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[Ludorum Rex]

And for the love of god if development ceases, just open the floodgates and release everything you have.

I've seen quite a few people suggest, demand or ask that the assets and source code be released to the backers. It is highly unlikely that the assets made by 3rd party artists can be released into the public domain like that - the license for their use is almost certainly tied to this specific game. The same for the Unity store assets and modules/toolkits/frameworks - releasing those to the public would also be a breach of a licensing agreement. So it's a non-option to do this.

[Malus]

And for the love of god if development ceases, just open the floodgates and release everything you have.

I've seen quite a few people suggest, demand or ask that the assets and source code be released to the backers. It is highly unlikely that the assets made by 3rd party artists can be released into the public domain like that - the license for their use is almost certainly tied to this specific game. The same for the Unity store assets and modules/toolkits/frameworks - releasing those to the public would also be a breach of a licensing agreement. So it's a non-option to do this.

I don't think I'd agree it's a "non-option" though obviously it depends on what the nature of the codebase is. If it's literally all cobbled together from scripts he bought off the Unity marketplace then you're right, but surely there's a substantial amount of code he's written and has complete ownership of, right? He doesn't need to put it into the public domain either: you can release source code and retain copyright over it. And he could certainly release the art assets, unless he has a really gnarly contract with the artists. He can't release those into the public domain, but he could release a "build" of the game to backers with the assets packaged alongside it, with all rights reserved just like any other game release, and then separately release the source code (third-party libraries notwithstanding), Doom/Quake-style.

As far as I know, no one's even seen the source code so it's impossible to know what the situation is. If parts of the code are plagiarized, then I can even understand why he might not be willing to show off any of it publicly. But at this point, releasing even just scraps of this product that's been in development for 2 years would be an immense show of good faith toward the community that's supported him financially for so long.

[SangerZonvolt]

Let us know if the unban deal goes okay or if things go to shit again. Even if the details are personal, a "things are good" or "things are not good" is still useful information.

If things go the way the developer has descripted in his mail then it wouldn´t be the outcome I would have liked, but I would call it "acceptable" for me personaly.

[forsaken1111]

And for the love of god if development ceases, just open the floodgates and release everything you have.

I've seen quite a few people suggest, demand or ask that the assets and source code be released to the backers. It is highly unlikely that the assets made by 3rd party artists can be released into the public domain like that - the license for their use is almost certainly tied to this specific game. The same for the Unity store assets and modules/toolkits/frameworks - releasing those to the public would also be a breach of a licensing agreement. So it's a non-option to do this.

Wouldn't it be possible to include a license with the release stating that the assets are only for use with the game? You can get at most game assets once you buy a game anyway, it isn't that hard to extract them but you're still not allowed to reuse them without permission

[Ludorum Rex]

Wouldn't it be possible to include a license with the release stating that the assets are only for use with the game? You can get at most game assets once you buy a game anyway, it isn't that hard to extract them but you're still not allowed to reuse them without permission

The Unity Asset Store license agreement has this:

"Licensor grants to the END-USER a non-exclusive, worldwide, and perpetu- al license to the Asset to integrate Assets only as incorporated and embed- ded components of electronic games and interactive media and distribute such electronic game and interactive media. END-USER may otherwise not reproduce, distribute, sublicense, rent, lease or lend the Assets."

That means that assets cannot be distributed as image files, even with a clause they can only be used with the supplied source code. When art is commissioned directly there is usually a similar clause. Open sourcing a tanking project will almost invariably require stripping all 3rd party assets from the project before releasing. Note that this clause also includes various libraries and source code files.

From the screenshots and videos I've seen, that means that in practice open sourcing TWS would not be legal without removing large amounts of content. That's not a particular pleasant task to spend a lot of time on, for a developer who is probably already quite down for obvious reasons.

[forsaken1111]

So release the code sans assets and have an 'asset pack' mod that stores the assets in the approved format and must be downloaded from their website? There must be a way to do it that allows others to help with the game without breaking the license, but I admit I'm not really familiar with the license terms and applicable law. I'm just a hobby coder really

[Farce]

I dunno why people are talkin' so much shit, like it's a surprise games miss their planned release dates, let alone indie ones, where there isn't really a professional management team aspect or whatever tasked with keeping people to schedules and stuff.  Like, isn't one of the contrasting highlights of indie vs industry that indie developers DON'T push it out before it's done?

Though, my approach to Kickstarters has kinda always been 'pay the money and check back in a year or two, and hope the gamble paid off', so.  It's taking longer than predicted or expected for That Which Sleeps, but it's still like one of the things I'm anticipating the most.

[nenjin]

For reals. *points to RCR:U* Last deadline was supposed to be Q4 2015, then Q1 2016 and now we're looking at probably Q4 2016. Didn't actually get anything playable out of it for nearly two years after it completed its Kickstarter campaign.

[sirvente]

It's a turn based strategy game where you can't press end turn over a year after they said it was nearly done but for the final spit and polish. I mean I don't mind so much because I backed through paypal but good luck getting a game with that kind of screwed up development

[nenjin]

Final spit and polish is putting it too strongly. They had bugs to fix and ones serious enough that it clearly overturned the original plan. What it says about a dev who thought their game was ready but then had it completely derailed by something unforseen....I don't know. But ultimately the real problem is that since the tides have turned against them, Josh has stopped speaking to what is going on directly. If people understood the problem, they'd be less likely (although no completely unlikely) to just decide on the narrative themselves. I get it though. When the mouthpiece of the developer is seemingly at their wit's end, that kind of drama makes it hard to assume things will pan out in the end.

[sirvente]

I didn't say it was the case that 2014 That Which Sleeps was done but for the art. I'm pretty sure the game was completely unplayable and Josh was lying to someone, us or himself or both when he claimed he had an almost finished product at hand.

[Xantalos]

They did talk about completely rewriting a lot of the game's code to fit in the procedural generation and all; it's possible there once was a game but they took it apart to make it better and haven't put it back together again yet.

[nenjin]

I didn't say it was the case that 2014 That Which Sleeps was done but for the art. I'm pretty sure the game was completely unplayable and Josh was lying to someone, us or himself or both when he claimed he had an almost finished product at hand.

You mean done before he added in a metric fuck ton of stretch goals? That done? I don't doubt he overestimated his abilities and his game's completeness. But let's at least try to be partially fair here.

[forsaken1111]

I don't think people realize how big of a step it is to go from hand-made maps and static scenarios to procedurally generated maps/textures, easily user-editable maps and scenarios, etc.

[Egan_BW]

Note to self: if I ever make a game kickstarter, no fucking stretch goals.