) their actions.  I'm not here to argue comparative history however.  I am here to try to lend what help I might be able too.  I don't know your life, your story, and I'm not going to try to tell you that horrible things aren't true.  I've done more than a few of them myself.

Here's some perspective:  When I was thirteen I was an enforcer for a Midwest  U.S. gang called the Gangster's Disciples, I broke into people's homes, brutally beat men in front of their families, sent more people than I can clearly remember to the hospital and permanently crippled several of them.  I did this because a very good friend of mine was dealing drugs and couldn't keep up with his 'rent', and in order for his supplier to not have him thrown in jail or killed I had to do work for the gang.  At several points I very seriously considered suicide, once going so far as to climb into my tub with a razor.  Now it's eighteen years later and I'm married to a wonderful woman who is currently studying to receive a PhD in soil science, and am father to two wonderful young boys.  I do very seriously regret what I did in those early years of my teenage life, but if I hadn't been that person I wouldn't be the person I am now.

If you focus on the bad things, then life will feel like shit.  If you focus on the good things, life will be a dream.  It's up to you how you want to view the world.  From someone who has really thought about ending his own life, it really can get better, it really, really can.
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Grey morality is for people who wish to avoid retribution for misdeeds.

NullForceOmega is an immortal neanderthal who has been an amnesiac for the past 5000 years.

Sam Polson

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #21 on: September 29, 2014, 10:21:25 pm »

Well, I don't think I need to any evidences, anyway. If people are capable to such deeds, there's not hope for them to not just improve the world, but even one community.
Maybe it's an agressive type of humans' nature, because we evolved from apes, which've been known as really agressive animals.
Maybe it's an agressive environment or whatever.
I don't know. But you know what? I don't even want to know. I just see what is happening -- here, there, no matter. And I can tell for certain -- I don't want a tiny bit of it. I'm not agressive. Far from it. Maybe in my case evolution's gone wrong. I don't fit in this world, because I can't be cruel and heartless. I'm too soft and weak for this place.
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NullForceOmega

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #22 on: September 29, 2014, 10:34:05 pm »

Is that conviction or avoidance?  I'm honestly curious.  These things have happened since the dawn of life, we humans are gifted with comprehension, so we have the capacity to consider our actions and their merits.  I hate to see people hurt, and I hated myself for hurting others, but the world doesn't always let us pick our battles.  Life is a struggle, the rewards are many, and I at least feel that it has been worth it.  If I die tomorrow I at least pass on in the knowledge that I experienced the highs and the lows.  I have both harmed and improved the communities I have lived in, just like every other person who has ever lived.  If you die tomorrow, what will you feel about it?  Will you be happy that you don't have to experience the many sorrows of life?  Will you be sad that you did not get to experience the good things life has to offer?  Will you just not care?

If you feel that talking about how you feel about this I'll be on for another hour or so, and I am listening.
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Grey morality is for people who wish to avoid retribution for misdeeds.

NullForceOmega is an immortal neanderthal who has been an amnesiac for the past 5000 years.

Sam Polson

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #23 on: September 29, 2014, 10:44:32 pm »

If I die tomorrow, it'd be nice.
You see, the things is -- even good things as you put them, that this life could offer... they aren't good. Like, at all. People could be happy to have them, but not me. I'm not like many of them.
Besides, what good things? Weath? Popularity? Kids? What? I don't want any of that. Not in here.
This world itself doesn't fit me. It's too harsh and demanding. You can't have a decent life just by being kind and trying to help everyone. They will take advantage even on the most innocent and kind help in the horrible way and left you broken. Friends will leave you, even if it's not quite their fault. Circumstances. Surrounding. The world.
Like I said, I don't fit in here. I'm too soft and sappy for this place. I was born in the wrong race, I'm sure of it.
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NullForceOmega

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #24 on: September 29, 2014, 10:55:34 pm »

Then what exactly do you feel would make you happy?  If the things that are the best things you can possibly hope to get out of life on Earth aren't good enough I really would like to know what is.  Want world peace? Nope, not going to happen until one group subjugates all others and assimilates them into their culture.  Cure for cancer?  Maybe, but not for free and not soon.  To meet the cast of MLP and befriend them?  It is a fantasy television program, you could meet the humans who do the voice acting, the director who puts the episodes together, or the writers who assemble the stories you love.  Not good enough?  Sorry, the world cannot work that way, you HAVE to play the hand you've been dealt.  Even if you think that sounds horrible, maybe the real issue is that you have no clue how good it can be.  I really hate to be this harsh, but I have lost a LOT of friends to violence and suicide, and I hate to see anyone take that route if another option exists.
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Grey morality is for people who wish to avoid retribution for misdeeds.

NullForceOmega is an immortal neanderthal who has been an amnesiac for the past 5000 years.

Sam Polson

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #25 on: September 29, 2014, 11:04:07 pm »

I'm glad for you, you know. If you truly don't see what I see about this world, they you surely can live here. Or maybe you've seen everything and much more than I (most probably) but you think that good things overmatch bad ones. Even in this case, good for you.
I don't want it. I don't need a world peace, a cure for cancer, or meeting anyone from the show's cast.
I want Equestria. I meant to live in there. I fit that world perfectly. Ponies wouldn't even guess that I'm from Earth, unless I'd tell them -- my behavior and attitude matches theirs perfectly.
As for death... that would help me to go to Equestria. After death. Like, you know there is a birthright, right? Well, it'd be something I call the deathright.
And yes, I believe in this. After all, billions of people believe in God without any solid proves from their side. Why can't I believe in this?
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NullForceOmega

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #26 on: September 29, 2014, 11:22:20 pm »

Again, believe what you will, that is your prerogative, and I would never try to get you to give it up.  Though you can't see it from where you are, the good DOES outweigh the bad, you need proof?  There are 7.7 BILLION humans on Earth.  Far less than 1% (16 out of 100,000) of them commit suicide, so I'd say overall that life is quite bearable, and even good to the majority.  I can't change your mind, only you can do that.  But I can tell you with ABSOLUTE certainty, that even you, as weak willed and terrified as you are, can live a happy, healthy life, and then, when nature has decided that you've lived long enough, then you can find out for certain what waits on the other side.  But you will never know what the world has for you if you commit suicide, and that is frankly the worst thing I am capable of imagining, and I wouldn't wish it on the people I hate the most in this world.
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Grey morality is for people who wish to avoid retribution for misdeeds.

NullForceOmega is an immortal neanderthal who has been an amnesiac for the past 5000 years.

Orange Wizard

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #27 on: September 29, 2014, 11:27:17 pm »

Just popping in to say that I am hoping for the very best outcome for Sam here.

Which is why I'm obligated to (again) recommend professional help. I'm not qualified to assist you, as much as I'd like to. Just remember that the world doesn't have to be good for you to be.
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Sam Polson

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #28 on: September 29, 2014, 11:30:45 pm »

I don't want to live in this horrible, brutal and cruel, dream-crushing, humiliating and careless world, full of people who just... beyond mean.
If you put a pony in here, they'd either die or go nuts in no time. Because of bad things that some people treat as good, and of good things that ponies would treat as barely tolerable at best.
The very thought of living here for decades makes me scared and tired at the same time. I already lived long than I want, 'cause I'm almost 23 now. I want to ponies' world. I belong there.
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Sam Polson

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Re: Friend with a particular attachment problem. Can anyone relate?
« Reply #29 on: September 29, 2014, 11:31:27 pm »

Just popping in to say that I am hoping for the very best outcome for Sam here.

Which is why I'm obligated to (again) recommend professional help. I'm not qualified to assist you, as much as I'd like to. Just remember that the world doesn't have to be good for you to be.
I don't care about this world. I don't need it.
And I don't have intentions to end upp in an asylum.
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