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[Descan]

* Descan hugs Glyph

[palsch]

Scalzi on women and geekdom. Mostly focusing on fandom in general, but still relevant to gaming culture.

[Putnam]

holy shit the comments on that article aren't full of fuckwads

[Vector]

Because that's what a moderated "safe space" is =_=

"BUT FREEDOM OF SPEEECH"

Yeah yeah.

[Rolan7]

No no, it's clearly proof that sexism doesn't exist on comment boards, and therefore doesn't exist anywhere.

[Putnam]

No no, it's clearly proof that sexism doesn't exist on comment boards, and therefore doesn't exist anywhere.

obvi

[palsch]

A follow-up FAQ to the Zelda role reversal thing.

[Neonivek]

A follow-up FAQ to the Zelda role reversal thing.

Wow, so every complaint that I honestly thought would halfway be resolved in game through the plot was... true.

As well the creator isn't aware of "implied character traits" that you can infer to even blank slate characters. I mean there is a lot you can fill in and a lot absent but Link isn't "without personality".

Anyhow Link is about defeating the odds and being able to walk the path to victory and Zelda is about choosing the one possible way to victory (And Ganon is about being powerful enough to open his way to victory), which is why they tend to work well together. Somehow this makes me think that in the story Zelda will just constantly harass Link and force him to do these dangerous and painful things for her own end.

[palsch]

As well the creator isn't aware of "implied character traits" that you can infer to even blank slate characters. I mean there is a lot you can fill in and a lot absent but Link isn't "without personality".

It’s hard to answer this because the characters of Zelda and Link are usually very simple. Link, especially, has almost no personality at all by design, since he’s a stand-in for the player. However, there’s a lot of personality you can pull from the gameplay style of Link in contrast to Zelda, and it might be best summed up as Courage vs. Wisdom, the two Triforce elements Link & Zelda often represent, respectively.

Isn't that exactly talking about implied character traits?

[Neonivek]

He is getting that just from the Tri-force.

He is forgetting Link to the Past where Link's True form is a Pink Bunny for example, symbolic of his gentle nature.

Mind you in Twilight Princess he has a different personality, hense why he becomes a Wolf... but I don't know if the Dark World has the same mechanics in both games.

[Graknorke]

As well the creator isn't aware of "implied character traits" that you can infer to even blank slate characters. I mean there is a lot you can fill in and a lot absent but Link isn't "without personality".

It’s hard to answer this because the characters of Zelda and Link are usually very simple. Link, especially, has almost no personality at all by design, since he’s a stand-in for the player. However, there’s a lot of personality you can pull from the gameplay style of Link in contrast to Zelda, and it might be best summed up as Courage vs. Wisdom, the two Triforce elements Link & Zelda often represent, respectively.

Obviously both Zelda and Link possess wisdom and courage, but the play style of Link is a direct sword-and-shield approach, as he is the quintessential “heroic knight” protagonist. Solving puzzles and using your brain is essential to all of Link’s adventures, but if we were going to distinguish him from a Zelda-protagonist play style, I would say that Link stands his ground and marches into danger, while Zelda would take a more thoughtful approach.  Link is scrappy and fearless, while Zelda is cunning and patient.

EDIT: Argh, nitpick-ninjad.

[Neonivek]

Countered again! He is making the differences superficial. "Link is courage so he beats them up with a sword, while Zelda is wisdom and beats them up with magic!"

As well they are both cunning.

[Graknorke]

Countered again! He is making the differences superficial. "Link is courage so he beats them up with a sword, while Zelda is wisdom and beats them up with magic!"

As well they are both cunning.

No, not really. It's "Link is courage so he runs in and beats them up with a sword, while Zelda is wisdom and so waits to pick the best opportunity to fight.".

[moocowmoo]

Has it been discussed that nearly all the games being showcased are Japanese? My father is second generation Japanese American, and even though his generation grew up in Western culture, I can see a very different dynamic between men and women than is typical for the West. It was even more pronounced in my grandparents. From a western point of view, the women's behavior might be labelled submissive and weak, and the men might be accused of misogynism.

Someone earlier in the thread listed a bunch of games with strong female protagonists, and if I remember correctly many of the titles were by Western developers. I am not versed in the methods of setting up social science experiments, but is it not significant that most of the data is taken from one country, especially when the results are interpreted to prove a trend in a different country and culture?

[PanH]

Countered again! He is making the differences superficial. "Link is courage so he beats them up with a sword, while Zelda is wisdom and beats them up with magic!"

As well they are both cunning.

He's not making anything superficial, he's just summing things. So yeah, he didn't make an essay about it (about implied traits, etc).