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Author Topic: Choose-Your-Own-Masquerade - Dance 3 - TOWN WIN  (Read 90304 times)

Jiokuy

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Re: Choose-Your-Own-Masquerade - The First Dance Has Begun
« Reply #180 on: July 27, 2014, 05:23:22 pm »

Adding my Extend vote to the pile. This will need some serious sorting though. Will do a more complex analysis in ~6 hours.

So we have two players claiming masks.
One of who has been hit by a scum changeling. (not confirmed, but seems probable)
He's given us a pretty strong lead on figuring out who might have targeted him, but it could also be part of some meta-plot.
(if he is scum and one of his scumbuddies claims an information role. Nahh it's too early for that, it would be dangerous for them to implicate 2/3 of the scumteam in the D1 Mys-lynch)
With the above as my logic I am inclined to believe him for now.

Everyone: So what are the advantages to claiming masks?

Tolyk, Tirun, Toony, and Toaster:In your opinion what are the chances that he's faking the lover to direct the scum-kill to Toaster?

One more note, in Supernatural when I was sure I was going to die I acted a lot like Scripten is acting now (I think). I don't entirely know where I'm going with this, but I'm inclined to believe he fears for his life. (although as a tree-stump for all intents and purposes I don't know if the scum would waste a kill on him anymore)
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TolyK

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Re: Choose-Your-Own-Masquerade - The First Dance Has Begun
« Reply #181 on: July 27, 2014, 05:34:37 pm »

Hold your horses.
Don't we get an extension per person? And lovers are one-way deals, right? nqt

And scum can't directly target Toaster, so I'm not sure that would work. It would be good if people refrained from claiming masks though just yet.
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My Mafia Stats
just do whatevery tolyK and blame it as a bastard mod
Shakerag: Who are you personally suspicious of?
At this point?  TolyK.

notquitethere

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Re: Choose-Your-Own-Masquerade - The First Dance Has Begun
« Reply #182 on: July 27, 2014, 05:59:42 pm »

"I'm having such a great time!" cries one of the revellers swigging a horn of port. "I hope this dance never ends!"

Masks
Lemon
Ochre
Scarlet
Ultramarine
Turquoise
Brown
White
Chrome
Black
Beige
Emerald
Puce

Guest List - Formal Requests For Unmasking
Reverie
Tiruin
Toaster
Deathsword - [2]
Varee
Wolf - [2]
Toony
Silthuri
Scripten
TolyK - [1]
Jiokuy
Flabort

Has used their extend: Scripten

The day has been extended. Hammer is 7 votes. Day ends when the hammer falls, or Tuesday 4PM BST (GMT+1).



Jiokuy
Adding my Extend vote to the pile.
Everyone has a one-shot 24 hour extend, I'm going to assume as Scripten's went through that you don't want to use yours yet.

TolyK
Don't we get an extension per person? And lovers are one-way deals, right? nqt
Correct on both counts.
« Last Edit: July 28, 2014, 05:09:55 am by notquitethere »
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Varee

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Re: Choose-Your-Own-Masquerade - The First Dance Has Begun
« Reply #183 on: July 27, 2014, 06:48:22 pm »

I cant make a full post right now. But wow at the turn of event give me a few more hour to see if i find time to write.
Also i used that changling stop blaming people it my fault.....
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ToonyMan

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Re: Choose-Your-Own-Masquerade - The First Dance Has Begun
« Reply #184 on: July 27, 2014, 07:07:24 pm »

Tolyk, Tirun, Toony, and Toaster:In your opinion what are the chances that he's faking the lover to direct the scum-kill to Toaster?
Unlikely.



I cant make a full post right now. But wow at the turn of event give me a few more hour to see if i find time to write.
Also i used that changling stop blaming people it my fault.....
You used the changeling? Did you hope to hit scum? Because if Scripten is town you really screwed him over for like, no reason.

What was your plan of action really?
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flabort

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Re: Choose-Your-Own-Masquerade - The First Dance Has Begun
« Reply #185 on: July 27, 2014, 08:49:09 pm »

I cant make a full post right now. But wow at the turn of event give me a few more hour to see if i find time to write.
Also i used that changling stop blaming people it my fault.....
The heck man? You had me worried! But you have me MORE worried now!

What are you thinking saying this?
If you ARE scum, then saying this means that you've just signed a death warrant, Varee. If you're town, then you've just admitted to screwing over another towny, and what are you doing with six unspent points?

This seems like the most illconcieved claim of all the illconcieved claims just this game! We're not even to day 2, and HOW many people have started claiming stuff?
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The Cyan Menace

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Scripten

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Re: Choose-Your-Own-Masquerade - The First Dance Has Begun
« Reply #186 on: July 27, 2014, 09:30:50 pm »

WHAT THE HELL?

Seriously? If you're town, Varee, shame on you. If you're scum... well, good job, I guess? Anyway, I'm going to keep the FoS on you, 4maskwolf, but yeah, this is kind of impossible to ignore.

Unvote 4maskwolf
Vote Varee


*SIGH*
Well, at least there's no way we can say this has been a boring game!
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Jiokuy

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Re: Choose-Your-Own-Masquerade - The First Dance Has Begun
« Reply #187 on: July 27, 2014, 11:21:17 pm »

I am so confuzled. I mean the basic complexity of mafia + the three variants was already. This is one hell of a Day One. eithir mafia went for

Lets assume for a second that Varee is mafia, well he stole some pretty powerful abilities, but they are all town sided. Is he dangerous (he could buy a kill with those 6 pts). Information roles might be able to clear his name though?

What if he is town aligned? Is it a good idea to further dig us in this hole? Honestly I cannot see a sane scum doing this, but then again I also can't see a sane town doing this either. He turned himself in, that makes me think he has a town lean. Is he a dick, oh hell yes; is he scum?, Using the English definition sure. The mafia definition, I don't think so.

I am against a policy lynch. I will only support this lynch if the alternative is a no lynch D1.

Also, a message directed to the town healers \/ (if we have any)(4mask?), footnote: please don't claim of course.
Everyone: Is it worth trying to "fix" Scripten with cleanses? I think we should leave the individual decisions to each healer to preserve anonymity, but everyone should be ale to weigh in on this debate. Is it worth it?

But if Varee isn't scum who is? Ugh this is like the IG debacle (though to be fair he was scum). :I
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flabort

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Re: Choose-Your-Own-Masquerade - The First Dance Has Begun
« Reply #188 on: July 27, 2014, 11:31:26 pm »

Speaking as someone who does not have cleanse, no I don't think it's worth trying to fix Scripten with cleanse, because I have a plan to fix Scripten already, assuming Scripten and Varee are not lying; and to find out if there IS a lie there, too. (And it's NOT a mercy killing or a killing of any sort!)

This is assuming, of course, that Scripten does not die, which as the scum probably consider her to be an empty useless husk now, she probably will survive while they kill someone else.
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The Cyan Menace

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Silthuri

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Re: Choose-Your-Own-Masquerade - The First Dance Has Begun
« Reply #189 on: July 28, 2014, 12:10:25 am »

TolyK:
And, I just thought of a question I'd like to ask Deathsword, Reverie and Silthuri: When do you think it would be appropriate for all the people to say which masks are whose (i.e. roleset-claim?) in order to figure out inspect results of everyone?
I should think it should be done when massclaims are usually done. Like LYLO. But with the mask swapping ability, unless we had peekers to confirm claims, it wouldn't be very useful.


Flabort:
Silthuri There are two "red" masks, Puce and Scarlet. If one of them had to be scum, and you had to guess between those two, which would you guess? If you had to guess between Lemon, Chrome, and Black, which would you guess?
Puce because that's a horrible color. Going by just color, I'd say black because black is associated with darkness and thus evil. Although I highly doubt that the mask colors would have been handed out based on alignment.

Everyone What are your feelings on the power modifiers? Which ones are most useful, and which are not worth their cost? What are your feelings on Hidden, specifically?
I think that Innate is very good for town with strong powers. Self targeting could be useful, especially with protects and peek. Free would also be very useful. Hidden, however, could go both ways. Scum would most likely want to be hidden, but town with strong powers might want to keep their moves secret to live another day.


4mask:
Everyone: What are your opinions of townies having kills? non-self cleanses?  Gifts? gossip? vote-stealer?
Kills: Quite dangerous to the town, even with good intentions due to the masks. If paired with peek, it could be useful.
Cleanses: Could be good. They might want to cleanse those they view as town to make them more helpful in hunting scum.
Gifts: Again, could possibly want to help the other town members by giving them more to work with. Kind of a support role.
Gossip: I don't really see why town would want gossip...
Vote-Stealer: I understand that the vote is town's main weapon, but I don't think town should screw with votes like that.

More questions, because I am bored:

everyone: Do you believe that the masquerade element of the game is town-sided or scum-sided?
Which flaw do you think is the worst for it's cost?
Do you think that santa is a power more likely to be taken by town or scum?
How about bless?
Do you think that the deep south element of the game is town-sided or scum-sided?
It's scum sided because the masks cripple the town power roles because one cannot simply inspect or kill someone if they have to target masks rather than the people themselves.
Unable to vote. The vote is town's main weapon. Taking that away should be worth more.
Santa is probably more scum because they know who each other are and are more likely to take powers to make each other stronger.
The same with bless.
Probably more scum-sided. It makes things a bit more unpredictable if actions can happen at any time. Chaos is kinda the scum's best friend.


Jiokuy:
Everyone: So what are the advantages to claiming masks?
Well those with inspects can see who their results match up to, vigilantes will know which people they want to kill...


On Varee... I have no clue. All I know is claiming to have screwed a townie over is a bad, bad move. I'll have to think about this when my brain isn't crying out for sleep.

I'm sorry if anything I've said was worded oddly. It is one in the morning for me and I haven't been getting much sleep the past few days...
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Tiruin

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Re: Choose-Your-Own-Masquerade - The First Dance Has Begun
« Reply #190 on: July 28, 2014, 12:16:00 am »

[Quote destruction snipped...]
Alright, point by point.
I didn't leave a vote, but I said that you seemed scummy. Sorry for misusing terminology.
You claimed a part of your role, that is, your mask. So it does.

It was an analogy, yes. And that was a typo, I meant "You don't normally jump off of buildings with no gear, do you?".
The mere fact that you decide to give info the first day was suspicious to me because it seemed overly planned.

Same thing goes with 4mask's claim - it seemed to preemptive. As in, to use later in argument for towny-ness.

And "outburst" wasn't the correct term, I agree.
@Orange: Really now?
Actually, that brings up a good point. I got a ping that Tiruin is scum. Nothing concrete, but a ping. Why would you default to claiming as town on the first day? A different setup doesn't change the factory defaults - it would have to be something you think of before you start posting, right?

Pfp
You said its nothing concrete but a ping. Then didn't define it in a way that it was clear on how >__>

I claimed my mask. And? AND?
What does that mean to you? :v

And what seemed overly planned? That I gave my mask out? That is a ping to me that you're choosing to see too much in that I just gave my mask out. Why would you do such?

You didn't expound on the ideas of that matter, despite it meaning a lot to you, by the way.



flabort
I forgot to say this:
I need to use my vote, but I'm not certain of anything yet, so I'm going to flip a coin to see if I vote for someone who DOESN'T have a vote on them yet, or someone who DOES. Then I'm going to roll an appropriately-sided die.

Spoiler: table of possibilities (click to show/hide)
@_@
You're 'random' voting by coinflip.
.__.
No seriously. You vote without any content but a coinflip?
Why?



Script
[...]Right now, I'm basically a liability to the town if I don't reveal everything I know. If Toaster goes, I go. I'm also pretty sure that I'm set to be stabbed, unless Toaster is scum, in which case it doesn't really matter.[...]
Orange:
>
Quote
Also, since the scum know it now, I got an ultramarine mask and was targeted by a scum changeling.
muh ._.
NQT: Given the Lover feature--does the player who is a target OF the one of picked lover, know that they are...lover'd with that player?
*reads back more*

Script: Could I ask your list of plausible reads on anyone ELSE but 4maskwolf? If he so far is your target for scum...it would be strange for him to go along logic of scum/changeling notions that would make him stick out from the rest in that context if scum hit you.
Meaning: You're really sure scum hit you? What makes it so?


Voting to extend just for the lack of votes, tho.
Adding my Extend vote to the pile. This will need some serious sorting though. Will do a more complex analysis in ~6 hours.
W-wha? THIS IS NOT A VOTE-TO-EXTEND GAME, THE EXTENSION VOTING IS A PERSONAL ONE-SHOT 24 HOUR USAGE.

PPE: Oh look another page.
Crud.






Tolyk, Tirun, Toony, and Toaster:In your opinion what are the chances that he's faking the lover to direct the scum-kill to Toaster?
Opinion Output: @__@
Why would he?
Meaning: I see no way anyone would do such a thing UNLESS (and as stated on..flabort[?]'s query to my outlook on flaws in this game), the lover KNOWS WHO SCUM IS.
Also scum don't have a kill. Are you in the game, sir?
.__.

Varee
I cant make a full post right now. But wow at the turn of event give me a few more hour to see if i find time to write.
Also i used that changling stop blaming people it my fault.....
Why'd you changeling him o_o


Toony
I cant make a full post right now. But wow at the turn of event give me a few more hour to see if i find time to write.
Also i used that changling stop blaming people it my fault.....
You used the changeling? Did you hope to hit scum? Because if Scripten is town you really screwed him over for like, no reason.

What was your plan of action really?
Err, why or how did it screw him over? It makes him a mirror match
Quote
4 - Changeling (target player gains all your powers/flaws/autos and you get the powers/flaws/autos of your target)
Though in context, that means he gave out his full role and mask to...that which targeted him.

Quote
Everyone: So what are the advantages to claiming masks?
Knowing that nobody likes to target me. :I
It's been a thing since ever before ;_;



@Flabort//Script
I cant make a full post right now. But wow at the turn of event give me a few more hour to see if i find time to write.
Also i used that changling stop blaming people it my fault.....
The heck man? You had me worried! But you have me MORE worried now!

What are you thinking saying this?
If you ARE scum, then saying this means that you've just signed a death warrant, Varee. If you're town, then you've just admitted to screwing over another towny, and what are you doing with six unspent points?

This seems like the most illconcieved claim of all the illconcieved claims just this game! We're not even to day 2, and HOW many people have started claiming stuff?
. . .You do know the paragraph where the vote is doesn't make a lot of sense when read through, right? -__-
By logic, Varee is pretty much town (or is owning up to the changeling for townie points, which in my intuitive opinion, does not speak well of him as scum regardless)

WHAT THE HELL?

Seriously? If you're town, Varee, shame on you. If you're scum... well, good job, I guess? Anyway, I'm going to keep the FoS on you, 4maskwolf, but yeah, this is kind of impossible to ignore.

Unvote 4maskwolf
Vote Varee


*SIGH*
Well, at least there's no way we can say this has been a boring game!
Script, check my question before checking this.
What made you think the one who changeling'd you is scum? You seem to be more bordering on emotional reaction here than anything else.
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Scripten

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Re: Choose-Your-Own-Masquerade - The First Dance Has Begun
« Reply #191 on: July 28, 2014, 12:59:06 am »

Script: Could I ask your list of plausible reads on anyone ELSE but 4maskwolf? If he so far is your target for scum...it would be strange for him to go along logic of scum/changeling notions that would make him stick out from the rest in that context if scum hit you.
Meaning: You're really sure scum hit you? What makes it so?

This. I confronted Varee earlier and didn't get a very satisfactory answer. Also, there's next to no reason why he should have used that power the way he did, unless he is scum. Frankly, I'm suspecting that 4maskwolf and Varee are scumbuddies, with an unknown third mafia member. My hypothesis is that 4maskwolf is currently trying to distance himself from Varee, who is to be bused for the good of the scum team. The reasoning behind this is that 4maskwolf encouraged claiming, which is blatantly maskfishing, and, at first, tried to say that changeling was a crapshoot for scum, and then accused me of being scum because I was thinking too hard about using changeling as scum. Discouraging scumhunting is not particularly town-sided. If you can't think like your enemy, how can you confront them competently?

Anyway, aside from Varee and 4maskwolf, I'm not entirely sure. Here's where everyone stands:

Reverie: Slightly town leaning; null read atm. She seems like a competent player and hasn't dropped any clues to her being scum. I'd like to see her reaction to all this new stuff before I make any further comment.
Tiruin: Town leaning. Confronts others on their bull and is actively scumhunting. Moderate town read.
Toaster: Null read, VERY slightly scummy. Needs to get back in here so I can get a better read on him. If I'm not wrong, he's said nothing since last friday, and it's all rules stuff and banter before then for the most part.
Deathsword: Almost entirely inactive. Literally one post in the game, promising more questions and never delivering. Null read, and dangerous for town if he's inactive up until the vote.
Toony: Slightly town. Strange RVS/pressure voting. Has done a bit of scumhunting, but nothing particularly damning nor exonerating. Has brought up some good points that felt like scumhunting.
Silthuri: Not particularly active. I've seen some reports and reads, but I would enjoy more scumhunting. Null read.
TolyK: More null than scum, though there's been a few points that made me question. Needs to be a bit more clear about his points for me to see him as town-sided.
Jiokuy: Fairly active. More than slight town read. Definitely new, but doing a decent job so far.
Flabort: Null, leaning scum with certain issues. Random voting late into the day, after real content has appeared. Random voting by blatant coin flip, too. Some decent points, but still a little scummy.

Err, why or how did it screw him over? It makes him a mirror match

Sadly not. It makes me unable to use powers for the remainder of the game unless another townie wastes a power on me to *possibly* heal me. Unless Varee wanted to use changeling again (which he would have to purchase with points since he'd used one-shot), there's no real way I would have a viable power role from here on out. Which is fine, if Varee is scum, since I expect him to play for his team's wincon. If he's town, he just massively screwed up and is likely a liability. Also, since he now has my resurrection, we can get a hard flip on him without removing a voting member from the town.

By logic, Varee is pretty much town (or is owning up to the changeling for townie points, which in my intuitive opinion, does not speak well of him as scum regardless)

That or he's being coached so that he doesn't reveal his scumbuddies. Just like we, as town, are playing to our wincon regardless of our own deaths, so too is every mafia member.

Script, check my question before checking this.
What made you think the one who changeling'd you is scum? You seem to be more bordering on emotional reaction here than anything else.

Nah, I'm not really all that beaten up over it. If Varee is town, then I'm just really disappointed that he's done so much damage and muddied the scumhunting waters, as it were. If he's scum, then at least we've found one of them. Only a mafia member (or, I suppose, a very misguided townie) would risk using a harmful changeling this early in the game, when you're so much more likely to hit town than scum.
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Tiruin

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Re: Choose-Your-Own-Masquerade - The First Dance Has Begun
« Reply #192 on: July 28, 2014, 01:35:09 am »

Varee: You said that you intend to fake cluelessness to prove you are town. That seems very fishy to me and rather scum-sided. That, along with your view that rolefishing is not scummy, makes me feel like you're setting up a wall to hide behind later on if/when you are called out for other scummy actions. How do you intend to help the town win with such an attitude?
This is the link 'in This', aye?
I've checked back (and the proceeding answer to that question (without a question mark o-o)) and it...it makes sense, actually.

Varee: In the BYOR you faked cluelessness to prove you were town. Do you think this will make any new genuine mistakes you make look scummy?

I cannot answer that question as it is my intention to do that. It is the others who decided to interpret my actions as scummy or not.
In that BYOR, [seriously, people, go link which Mafia game it is if such and such would be used as evidence or a factor in a case :I] as in this BYOR
, Varee is town o_o
In that idea of playing 'clueless', I believe its rather of a contextual point that was being raised.
Did you look into the context there?
Or his answer ._.
*reads* You did and went on another tangent .__.
Query: He didn't answer yet on using said power--await the decision before concluding :v I'm speaking to you like so because my personal read on you is leaning town.
Quote
The reasoning behind this is that 4maskwolf encouraged claiming, which is blatantly maskfishing, and, at first, tried to say that changeling was a crapshoot for scum, and then accused me of being scum because I was thinking too hard about using changeling as scum. Discouraging scumhunting is not particularly town-sided. If you can't think like your enemy, how can you confront them competently?
Wait, where did he encourage..erh?
Quote
Sadly not. It makes me unable to use powers for the remainder of the game unless another townie wastes a power on me to *possibly* heal me. Unless Varee wanted to use changeling again (which he would have to purchase with points since he'd used one-shot), there's no real way I would have a viable power role from here on out. Which is fine, if Varee is scum, since I expect him to play for his team's wincon. If he's town, he just massively screwed up and is likely a liability. Also, since he now has my resurrection, we can get a hard flip on him without removing a voting member from the town.
Mwuh? Wait, let me try to get this straight. http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=140835.msg5516466#msg5516466 was your, and now his, role/ability list.
You, however, have his full role list.
Quote
4 - Changeling (target player gains all your powers/flaws/autos and you get the powers/flaws/autos of your target)
PLUS Changeling. Given this context, you've something stopping you from..um, doinng your stuff (ie Changeling is a One-Shot? [CONFIRM PLEASE])
*re-reads*
AH. ._. I missed the 'with' in the second part. SO, you're now flawed in all forms and have nothing else to get by.
...Ah. Now I get it.

You're a vanilla lover to Toaster then. Ok?
HOWEVER, I've to note that this, in my personal opinion, along with Varee's PFP claim (I'm a bit biased in judging that 'hey, he got a PFP to admit it :o') does not point Varee being scum.
Why?
He could've done SO MUCH MORE DAMAGE :3
Spoiler: See: Flaw list. (click to show/hide)
Reasoning:
> We've got 5 points at start.
Quote
4 - Changeling (target player gains all your powers/flaws/autos and you get the powers/flaws/autos of your target)
With 1 left over.
Quote
0(+2) : Lover(Toaster)
0(+2) : One-Shot
0(+1) : Dense
So Varee has 6 points in his stat sheet.
Guess what ELSE he could've done with the changeling (marked in orange) if he really meant malevolent (in which my judgement on Varee == Town mistake)
...The purple is unsure.

SO. IF such is to be assumed, (and the above is an answer to the third paragraph from bottom too), then
Quote
That or he's being coached so that he doesn't reveal his scumbuddies. Just like we, as town, are playing to our wincon regardless of our own deaths, so too is every mafia member.
In CLAIMING that he did it, it appears to be less of a smoke screen and more of an admittance to error in doing so.

Quote
Nah, I'm not really all that beaten up over it. If Varee is town, then I'm just really disappointed that he's done so much damage and muddied the scumhunting waters, as it were. If he's scum, then at least we've found one of them. Only a mafia member (or, I suppose, a very misguided townie) would risk using a harmful changeling this early in the game, when you're so much more likely to hit town than scum.
Wherein I say: Varee is doing a pretty RISKY maneuver is scum. As in. Really.


So a few thing about myself first, i kinda have a totally opposite time zone compare to US so i might be posting at weird time. Also it mean my action will happen at weird time which might be a give away ......
I wonder if you're Asian o_o
Because I am. GMT +8. Half the world away from the Americans (and other related GMT -4~6 peoples)

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Tiruin

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Re: Choose-Your-Own-Masquerade - The First Dance Has Begun
« Reply #193 on: July 28, 2014, 01:42:07 am »

I mean darnit there was something familiar about Silthuri.
I didn't read the sig >_> <_<
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ToonyMan

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Re: Choose-Your-Own-Masquerade - The First Dance Has Begun
« Reply #194 on: July 28, 2014, 01:48:22 am »

PFP

That's true, he could have added even more flaws besides like, intermittent or unreliable for obvious reasons.
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