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[RangerCado]

Jim: Now this is interesting to me. Fully denying it would be the "Proper" response? I don't believe there is a true "proper" response to that. I've said it before that I don't think about the wording that goes into my post and just speak my mind. And no, I wasn't thinking about it before hand, but it seems it would be an obvious bus for a Dopp member to do. If you want a denial of it then here, I didn't bus him because I am not a dopp! Now, back to doing something productive. And speaking of makeinu...

Caz is giving me a null tell, so I have no idea what we might be dealing with if its anything but a camo cloaked role. For now, lets just focus on finding the last couple dopps.

Sinless: You've posted 5 game posts total, your last post here was 4 DAYS ago, and you have done nothing in the way of hunting in those posts. You were warned about how long this game would take, and the time you should put into it. Where are you and why haven't you posted?

Makeinu:

Imp is long on verbiage, which is a personal scum-tell, though a weak one, and his list doesn't match mine

...So your suspicious of Imp, partially because his scum list is different than yours? Okay, that is just silly and you have to know it. People's lists are going to be different from yours due to their different personalities and what they believe are worse scum tells. Do you really think thats a good scum tell? Also, could you explain why you suspect Max again?

[makeinu]

Imp is long on verbiage, which is a personal scum-tell, though a weak one, and his list doesn't match mine

...So your suspicious of Imp, partially because his scum list is different than yours? Okay, that is just silly and you have to know it. People's lists are going to be different from yours due to their different personalities and what they believe are worse scum tells. Do you really think thats a good scum tell? Also, could you explain why you suspect Max again?

Meh. That her scum list is different isn't really a tell, nor why I have suspicions. More, it's that her posts are very long-winded and I'm having trouble parsing out the meaning. That, to me, is a potential scum tell, because I've used that very tactic as scum to hide behind. It looks informed, and informative, but can end up like a political speech: by the time you add up all the pluses and minuses scattered throughout, nothing much has been said at all.

That said, it's Imp's style, and that's fine. It doesn't necessarily mean anything at all, and I wouldn't vote based solely on that, but it gives me something to look at, and as I dig further through those posts, maybe questions will come to mind.

As for Max, it's more a feeling, heavily tempered by the fact that he spent all "yesterday" hounding me. So, somewhat personal. That's why I'd like to see if a replacement plays the role differently, since he's basically announced he has no time or intention to play.

I'm curious, you've made mention twice of basically ignoring Caz's fate now, despite that I'm really the only one that's made any fuss about it, and then only in the name of understanding the game itself:

We will likely know Caz's fate tomorrow, so lets focus on this day.

Caz is giving me a null tell, so I have no idea what we might be dealing with if its anything but a camo cloaked role. For now, lets just focus on finding the last couple dopps.

Why is that?

Sinlessmoon: I'm with Jim here. Join the game for real.

[RangerCado]

Makeinu: Me being needlessly repetitive it seems. Mostly i'm saying we should ignore trying to figure out what happened, unless someone wants to claim to have followed them around or something similar. And fair point, that was my own mistake. And you really shouldn't take things personally in Mafia, or we might get what happened to Webadict where he was targeted by 9 seperate people at one point? I'm rambling, off to school work!

[Jim Groovester]

Jim: Now this is interesting to me. Fully denying it would be the "Proper" response? I don't believe there is a true "proper" response to that. I've said it before that I don't think about the wording that goes into my post and just speak my mind. And no, I wasn't thinking about it before hand, but it seems it would be an obvious bus for a Dopp member to do. If you want a denial of it then here, I didn't bus him because I am not a dopp! Now, back to doing something productive. And speaking of makeinu...

Caz is giving me a null tell, so I have no idea what we might be dealing with if its anything but a camo cloaked role. For now, lets just focus on finding the last couple dopps.

Maybe you should start taking care of what you say, because you wouldn't want people like me to suspect you for a careless turn of words on your part.

In any case, there was a proper response and you blew it. The proper response was any response that sufficiently convinced me that you were unrattled by my rather obvious insinuation. Sadly you did not give me that impression.

If you had said that you weren't a dopp to begin with without trying to explain it too much I probably would've looked elsewhere.

Sinless

. . .

Makeinu

Why are you bothering with FoSing people when you're not voting anybody? Why not just vote one of them? Hell, Sinlessmoon is literally the safest vote in the game right now, why FoS him at all?

Gosh you are so scum. Scared, cowardly scum. Can't cast a vote without adequate preparation and signaling beforehand.

[Mephansteras]

The Whiteboard
Sinlessmoon: Jim Groovester, makeinu


Day ends ~5pm Pacific Monday

[Imp]

I can't help but notice that your itemization on myself and Jim is very similar, yet you give him a pass and vote me.  Why the discrepancy?

Feel is a part of it.  Also this is very similar to Jim's behavior in S2 and he was Town that game.  I know that doesn't mean he's Town this game, but I have no real read of him other than 'Yeah, that's Jim, whatever that means'.  That doesn't give him a pass, but it is different from you.

What bugs me the most with Toaster, Jim, and now Persus13 is this tendency to not answer my questions, with or without direct refusal.  I think that's a very weird choice and that does disturb me.  All ribbing aside, don't forget you three that it's more than a snub of me (if that's the motivation any of you have for doing so, as Jim and Toaster have both alluded to) - it's also a failure to answer questions.  If my questions are so out of line call me on them and make it clear why they are inappropriate questions - that's Scumhunting, if my questions are bad ones - but to evade, deflect, belittle, or just ignore them is Scummy, not Scumhunting.

I see avoidance of answering.  Why aren't you answering these questions?

I did answer. The robot is you. Apparently there's no room for jokes because mafia is srs bsns.

Because it doesn't make sense to me except as active lurking and deflection.

I don't believe you. There's no way you're getting this worked up over a fucking joke.

I'm not worked up over joking - I make jokes too, but I'm getting there and past there about my questions not being answered.

• TOASTER MADE A JOKE AND I HATE IT

Why is Toaster's joking a worse offense compared to the other people who rate highly on your scum list?

Noted, Jim, who is happy to not answer most of my questions, also has no problem with Toaster not answering my questions and thinks not answering them isn't Scummy at all.

Why did you not notice extend?

It doesn't matter. I was concerned about activity. I noticed the extend.

And I'm trying to do some homework and I'm getting distracted.

Persus

Imp, Toaster seemed just to be making a flavor text reference. For the record, he wasn't exactly that active in the last Supernatural either, (although he did turn out to be converted scum). And for that matter, you don't have a lot of posts either. You're 4th in the overall post count.

You're saying that you're fine with Toaster's activity here because he wasn't very active in S6, where he was converted to Scum?

And you're saying that I don't have a lot of posts either, because (when you posted this comment) three people had more posts than me and seven had fewer - what's the significance of this to you, and how does that compare to talking about people in last place for number of posts?

My point was that Toaster wasn't very active either D1 or any of the other days. To me at least there wasn't a notable difference in his activity, but they were low throughout the game.

Normally you are number 1 in the post count. There this thing in Statistics known as z-scores that measure the deviation from a mean. At the moment I'd estimate that your z-score for this game is lower than Toaster's z-score.

Busy and other distractions also happens to me.  So do migraines and sickness, which delayed my joining the activity here D2.

Imp (seems odd, scumhunting Toaster for A JOKE, which is much easier to make than a WOT analysis post, and friendliness)

Noted that Persus also has no problem with Toaster not answering my questions.  Persus, would it be appropriate for others to answer your questions with jokes?  That wouldn't seem like a dodge, deflection, or evasion to you?

Persus: Can you expound on why your suspicious of Imp more? Yes where the scum hunting started was odd, but we all have to start somewhere so I'm not sure where your reasoning is coming from. If you would be so kind as to explain?

Imp seems off to me. She was attacking Toaster for something that seemed completely odd to me. I understand getting annoyed about inactivity, especially from a very experienced player, but it is much easier to crack a joke than to scumhunt. I tend to get annoyed at people attacking others for RL issues as well, and that also played part of it. Imp just feels different this game as compared to the others I've played with her. I had a similar feeling at the beginning of Supernatural, but this time I think it's different.

I noticed in the Scumchat for the sprint BM game, you considered night killing me and it didn't sound like a joke, though I was not a reasonable choice for target then:

Perses, reply #12:  Maybe Imp would be a better target.

Tiruin, reply #13:  Friendly reminder: Imp is on the replacement list, she's not an active player (yet?).

Perses, reply #14:  Oh, in that case I think SBC is our best bet.

Persus, would you say that you're a bit fixated on me?  Any reasons why?
Time to go to work and great time pressure these days for me.  I'll be able to post again tonight, possibly before if work's slow enough.

[Persus13]

Noted that Persus also has no problem with Toaster not answering my questions.  Persus, would it be appropriate for others to answer your questions with jokes?  That wouldn't seem like a dodge, deflection, or evasion to you?'

I didn't remember that. I'll look back at that.

Persus: Can you expound on why your suspicious of Imp more? Yes where the scum hunting started was odd, but we all have to start somewhere so I'm not sure where your reasoning is coming from. If you would be so kind as to explain?

Imp seems off to me. She was attacking Toaster for something that seemed completely odd to me. I understand getting annoyed about inactivity, especially from a very experienced player, but it is much easier to crack a joke than to scumhunt. I tend to get annoyed at people attacking others for RL issues as well, and that also played part of it. Imp just feels different this game as compared to the others I've played with her. I had a similar feeling at the beginning of Supernatural, but this time I think it's different.

I noticed in the Scumchat for the sprint BM game, you considered night killing me and it didn't sound like a joke, though I was not a reasonable choice for target then:

Perses, reply #12:  Maybe Imp would be a better target.

Tiruin, reply #13:  Friendly reminder: Imp is on the replacement list, she's not an active player (yet?).

Perses, reply #14:  Oh, in that case I think SBC is our best bet.

Persus, would you say that you're a bit fixated on me?  Any reasons why?
Time to go to work and great time pressure these days for me.  I'll be able to post again tonight, possibly before if work's slow enough.
[/quote]
That incidence in the scum chat was me being dumb and deciding to kill off an experienced player N1 to be nice, and that was N0, when I wasn't looking at a player list and no one had posted. You should know by now that making dumb mistakes is fairly common for me.

And I'd disagree on the fixated part. I just have played a lot of games with you. I've also played a lot of games with Tiruin as well. So I have a better idea of your playstyles and so you two are easier to talk about.

Why are you concerned about me attacking you?

[Persus13]

Imp: Are these the questions you say Toaster hasn't answered?

Toaster:  You've asked two players questions about their questioning of all other players, and each of your questions has included a negatively-directed statement about those players lack focus because of questioning everyone.

Ranger:
Since you're questioning everyone, how will you cope with the loss of focus your questions have?

Imp:
Why did you cast a wide net and question everyone instead of focusing your attention?

Please explain why you percieve questioning everyone as preventing focused attention.

For the record, I am 100% for claiming Kook status first post, and extend this to regular miller in any game I play.

Why?  Furthermore, one possible reaction I imagine is voting you from suspicion that you are not a miller, but a Scum claiming to be a miller.  How would you handle that so that your claim and the reactions it provoked on D1 served Town?

Toaster:

Can you answer these questions?

[Jim Groovester]

I HATE JOKES

I AM THE FUNQUISITION

Your question was: what's the purpose of these jokes?

I dunno, maybe they were jokes.

Wasn't this obvious?

I fail to see what questions I haven't answered.

[Persus13]

Edit of earlier post

Noted that Persus also has no problem with Toaster not answering my questions.  Persus, would it be appropriate for others to answer your questions with jokes?  That wouldn't seem like a dodge, deflection, or evasion to you?'

I didn't remember that. I'll look back at that.

Persus: Can you expound on why your suspicious of Imp more? Yes where the scum hunting started was odd, but we all have to start somewhere so I'm not sure where your reasoning is coming from. If you would be so kind as to explain?

Imp seems off to me. She was attacking Toaster for something that seemed completely odd to me. I understand getting annoyed about inactivity, especially from a very experienced player, but it is much easier to crack a joke than to scumhunt. I tend to get annoyed at people attacking others for RL issues as well, and that also played part of it. Imp just feels different this game as compared to the others I've played with her. I had a similar feeling at the beginning of Supernatural, but this time I think it's different.

I noticed in the Scumchat for the sprint BM game, you considered night killing me and it didn't sound like a joke, though I was not a reasonable choice for target then:

Perses, reply #12:  Maybe Imp would be a better target.

Tiruin, reply #13:  Friendly reminder: Imp is on the replacement list, she's not an active player (yet?).

Perses, reply #14:  Oh, in that case I think SBC is our best bet.

Persus, would you say that you're a bit fixated on me?  Any reasons why?
Time to go to work and great time pressure these days for me.  I'll be able to post again tonight, possibly before if work's slow enough.

That incidence in the scum chat was me being dumb and deciding to kill off an experienced player N1 to be nice, and that was N0, when I wasn't looking at a player list and no one had posted. You should know by now that making dumb mistakes is fairly common for me.

And I'd disagree on the fixated part. I just have played a lot of games with you. I've also played a lot of games with Tiruin as well. So I have a better idea of your playstyles and so you two are easier to talk about.

Why are you concerned about me attacking you?

[Toaster]

Imp:  Please quote the questions I haven't answered- I get the feeling you never read my last post to you, at least not fully.


Persus:  I did answer those:

(RQing everyone)

I dislike the opener of asking everyone a question.  If you ask everyone, there's no shock of "Oh crap attention is on me" because it's on everyone.  You're not putting any pressure, and are not likely to get anything useful out of it.

(Kook claiming)

Short answer is I found scum the first time I tried this.

To elaborate, claiming it the very first post of your game- and making it your meta- does several things.  If it's a true claim, then it's right out there in the open for everyone to know.  It tells people that alignment inspecting you will return a scum result, so go inspect elsewhere.  The big reason is in opposition, though.  If you are one- or are scum- claiming Kook after someone claims a guilty inspection on you is very unlikely to convince people not to lynch you.  The goal is to turn it into a null tell; something that is acknowledged and then moved on from.  The first time I did it, one of the dopps made a huge issue out of it and tried to get me lynched over it.  I eventually figured this out, but the dopp team had a vig and we were pretty much screwed anyway.

Heck, Imp even acknowledged my answering of these.  Why are you trying to be Imp's little helper monkey?


Jim:  If you're so convinced Ranger is scum, why are you voting nonplaying Sinlessmoon over him?


Going to look over things in the AM.

[Persus13]

Persus:  I did answer those:

(RQing everyone)

I dislike the opener of asking everyone a question.  If you ask everyone, there's no shock of "Oh crap attention is on me" because it's on everyone.  You're not putting any pressure, and are not likely to get anything useful out of it.

(Kook claiming)

Short answer is I found scum the first time I tried this.

To elaborate, claiming it the very first post of your game- and making it your meta- does several things.  If it's a true claim, then it's right out there in the open for everyone to know.  It tells people that alignment inspecting you will return a scum result, so go inspect elsewhere.  The big reason is in opposition, though.  If you are one- or are scum- claiming Kook after someone claims a guilty inspection on you is very unlikely to convince people not to lynch you.  The goal is to turn it into a null tell; something that is acknowledged and then moved on from.  The first time I did it, one of the dopps made a huge issue out of it and tried to get me lynched over it.  I eventually figured this out, but the dopp team had a vig and we were pretty much screwed anyway.

Heck, Imp even acknowledged my answering of these.  Why are you trying to be Imp's little helper monkey?

Because I was wondering if I should vote her.


Imp: What questions hasn't Toaster answered?

[Tiruin]

Apologies for extended absence yet again (yeah, coincidence happens that it hits me at this single point in time that it seems consecutive).

Am keeping a list of notes offline, will try to post later. I keep on collapsing to sleep due to schoolwork. u__u

But no way I'm going to ask for a replacement. I can do this.
Any questions I've missed?

Oh, and for that thing on why I voted Max D1--I noted a severe discrepancy through what seems to be an agreeable idea. While my action of asking Persus a question regarding what he saw..the follow-through on Max' defense didn't make much pertinent sense. Sure, it could be 'intervening', but I did note he didn't question Persus afterwards and instead took on kicking that notion until it was bled dry. Meaning: He didn't continue the idea of questioning but instead inflated the idea of 'blocking reasoning'.

I mean, its not like there's a linear way to scumhunt like ask questions or whatever.
So that's why I voted him. I haven't read up until D2 yet however, and will browse back.

Persus:  I did answer those:

(RQing everyone)

-Goodnote-

(Kook claiming)

-importantpost-

Heck, Imp even acknowledged my answering of these.  Why are you trying to be Imp's little helper monkey?

Because I was wondering if I should vote her.[...]

...You're wondering in public?

[Jim Groovester]

Jim:  If you're so convinced Ranger is scum, why are you voting nonplaying Sinlessmoon over him?

I'm trying to crack RangerCado. He's been nice enough to provide me with stuff to use against him.

Even with all my tough talk I'm not currently sure which way he's cracking. I'm leaning scum at the moment.

Sinlessmoon PMed Mephansteras to say he didn't need a replacement despite having done literally nothing all game long. My bet is he's got night game, and with how hard he's lurking I'm assuming the worst. I have no intention of letting him continue doing whatever it is he's doing without making himself available to get a read on.

In short, I want him dead. We'll see how I feel if he ever shows up. My guess is he won't, and I doubt I'll change my mind if he does.

How come you're not giving him crap since he's been in flagrant violation of Toaster's #1 Scumtell for a pretty damn long time now?

[Mephansteras]

The Whiteboard
Imp: Persus13
Sinlessmoon: Jim Groovester, makeinu


Day ends ~5pm Pacific Monday


Superblackcat is replacing in for Max White