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[Knit tie]

I'm not planning to sail off into the sunset. We just need a new base of operations, and if we see something going on (mass stealing from Chemista, capture and torture from HEROES), we step out and fight it, non-lethally as much as we can. The only difference between your plan and mine is that we stand up to Chemista when she oversteps her standards. Continuing to be Evil will just result in our dysfunctional family getting hurt again.

That is exactly my point! The only difference between what you and I propose is that I want to keep Chemista at our side to be able to control her better. But I do believe we need to become a better person! Our previous actions were those of an ignorant and self-righteous killer. We need to use this conversation as a way to see the mistakes we have made and rise above the slaughter. In short, we should become the character we wanted our overlord to be in the very beginning, before LordBucket proposed we euthanise the catatonic girl.

And our family is not getting hurt because we kill innocents, it is getting hurt because we oppose heroes. It has been already established that whenever one tries to stop the heroes from doing their usual slaughter of monsters, he is portrayed as a villain and hunted, or at least sent to the asylum for brainwashing. Hell, the only reason I say we remain overlord is that we can effectively oppose the heroes from murdering monsters. It's just that we need to stop murdering the heroes back.

[shadenight123]

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

It's nice to know I've given the forum-users a tough moral choice. Like in The Witcher or like in Dragon Age. There aren't any 'Good-Good' sides or 'Evil-Evil' sides...but the majority seems to be siding with Chemista.

"I understand," you whisper. You bring your staff of silver cogs forth, "I'm sorry, Knighthowl. I do not remember anything of my past. I do not know you, but I know that while your words sound true...they aren't enough to make me forget what you HEROES did to Cerulean. They aren't enough to make me forget how you HEROES killed her second mother, or how you brutally act against evil without prejudice. I'm sorry. If I could, I would avoid your death. I am sorry friend...but I am the Overlord and that will not change...the world needs me! It needs someone to remove a corrupt system from its very core! It needs someone to take upon the mantle of Evil to purify Good! I will be that man! Forever, shall I carry the weight of sin...because I cannot let someone else bear it for me," you think of Cerulean, "And I will not let any harm befall those who gave their trust to me," you think of Pysquid, Lord Gamington...Chemista as last, and you're actually wondering on her but you add her to the list all the same.
Slamming your staff on the ground you watch as the silver-cog golem comes to surround and lift you inside its protective chest.
"I AM INCOGNITO! Evil Overlord! Knighthowl, Heroic Hero, I will defeat you today!"

"Then so be it...kid," Knighthowl whispers. "You've chosen your side..." he smiles bitterly, "It is time then to end this."

And so, the battle begins.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

1d12= 2 + 4(Heroic Hero) + 6 (My sword shines in the night) Vs 1d12= 10 - 1 (Pure Control) + 14 (My Attack Golem Is My Shield) + 1 (Chemista is an Ex Overlordess) = 12Vs 24= +12!

Your golem's claws come down upon the sword of Knighthowl, parrying it as sparks fly in the air while the Heroic Hero, who already was tired from the fight before, snarls as your golem's right claw slams into his chest, cracking his armor and sending him to fly against the wall where he impacts with a sickening thud. He lands down and coughs out blood, holding on to his chest as he stumbles forward.
"I...am..."
"This wasn't much of a spar I suppose," Chemista remarks eying Knighthowl. "I think it was mostly a one-sided slaughter...just like he did before, right?"
"Enough, Chemista," you remark jumping out of your silver-golem who disassembles back into its basic parts. You then walk forward, to where Knighthowl is gasping for air on the ground of your lair, his breathing ragged and sharp as a pitiful whine comes out of his throat.
"That..." Knighthowl chuckles, or at least tries, "Was just...like I remembered..." his eyes look to you, "I lost..." he whispers. "Do what...you have to...do."
Your staff in hand, you eye the defeated body of Knighthowl.

He didn't kill Gamington, even though he could have.
He isn't like the other heroes, at least those you saw.
You can kill him, if you so wish. He is barely lingering on after all, and he no longer has the strength to fight. Or you can...well, help him?
Whatever your choice is, Chemista waits, as always, behind you.
In the end...
Did you even have Standards to begin with?

That's your decision to make.

Do you kill Knighthowl? Yes-No.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

And damn it you lot. I wanted you to come to that conclusion after this post, not while I was writing it!

[Eotyrannus]

Help him.

"You're a better man than most Heroes, Knighthowl. The one thing I want is a better city, and I can't do it myself. Chemista, go patch him up. I'm the Overlord here."

Go to find the others. Since Knighthowl knows where our Lair is now, find a new location for it.

[10ebbor10]

Help him

On another note, keep a close eye on him, or he might happen to pass away.

[LordBucket]

*shrug*

If this is the path we've chosen, then finish it.

It's pointless to declare war if you're unwilling to follow through. If we're always fighting heroes but never killing them, we're going to end up an a never-ending treadmill until eventually we lose . If we're trying to "be the evil overlord" but always afraid to step on any toes, we're going to be a weak and ineffectual overlord. We chose this path, so walk it.

Kill him.

EDIT:
Tie him up and inject him with mutagen.

[Knit tie]

Help him

You are the kind of person I always wanted to be, Knightwolf. You are the kind of person I hope I will become. You are the kind of person that need to live.

[Eotyrannus]

Help him

You are the kind of person I always wanted to be, Knightwolf. You are the kind of person I hope I will become. You are the kind of person that need to live.

Just keep your eyes open to the wrongs that HEROES will do, and fight them. Make sure you know the difference between Cruelty and Justice.

[jaass]

He might be a tired old warrior who want a way out  but his morals and the system are preventing him to. If that is the case we should just kill him. If that is not the reason then we should help him.

[Knit tie]

LordBucket, why are you always either so opposed to violence or so calmly suggesting that we proceed with the killing? Being a Hero is not about fighting while you think that violence is good and becoming pacifistic when you realise that is is bad. It is about making hard choices. We did not make any before, so let us begin our redemption by making one now.

[Talvara]

while I would like to try and corrupt the guy, I'd guess considering his background we'd have a very hard time trusting him. worrying hed backstab us at every turn.

so the overlord guidebook compels me to:
Kill him edit: lord bucket has swayed me, we might aswell try the mutagen. (which is going to be weird since hes already a wolfman thing but hey! Science!)

[LordBucket]

Inject him with mutagen.

If we do, he either joins us immediately like everyone else has, which would both help our philosophical quandry since we're avoided killing our friend and it also immediately makes us stronger...which we're kind of in need of anyway. Or, it changes his body, but he refuse to join us...in which case he becomes a monster and sees first hand what it's like on this side of the playing field, sees firsthand how the heroes treat monsters...and very likely becomes personally sympathetic to our cause.

Or, it kills him. In which case we don't have to worry about him attacking us again.

I see no downside to injecting him.

[Knit tie]

Inject him with mutagen.

If we do, he either joins us immediately like everyone else has, which would both help our philosophical quandry since we're avoided killing our friend and it also immediately makes us stronger...which we're kind of in need of anyway. Or, it changes his body, but he refuse to join us...in which case he becomes a monster and sees first hand what it's like on this side of the playing field, sees firsthand how the heroes treat monsters...and very likely becomes personally sympathetic to our cause.

Or, it kills him. In which case we don't have to worry about him attacking us again.

I see no downside to injecting him.

You know, yes. We do not murder people, but there is nothing wrong with helping them see the truth.

That is, of course, if it makes any difference. He is already a wolfman. Aren't the heroes sometimes inhuman themselves?

[Dorsidwarf]

Help him. Let him go. Do NOT do anything like inject with mutagens. Send him home on the airship he came in on.

[10ebbor10]

Help him. Let him go. Do NOT do anything like inject with mutagens. Send him home on the airship he came in on.

Meaning we loose

a) An airship
b) Our base
c) Our only option to evacuate our base (After all Psysquid already took the other airship)

So let's not to do that. Just keep him alive, and let's have another talk.

[LordBucket]

LordBucket, why are you always either so opposed to
violence or so calmly suggesting that we proceed with the killing?

Your worldview and mine are so dissimilar that it's difficult for you to see the logical consistency behind my thinking. Our facts are different, so we naturally come to different conclusions.

Being a Hero is not about fighting while you think that violence is good and becoming pacifistic when you realise that is is
bad. It is about making hard choices. We did not make any before, so let us begin our redemption by making one now.

Spoiler: stuff (click to show/hide)

1) I have no illusions about us being a hero. We've chosen to stay here and perpetuate the system that we're unhappy about. That doesn't make us a hero. It makes us foolish.

2) I don't think that violence is "good." I think that it is effective when properly applied. For example, if we know that Bob is likely to create problems for us, and if we kill Bob, we can be relatively assured that Bob will not create problems for us. It's really very simple.

3) "Pacifism" was not my motivation is suggesting we walk away. The motivation was to not perpetuate the system. To not continue to do the thing we were unhappy about. To not be one of the people we disagree with. To simply choose to not participate in the thing. If 1000 people in a village to the east and 1000 people in the village to the west are all fighting each other...you don't solve that problem by starting a new village in the north and attacking them both. There's a rather amusing anecdote about a software programmer that comes to mind. He sees that there are a dozen different text editors, and it frustrates him that nobody can agree on single standard editor and that he has to learn 12 different editors. So his solution is to make another one. Until somebody slaps him and says they don't want to have to learn 13.

The method that you're using to solve your problem is not going to solve the problem. It's simply going to perpetuate it.

4) Sure we've made hard choices. We chose to make a personal appearance in the hospital knowing there was a heroic hero present. And we chose to kill the girl in the hospital knowing that it might alienate Cerulean. From my point of view, you are the one trying to take the easy path: you're trying to appease your conscience, but you refuse to walk away from the situation, and now you're refusing to accept the consequences of your decision to fight by refusing to follow through on Knighthowl. You're just going to let him go. And he's just going to leave, rally forces, get stronger and come back.

5) My motivation has nothing to do with redemption. I feel no guilt about how we've played the game so far.

6) I simply suggest that if we're going to choose this path...then walk the path we've chosen. Let's not waste our time deluding ourselves. If we're seriously going to take on an entire society of people who are completely eager and willing to kill and torture us to maintain the status quo...and we're going to try to force a change of the status quo...we're not going to get very far if we refuse to use force. What are you going to do? Are you going to turn down all destruction missions? Are you going to let everyone get away to get stronger and attack us again?

I suggested that we walk away. You wanted to fight them, so fight them. Don't stay to fight them but refuse to fight. Make up your mind.

We do not murder people, but there is nothing wrong with helping them see the truth.

What are you talking about? Of course we do. We've killed lots of people when it accomplishes our goals. Why are you suddenly hesitant now? You were the one who wanted to stay and fight these people.