Demdemeh:
As a personal favor please make it clear what points you are addressing with each sentence. At the very least split your responses into paragraphs based on what point you are responding to.
Alright then; points that I feel need to be addressed:
And I came back from my "hiatus" well before your mistake. Weekends don't count, remember?
Fair; I was wrong to accuse you of having taken 28 hours to answer my post, as with the weekend not being counted count it only took you ten hours; so my apologies there.
[spoiler]Demdemeh:
First off, I appreciate your defending me, Shinigami, but saying yourself that you think I'm slightly scummy and then later telling people they shouldn't vote for me seems a bit too "reverse psychology". Especially considering your earlier defense of Lenglon, who you also outright stated is "scummy". I'd also like to know your responses to griffinpup's inquiries, which have been conveniently requoted here.
How is being defended useful to town and why are you grateful for it? It seems like you're just glad the pressure against you is in part being deflected by Shinigami.
Specifically right here. I particularly appreciate your manufacturing the whole "good for town" angle, but I've already spoken on that.
Your exact words to Shinigami were "I appreciate your defending me, Shinigami." The only reason I can see to "appreciate" some one defending you is if you are scum. Hence the question: I wanted to know if you had another opinion about that that would give you a reason to appreciate him while acting in the interest of town. As you seem to use appreciate less as a form of "gratefulness" and more as a form of "admire", I'm willing to let this one slid.
You should be glad, though. You've got me off Shinigami's back. Isn't that what you wanted?
I think you're accusing me of chainsawing you to protect Shinigami; which is complete rubbish and you know it.
My reason for pressing you was based on your presentation of your case and the assumptions you made in making your case against Shinigami and pressing griffinpup.
Isn't one of the major points to this game to unite town against a perceived member of the scum team and have him lynched? Should it matter to me that I'm not the one applying pressure to someone I believe is scum? I don't think it should. I think I should be glad to direct pressure where I feel it's due.
This is addressing me calling you out on not applying pressure on Shinigami yourself, and relying on re-posting griffinpup's questions to apply pressure. Note how it does not actually address that; and rather is an excuse for not providing your own case. Let me ask again then: why did you copy griffinpup's questions press Shinigami when your own case was only "why did you defend Lenglon when you claimed he was scummy?"[
Link].
Your case btw makes no sense if you paid attention to the chronology of Shinigami's defense of Lenglon, and then calling him scummy. It sounds like you're being opportunistic and looking for places where you can manipulate people's statements and reads to paint them scummy wherever possible.
As for my response to griffinpup, at the time his attack on me for my own suspicions against Shinigami was, I felt, a little over-the-top. My own response seemed to be actually a little lower-impact than the original attack.... In rereading his post, it is obvious that pup was after more than just my attacking Shinigami; he wanted to know my reasons. That's not quite the reverse, but it's not the same, either, so we're both wrong. And, to undermine your own foundation, I acknowledged that at the time, anyway.
I think griffionpup made it clear
here that he wasn't attacking you over the actual act of voting shinigami and just over the fact that you hadn't provided reasons. What made you so sure that your act of attacking Shinigami was the issue at hand?
I still rather think that some large portion of your misunderstanding of my statements is deliberate. You came onto me rather hot while I was at the top of the suspicion charts, and you're keeping it up in the face of this new scandal. Your little slip-up was quite telling, though, and while I don't know where RangerCado stands on the truth chart, I'm pretty sure at this point that you're just scum trying to manipulate the situation to your best advantage. It would help if your perceived meanings of my statements were closer to what was actually said, of course.
Sentence by sentence then:
My misunderstanding is based on the fact that you make no sense; as is hopefully evident by now.
Honestly the day end was three days away (one and a half if you don't count weekends); and so I wasn't really paying attention to where you were in the charts. Hammers are not in effect so it doesn't really matter, I will press scum where I see them.
I'd like to point out that this is the only time you've mentioned the slip-up to my face (more on that in a bit). Just so you know for future reference: you also weaken your pressure on Ranger here as you mention your doubt.
It would help if you made any sense, of course.
I think that's all the points addressed to me.
Now if you don't mind
Demdemeh I have a couple more points that I want you to address (In addition to the ones made above).
There are points that he made that are similar to the ones that I was trying, and failing, to make, yes. Specifically his reaction to active scumhunting and deliberately delaying his own, with a public admission. Does that help you, at all?
Let's compare that to your actual pressure to Shinigami:
First off, I appreciate your defending me, Shinigami, but saying yourself that you think I'm slightly scummy and then later telling people they shouldn't vote for me seems a bit too "reverse psychology". Especially considering your earlier defense of Lenglon, who you also outright stated is "scummy". I'd also like to know your responses to griffinpup's inquiries, which have been conveniently requoted here.
Demdemeh- I don't understand what you are saying when you say that
Quote
On the other hand, your point is very good on other being able to hide while this argument is going on
. After joining this discussion haven't I painted a target on myself? Yeah, just wondering.
I wasn't specifically referring to you with this statement. Others have been far quieter, and have spoken little except with regards to you and Lenglon. You have at least been responding, and have been front and center with the discussion, so hiding isn't a scumtell that could be attributed to you.
On the other hand, your point is very good on other being able to hide while this argument is going on, SK. Why is it so hard to think with this kind of pressure? That's what Mafia is, right? And the entire point of the RVS, from what little I've seen, is to apply pressure to people and see how they react. So, with that observation in play, can you, Shinigami_King, let us know why you choose to play a game which has the potential to disrupt your thinking so strongly? Or is it simply the "Bible of Scumhunting" style of play that Vector is using which upsets you? "If you're suspicious, push... if they move, push harder," right?
So what do you feel is the best strategy for scumhunting?
Not included: Shinigami delaying his scum hunting. In the interest of completeness you DO mention this in your read on him when attempting to defend yourself from Ranger
here. Why did you only use this to defend your case on Shinigami rather than say; pressing him about it?
In your posts to griffinpup and Lenglon you make a rather odd claim:
Well, since GDay all but claimed mafia up there, and implied that you were a mafia power role with the whole "don't make all our power roles vulnerable to town" thing, I think it's natural to wonder if any other power roles are involved, don't you? Of course, GDay may very well BE mafia, and be attempting to bus you as the actual Town Cop, but that is, of course, WIFOM. As for myself, I think that I've gotten enough ammo lately to feel pretty strongly that GDay is scum, what with the rampant misinterpretation and attacking in the last posts addressed my way, and with the whole typo thing. That just seems like too much of a Freudian slip to me, and I don't think that it's likely that GDay has played enough scum roles in the past to justify that sort of thinking without actually being scum this time. It's just too convenient a typo, really, and there's nothing to gain from looking that scummy, especially on day one; not from an actual townie, anyway.
Lenglon: If you're referring to Shinigami's claim earlier in the day that the probability of the two of you both being scum was low, that was a legitimate response to Gday's statements to that exact fact earlier in the same day. While you're right that it definitely leaves room to infer that he is scum, it leaves equal room to infer that you might be, too. However, Gday's slip was a flat-out admission of guilt through claiming adversity with town. There's a pretty big difference between the two.
Specifically what I'm seeing here is that you are claiming that my sentence was a deliberate statement of intent, rather than what it was; a typo. You know this is bullshit, as you say in your post to griffinpup. So why are you claiming that? Are you trying to whip together a bandwagon?
Author
Topic: BM XLI: On Wings of Haven -- Scum Victory! (Read 102204 times)