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[Sheb]

Yeah, the absolute worse would be 1956/1968, not an annexation.

[DJ]

Well I just picked Poland because it's the traditional world war starter. But yeah, I don't think Putin gives a damn about insurgency, he doesn't have to worry about PR like USA presidents. He has an insatiable appetite for territory, and he'll take everything he thinks he can, and the West sitting on their hands while he annexes Ukraine will make him think he can take a lot more than he thought before.

[Sonlirain]

So once again the West has no balls. Hardly surprising. I wonder how long until Putin annexes Poland.

Why would Putin need Poland? Or concerning annexing the rest of Ukraine, does he really want to deal with UPA insurgents in Galicia and Volhynia?

Well if he did manage to add poland to the list of russian satelite states (not likely since poland has somewhat strong ties to EU and NATO) then russia would have more or less the same sphere of influence as ye olde soviet union without being defacto the red scare of old.

[DJ]

It would be a much scarier red scare, because now it has an economy that's somewhat efficient.

[Sheb]

Tymoshencko's braids fake, CIA conspiracy suspected.


Edit: Apparently Russia is suspending the gas discount. I guess this would invalidate the 2010 treaty regarding Sevastopol.

[Guardian G.I.]

Spoiler: Pro-Russian demonstration in Kharkov (click to show/hide)

[Sergarr]

It would be a much scarier red scare, because now it has an economy that's somewhat efficient.

You greatly overestimate the state of Russian economy.

[Mictlantecuhtli]

Besides the fact that (sadly) Kaliningrad/Königsberg has no tie Germany anymore (a fact which you are certainly aware of), provokation is not going to help here.

But, sir, they just have to occupy the lands, kill the local Russian population, move Germans in, and then claim the Russians weren't the ones who owned it first. That's how it works. I love how you say 'it's more complex than u think!!!" and then go entirely on the pro-Russian side of the arguement, and hand wave the murder of the Crimean people which allows Russia to even have the completely asinine claim that 'most of the people are Russians [because we murdered the rest of them and forced them to use Russian language therefore killing their local identities]!!'.

[burningpet]

No, he doesn't. he is trying to participate in a balanced discussion, whereas every little mention of trying to see the "other" side is being answered with deflections and hidden/open personal attacks. currently the situation is as such that they are a native speaking russians that have good reasons to fear.

[Sheb]

Actually you have to be careful when you say they're Russian. They have Russian as their mother language, but people from all over the USSR moved to Crimea in the days. You have Armenians, Georgians etc etc, all speaking Russian there.

[GreatJustice]

Besides the fact that (sadly) Kaliningrad/Königsberg has no tie Germany anymore (a fact which you are certainly aware of), provokation is not going to help here.

But, sir, they just have to occupy the lands, kill the local Russian population, move Germans in, and then claim the Russians weren't the ones who owned it first. That's how it works. I love how you say 'it's more complex than u think!!!" and then go entirely on the pro-Russian side of the arguement, and hand wave the murder of the Crimean people which allows Russia to even have the completely asinine claim that 'most of the people are Russians [because we murdered the rest of them and forced them to use Russian language therefore killing their local identities]!!'.

Of course, the US murdered Native American people too, but I'm not seeing many arguments that the US should cede most of the Midwest to the rightful owners in the form of the Sioux and so on.

Anyhow, while you could argue the Russians have less of a legitimate claim than the Tartars, the Ukrainians have less of a claim (using the historical argument) than either, having only gained Crimea in the 50s as a ceremonial gesture from Khrushchev.

[ChairmanPoo]

Well I just picked Poland because it's the traditional world war starter.

Weren't the Balkans the traditional world war starter?

[Dutchling]

I thought killing archdukes was.

[XXSockXX]

The way it looks right now, it seems Russia is trying to provoke a situation where they can justify the use of force. I hope Ukrainian and Crimean locals can keep it calm.

But, sir, they just have to occupy the lands, kill the local Russian population, move Germans in, and then claim the Russians weren't the ones who owned it first. That's how it works. I love how you say 'it's more complex than u think!!!" and then go entirely on the pro-Russian side of the arguement, and hand wave the murder of the Crimean people which allows Russia to even have the completely asinine claim that 'most of the people are Russians [because we murdered the rest of them and forced them to use Russian language therefore killing their local identities]!!'.

You know, the Königsberg analogy does work for me. You can't just reverse these kinds of things easily. I see nobody arguing for giving Germany it's former eastern parts back, but with Crimea it's totally different?

[darkrider2]

Well I just picked Poland because it's the traditional world war starter.

Weren't the Balkans the traditional world war starter?

Don't you mean the Belkans? (if you don't get it that's fine Ace Combat 5 joke)

The way it looks right now, it seems Russia is trying to provoke a situation where they can justify the use of force. I hope Ukrainian and Crimean locals can keep it calm.

Agreed, at this point escalation would only work in Russia's favor.