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[Sean Mirrsen]

The reason Hephaestus production isn't expanding is because we've hit worker and raw resource bottlenecks. We need to expand, but our construction crews are tied up in various construction projects, and without them any attempt at expanding will take a significant time. And we're waiting on successful negotiations with a friendly world to get more qualified workers.

In the meantime, those of us who are active pursue those projects where they can do the most good. Should probably give the science teams some work though.

[Beirus]

You want scratch resistant armor plating?

Diamond is brittle and sublimates in heat.

Nah, we just need it for the bling. We could call it the Pimpin' Pill. 

[Radio Controlled]

My primary opposition to using the pill machine is the cost of testing- we need human bodies of decent size, and those aren't cheap.  My secondary opposition is the fact that stuff coming from Hephaestus is always given a balanced price, so most of the obvious functions are entirely redundant with technology that we already have.  It isn't even very useful to sods, because robosods can't use pills, and effectively cost an eighteenth as much as flesh sods.

Remember those three little orbs I gave Grate via Gilgamesh doll?

You know what those were? Because if we can find a combo that makes an ingredient be armor, then add something to balance out the weight (eg a muscle fiber) we can have infantry with spaceship hull-level protection.

I wanted to test this particular route for quite some time, but alas haven't found the time yet.

In the meantime, those of us who are active pursue those projects where they can do the most good. Should probably give the science teams some work though.

Again, please go find out if there is anything you can already prepare for the space magic factory. It's much more important than that suit or any weapon you could think of.

Purchased by Stacy, sold to Grate, confiscated by Miyamoto, Given to Grate, shoved in Hephaestus storage.  That is the ownership history of the pill machine.  Also, serious science has been done, by GWG before he got banned.  He didn't get far, but he did do science.

Miya gave the pill machine back to Simus, it is officially she who owns it.


Pyro, would you care to but in and give us your opinion on extra hands on Hep to do whatever? PW, what about you? Because neither of you should just say yes to the idea cause you fell pressed. If you don't think it can be worked out in a satisfactory way, then nothing will be lost, so no problem.

[Unholy_Pariah]

My primary opposition to using the pill machine is the cost of testing- we need human bodies of decent size, and those aren't cheap.  My secondary opposition is the fact that stuff coming from Hephaestus is always given a balanced price, so most of the obvious functions are entirely redundant with technology that we already have.  It isn't even very useful to sods, because robosods can't use pills, and effectively cost an eighteenth as much as flesh sods.

Remember those three little orbs I gave Grate via Gilgamesh doll?

You know what those were? Because if we can find a combo that makes an ingredient be armor, then add something to balance out the weight (eg a muscle fiber) we can have infantry with spaceship hull-level protection.

I wanted to test this particular route for quite some time, but alas haven't found the time yet.

In the meantime, those of us who are active pursue those projects where they can do the most good. Should probably give the science teams some work though.

Again, please go find out if there is anything you can already prepare for the space magic factory. It's much more important than that suit or any weapon you could think of.

Purchased by Stacy, sold to Grate, confiscated by Miyamoto, Given to Grate, shoved in Hephaestus storage.  That is the ownership history of the pill machine.  Also, serious science has been done, by GWG before he got banned.  He didn't get far, but he did do science.

Miya gave the pill machine back to Simus, it is officially she who owns it.


Pyro, would you care to but in and give us your opinion on extra hands on Hep to do whatever? PW, what about you? Because neither of you should just say yes to the idea cause you fell pressed. If you don't think it can be worked out in a satisfactory way, then nothing will be lost, so no problem.

ah good ol' mythril shards... i actually wasn't gonna fuck with those personally... but we definitely gotta get them shipped back too if we go that route, along with some local wildife and a few bits of anomalous debris.
perhaps a synthflesh muscle strand? or a hydraulic piston? or a helium balloon to offset the weight? or some combat stims?

[Parisbre56]

The reason Hephaestus production isn't expanding is because we've hit worker and raw resource bottlenecks. We need to expand, but our construction crews are tied up in various construction projects, and without them any attempt at expanding will take a significant time.

Again, please go find out if there is anything you can already prepare for the space magic factory. It's much more important than that suit or any weapon you could think of.

That's one of the reasons I tried (and am still trying) to go to Hephaestus. People seem to be ignoring the fact that there are places in the universe other than the Sword and Hephaestus. Just build that freighter blackship I proposed, send it along with Charles (who has asked you to have him do something useful) to a nearby backwater planet you have previously scouted with the QEC-capable early warning probes I proposed and have it recruit people to our cause, either by covertly recruiting or abducting people (easiest option) or by striking a deal with a megacorporation or the government (harder but more consistent option).

[Sean Mirrsen]

The reason Hephaestus production isn't expanding is because we've hit worker and raw resource bottlenecks. We need to expand, but our construction crews are tied up in various construction projects, and without them any attempt at expanding will take a significant time.

Again, please go find out if there is anything you can already prepare for the space magic factory. It's much more important than that suit or any weapon you could think of.

That's one of the reasons I tried (and am still trying) to go to Hephaestus. People seem to be ignoring the fact that there are places in the universe other than the Sword and Hephaestus. Just build that freighter blackship I proposed, send it along with Charles (who has asked you to have him do something useful) to a nearby backwater planet you have previously scouted with the QEC-capable early warning probes I proposed and have it recruit people to our cause, either by covertly recruiting or abducting people (easiest option) or by striking a deal with a megacorporation or the government (harder but more consistent option).

You seem to have us mistaken for the Black Ops detachment, the diplomatic council, or the ARM military wing. Hephaestus is home of the Engineering Corps, and the R&D division. We're not functionally equipped to kindap people into slavery, and we don't have the requisite diplomatic clout to initiate business relations on our own. Not to mention that whatever passes for the PR department of ARM will have a fit if we start abducting people.

The automated scout ships are a neat idea, but without the amp factory our hands are tied - we can't make FTL ships.

The factory itself is underway, and will take a lot more resources to construct than we're capable of directing to it anytime soon anyway. We'll need a whole damn fleet of constructor ships before we even need to think about any sort of secondary requirements like seeding material. And we're not beginning construction of the core of that thing until we have an emergency evacuation solution for at least the personnel of Hephaestus.

So far we've hit the limit of what we can do. We can't build many more ships or facilities because our resources are limited, we can't go beyond the Heph system because we don't have FTL-capable ships we don't need. All we can do is wait until we can start expanding our resource acquisition, wait until we have more workers, and work on anything we're capable of working on in the meantime. And we're just five people. And Charles barely qualifies as a researcher. And we don't have Grate around anymore to fool around with the pill machine. And Simus is asleep most of the time. And Anton hates space magic and blackbox alien artifacts because they can't be reverse-engineered at the moment. This basically just leaves Saint, and his Heph posts are already quite wall-of-texty.

We could use more active people on Heph, but we still don't have much that we can do.

[Radio Controlled]

ah good ol' mythril shards... i actually wasn't gonna fuck with those personally... but we definitely gotta get them shipped back too if we go that route, along with some local wildife and a few bits of anomalous debris.
perhaps a synthflesh muscle strand? or a hydraulic piston? or a helium balloon to offset the weight? or some combat stims?

If (not when, if) pill machine comes to the Sword, then I'd leave the shards there, it was my final gift to GWG after all. Miya could always make more anyways (and a very big amount of other stuff. Just about any non-living material really).

Also, you have just showed very nicely why there needs to be some oversight. Putting synthflesh into the machine? You know synthflesh is spess magic, yes? That's just asking for Gratesplosion 2.0

That's one of the reasons I tried (and am still trying) to go to Hephaestus. People seem to be ignoring the fact that there are places in the universe other than the Sword and Hephaestus. Just build that freighter blackship I proposed, send it along with Charles (who has asked you to have him do something useful) to a nearby backwater planet you have previously scouted with the QEC-capable early warning probes I proposed and have it recruit people to our cause, either by covertly recruiting or abducting people (easiest option) or by striking a deal with a megacorporation or the government (harder but more consistent option).

Miya could write you a letter of recommendation 

As for workers and science crews, we might get some more if these negotiations pan out. But yeah, there are things to be done on other planets. One idea I had was to bioengineer a sort of plant/fungus that can withstand extreme conditions, then seed it to some nearby planet/moon that's livable but harsh (and otherwise not extremely valuable), and let it just grow big and produce biomass for our sod production. Hell, just coating Hep with it and feeding it waste material might even work.

You seem to have us mistaken for the Black Ops detachment, the diplomatic council, or the ARM military wing. Hephaestus is home of the Engineering Corps, and the R&D division. We're not functionally equipped to kindap people into slavery, and we don't have the requisite diplomatic clout to initiate business relations on our own. Not to mention that whatever passes for the PR department of ARM will have a fit if we start abducting people.

You should not limit yourself to only those things. Besides, it's Simus who decides what your various jobs and responsibilities, and if you don't have the tools for a certain job, start making them!

Case in point: Have you considered buying old (FTL) freighters or other ships from systems near you to convert and use till the amp factory is in place? If not, why not?

The factory itself is underway, and will take a lot more resources to construct than we're capable of directing to it anytime soon anyway. We'll need a whole damn fleet of constructor ships before we even need to think about any sort of secondary requirements like seeding material. And we're not beginning construction of the core of that thing until we have an emergency evacuation solution for at least the personnel of Hephaestus.

Could you please point me to the post where pw confirms you cannot do any preliminary work for the amp production facility? Because this kinda sounds like extrapolation and guesswork presented as fact.

We could use more active people on Heph, but we still don't have much that we can do.

-go solve the Leo issue
-Interrogate headless prisoner
-research M14 artifacts
-research Gratesplosion artifacts

And all of that can be started right now.

[Sean Mirrsen]

if you don't have the tools for a certain job, start making them!

Anton needs the high-energy physics lab. It can't be built and staffed until Saint is done with his bioforges, or the preliminary work on the amp factory is done.

Case in point: Have you considered buying old (FTL) freighters or other ships from systems near you to convert and use till the amp factory is in place? If not, why not?

Because I'm fairly certain that any planet that has FTL freighters is UWM-controlled, which means it's also guarded by FTL-capable warships. Of which we have, what, three? Four if we're lucky? And any UWM-controlled planet within reasonable distance will have been informed of Hephaestus being taken, by the guard fleet we've destroyed.

Could you please point me to the post where pw confirms you cannot do any preliminary work for the amp production facility? Because this kinda sounds like extrapolation and guesswork presented as fact.

I can't point you to a post because my search-fu is not that strong, but PW did say that it'll take several planetary masses worth of raw material for the core. The Heph system has enough materials overall, but we don't have anywhere near the requisite man- or ship-power to do it within a reasonable timeframe.

-go solve the Leo issue

Mostly inconsequential, and pretty much right up Charles' alley skill-wise.

-Interrogate headless prisoner

Headless? Ah, from the cultist mission. Given the overall danger of that bunch of people, we need special "alien containment" style facilities for that first, and QEC-controlled interrogation drones.

-research M14 artifacts
-research Gratesplosion artifacts

Definitely not Anton's area of expertise. Low will, horrendous Exo. Can assign a science team to those though, I suppose. Even Miyamoto can assign a science team to those, remotely. Not while he's on mission perhaps, but if he can tinker while he's doing it...

[Radio Controlled]

Anton needs the high-energy physics lab. It can't be built and staffed until Saint is done with his bioforges, or the preliminary work on the amp factory is done.

For this particular project, sure, you have to wait for things to work out in-game. But for the other examples you gave, there are things you could do. Even if it's only planning or working things out with pw. This also counts for the amp factory: is every step of the way planned out and decided yet? If not, then you have work to do.

Because I'm fairly certain that any planet that has FTL freighters is UWM-controlled, which means it's also guarded by FTL-capable warships. Of which we have, what, three? Four if we're lucky? And any UWM-controlled planet within reasonable distance will have been informed of Hephaestus being taken, by the guard fleet we've destroyed.

And yet, have you tried? Perhaps Steve can set up a legitimate business front to buy those ships for? Perhaps some private corporations are willing to do business with our side? Because defeatist 'it cannot be done' before looking into it or asking gm (IC or OOC) will get you nowhere.

I can't point you to a post because my search-fu is not that strong, but PW did say that it'll take several planetary masses worth of raw material for the core. The Heph system has enough materials overall, but we don't have anywhere near the requisite man- or ship-power to do it within a reasonable timeframe.

Again, 'work' can be more than in-game stuff that gets build.

For example, do you guys have a roadmap for future developments? A list of projects to do, with feasibility studies (aka asking pw) for them? An inventory of artifacts to research? If not, then you have work to do. And don't tell me 'Need Simus for it', just go ahead, do it, then ask Simus if it's all correct or to revise where necessary.

Headless? Ah, from the cultist mission. Given the overall danger of that bunch of people, we need special "alien containment" style facilities for that first, and QEC-controlled interrogation drones.

You have both of those.

Subject housing:  Subjects are housed in solid metal, vibration and electrical isolated cells of varying sizes. Each cell contains the basics of survival and can be customized to easily accommodate special subjects.  I assumed that, at some point, you might create things that need to be stored away, or have cloned test subjects. Seemed reasonable.

And Saint has made remote-control backpacks for robobodies.

You could start interrogating him right now.

Definitely not Anton's area of expertise. Low will, horrendous Exo. Can assign a science team to those though, I suppose. Even Miyamoto can assign a science team to those, remotely. Not while he's on mission perhaps, but if he can tinker while he's doing it...

Going to assign one for another project, but really, you can't expect me (a non Hep person just trying to get some necessary work done) to do all the stuff you guys should be doing. I might, if I find it is needed, but it's your responsibility first and foremost.


And while we are at it, some time ago another council member posted this:

I would also note that to my knowledge, no person on Heph has asked once - not once, in what has now been months - for feedback from the people on the ship. No questions about what roles crew might want filled, what functionality people want in their equipment, what price they would consider reasonable for a given function...they honestly have no idea if anyone wants or is even slightly interested in using these things that they are putting out, do they? This approach runs the very real risk of creating a bunch of toys which will sit rusting on the shelves (and wasting lots of design-hours in the process), because no-one is actually interested in the damned things. This should not be encouraged. They are creating things for their own amusement, and as a result are squandering resources, their time, and their gift.

wanted to wait till there was a good time to post this, seems like as good an opportunity as any.

[Parisbre56]

You seem to have us mistaken for the Black Ops detachment, the diplomatic council, or the ARM military wing. Hephaestus is home of the Engineering Corps, and the R&D division. We're not functionally equipped to kindap people into slavery, and we don't have the requisite diplomatic clout to initiate business relations on our own. Not to mention that whatever passes for the PR department of ARM will have a fit if we start abducting people.

You may consider your character to be that, but that doesn't mean that's what you have to be. You are simply the people in charge of Hephaestus. You are what you make of that. Besides, even the Adeptus Mechanicus went on missions with their ships. Just because you consider yourselves scientists and engineers doesn't mean you can't kick some ass outside of the office.

Miya could write you a letter of recommendation

Nah, Flint wants to convince Simus on his own for his own merit. He won't ask others for help. Doesn't want to look weak in her eyes.
Plus, for OOC reasons, I think it's best to let Pyro make the decisions he wants for Hephaestus without Miyamoto influencing that with his rank.
...
Well, besides him yelling at them about how they are doing everything wrong. 

Could you please point me to the post where pw confirms you cannot do any preliminary work for the amp production facility? Because this kinda sounds like extrapolation and guesswork presented as fact.

The quote:

4. Well, stage one will be done on November 3rd. Then we're gonna have to start manufacturing the containment system, which, I suggest, you get lots of people to work on and lots of quality control. It's very important, after all. You're gonna need to import some manipulators and systems to even create the thing, and also you're gonna need to gather...oh...a few planetary masses worth of raw material for the field. So thats gonna need some gravity tugs or something similar. And an automanip to condense the matter when you bring it in and...oh, well it's very complex. And if there are any mistakes you all die. Fun eh?

So you need to get those construction crews working on building those ships and ask Steve/Aresteve about the best ways to procure those manipulators. You might also want to put the science crews to brainstorm ways you could make this faster and more efficiently. And more safely, above all. You might also want to ask Steve if you could hire help, since he seems to have deep pockets. You might also want to work on getting more workers.

Actually, based on this, since Simus was overseeing, the amp factory's first stage should already be done:

Simple labor isn't your problem. We've already got drones and robot stuff doing most of the unskilled labor. The problem is skilled laborers.

Unless one of you want to go up and personally help them out. That should account for a good amount of support.

Anton needs the high-energy physics lab. It can't be built and staffed until Saint is done with his bioforges, or the preliminary work on the amp factory is done.

Why build it and more importantly why staff it if it's going to be so dangerous? Why not just create a pair of ships, one VR equipped and the other carrying the necessary materials, put one in orbit and land the other on some distant planet and perform any necessary experiments safely and quickly?

Because I'm fairly certain that any planet that has FTL freighters is UWM-controlled, which means it's also guarded by FTL-capable warships. Of which we have, what, three? Four if we're lucky? And any UWM-controlled planet within reasonable distance will have been informed of Hephaestus being taken, by the guard fleet we've destroyed.

Wrong. There are independent colonies like the sharkmist colony on the outer rim. That means there are independent freighters supplying them.

Headless? Ah, from the cultist mission. Given the overall danger of that bunch of people, we need special "alien containment" style facilities for that first, and QEC-controlled interrogation drones.

You already have that. The testing chambers Simus made, remember? And you don't really need QEC bodies, just normal remote controlled bodies. Not that it would be expensive for you to make some extra QEC bodies.

An inventory of artifacts to research?

I started doing something like that on the wiki, but alas, no time to read through all the subforum right now. Will continue work when I get some more time.

Even Miyamoto can assign a science team to those, remotely.

Didn't piecewise say that while you can assign a science crew to help you, you have to do some work on them manually? Or am I misremembering?

[Radio Controlled]

Thank you paris for finding that post. Because it also illustrates a certain point from before:

You're gonna need to import some manipulators and systems to even create the thing

Proving that it is indeed possible to import things from off-system. Parhaps not as cost-efficient, but better than nothing until we have what we need.

Well, besides him yelling at them about how they are doing everything wrong.

Hey, that's like, 70% of my work anyways, yell at people and whip them into working. Like an armored HR manager.

So yeah, Hep people, there is loads of work to be done that doesn't involve personal tinker pet projects.

[Toaster]

My primary opposition to using the pill machine is the cost of testing- we need human bodies of decent size, and those aren't cheap. 

I've brought this up in a semi-joking matter several times, but it's time to seriously ask.

Has anyone asked PW if you Heph people can (ab)use Grate for this?  If he goes nasty, just shoot him and get a fresh copy.

[Radio Controlled]

My primary opposition to using the pill machine is the cost of testing- we need human bodies of decent size, and those aren't cheap. 

I've brought this up in a semi-joking matter several times, but it's time to seriously consider methodological infanticide as a viable contribution to the scientific method.

FTFY

[Hapah]

Make a Pill out of Grate and feed it to the next Grate.

[Parisbre56]

Make a Pill out of Grate and feed it to the next Grate.

[obligatory Grateception joke]