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[peskyninja]

The gaming world of most 12-14 years old consists mainly of COD and Fifa ATM.

I think you forgot the iOS and mobile crap. Damn how I hate those. I have to hide my power level when someone tries to talk me about that s***.

[pilgrimboy]

The problem isn't the companies. It's the consumer. If someone is willing to pay someone else to level up their character for them, any smart company would wonder why they don't just sell the higher level character. However, the conclusions they come to are faulty. Giving someone who is willing to pay for a higher level character something that everyone can't just get while enjoying the game, makes everyone else feel slighted. And that is where all this pay to play stuff frustrates me. When I buy a game, I want to buy the whole game. I don't want to pay $60 and then be expected to pay $30 more.

[miauw62]

The gaming world of most 12-14 years old consists mainly of COD and Fifa ATM.

I think you forgot the iOS and mobile crap. Damn how I hate those. I have to hide my power level when someone tries to talk me about that s***.

We think the same. I just tought that I should add that to my post while in the shower. There ARE some decent timewasters on android/iOS tough, like that coin dozer thingy, wich looks neat for a timewaster. But then again, the google play store is 50% ripoffs of already shitty games that cover another 40% of the games in the play store.

[Vattic]

So, yeah, I think it's an evolution whose most recent ancestors have been in the MMO world. The earliest examples there would be paying someone for l00t and leveling characters. I'm sure there was a precedent prior to MMOs in gaming, but they'd be far more exceptional before that point.

I sold a fair few cloned level 100 pokémon back in the day. Made sure to train them properly too.

[aristabulus]

The problem isn't the companies. It's the consumer. ...

And the fact that "consumer" has become the operative word is also a problem.  By making that the identity label, when "customer"/"player" would suffice (and be more respectful of those that contribute to a revenue stream), it's framing the entire discussion that follows.  Yeah yeah, I know, the way things play out is that games don't last forever.  Some are inherently one-play-done, others take longer to master but ultimately the fun wanes along with the relative challenge/progress.  I reject the notion that all we are good for is consuming things.  We are not cattle, chained to a trough on one end and the loo on the other.

Respecting the player is what this thread's starting topic is really about, in essence.  Game design that coerces people to spend more on trivial things in the middle of the experience ( *_especially_* after already paying US$60/€45(?)/AUS$100 for the box ) is a shitty way to treat the people that give you money.  This is why I have spent precious few dollars on games in the last 12 years, and the majority of them went to CCP for running a 2-toon solo team for a year, or Asymmetric (KoL) for Mr. Accessories, or GoG for tasty classics on sale.  EA hasn't seen a dime from me since 1999, when I got Dungeon Keeper 2, and likely never will again.  EA will crash and burn before their culture changes to something I would support.

[Neonivek]

The Sims 3 oddly enough had a patch that came out WAY later that actually forced the "The Sims 3 shop" right into your game.

Unless you turn it off in the menu (it starts on) all the store items are first in line to clog up the Buy and build menus. Then even if you turn it off the Sims store icon (Which there was always ONE of but now there is two) is a big beaming button that is much more distracting then anything else.

Now just try to tell me "If you don't like it don't buy it" because I'll tell you now... There REALLY was no choice in the matter was there?

[Levi]

Now just try to tell me "If you don't like it don't buy it" because I'll tell you now... There REALLY was no choice in the matter was there?

TF2 got its microtransactions part way through as well.  It was my favorite game up to that point.   

Sometimes I'm paranoid about buying things that MIGHT eventually get microtransactions.  It sort of seems like a bad deal that companies can change their games so drastically after you buy it.

[Neonivek]

The Sims 3 had microtransactions pretty much forever any EVERYONE knew it was a total rip off and overpriced junk.

It was just that they became more and more obnoxious with trying to advertise it to you (especially since anyone who still plays The Sims 3 has pretty much no impulse control or sense of worth)

I mean imagine playing a game where "Buy our stuff!" is RIGHT THERE while you are playing it! not even in a Lobby.

[Leatra]

The problem isn't the companies. It's the consumer. ...

And the fact that "consumer" has become the operative word is also a problem.  By making that the identity label, when "customer"/"player" would suffice (and be more respectful of those that contribute to a revenue stream), it's framing the entire discussion that follows.  Yeah yeah, I know, the way things play out is that games don't last forever.  Some are inherently one-play-done, others take longer to master but ultimately the fun wanes along with the relative challenge/progress.  I reject the notion that all we are good for is consuming things.  We are not cattle, chained to a trough on one end and the loo on the other.

Respecting the player is what this thread's starting topic is really about, in essence.  Game design that coerces people to spend more on trivial things in the middle of the experience ( *_especially_* after already paying US$60/€45(?)/AUS$100 for the box ) is a shitty way to treat the people that give you money.  This is why I have spent precious few dollars on games in the last 12 years, and the majority of them went to CCP for running a 2-toon solo team for a year, or Asymmetric (KoL) for Mr. Accessories, or GoG for tasty classics on sale.  EA hasn't seen a dime from me since 1999, when I got Dungeon Keeper 2, and likely never will again.  EA will crash and burn before their culture changes to something I would support.

We get treated according to how we act. People like you and me are the minority. Most gamers are cattle, being milked by big companies. We have seven Call of Duty games and if "consumers" are still "consuming" it, why should companies stop milking?

[peskyninja]

Well...At least stuff is changing.THQ went down the hole and took a bunch a good IPs with it. But I hope someday people realize in what kind of stuff they are putting money on. (For example:Curiosity)
I swear to you that I laughed my ass off when I discovered their servers couldn't handle and the japs were losing their internetz monies. I bet that the url in the cube shows molyneux in the appice of his madness dancing ontop of his 100km^2 italian villa .

[Dishwater]

I agree that the gaming industry is trying to make as much money as possible at minimum effort.  But so is every other business type,the reason people start a business is to fill a market gap and make money.

And it has become very noticeable now,just five years ago I bought a game and it was completed, but now we have these very annoying inactivated "DLCs" on disc.So now I have to pay for a separate "license" to use stuff already on the disc?

But this market is still putting out as much crap as before, you just see it now because of advertising, we still get those maybe five good games a year as before nobody is forcing you to buy the ones you don't like so ignore them,your still getting the ones you like and they're getting what they want.

So in my opinion things haven't changed much we still get crap and good games but the distribution and market networks have grown massively its much easier to sell a game now then before and that's why it looks like it does today.

[Graknorke]

Now just try to tell me "If you don't like it don't buy it" because I'll tell you now... There REALLY was no choice in the matter was there?

TF2 got its microtransactions part way through as well.  It was my favorite game up to that point.   

Sometimes I'm paranoid about buying things that MIGHT eventually get microtransactions.  It sort of seems like a bad deal that companies can change their games so drastically after you buy it.

The thing about TF2 is that what you can buy doesn't really give a gameplay advantage. It just lets you collect new hats and sometimes keys to open crates, but none of the weapons even give an outright advantage. They're usually bonuses balanced by negatives.
Also, Valve don't charge for basic upgrades or maps.

[Levi]

Now just try to tell me "If you don't like it don't buy it" because I'll tell you now... There REALLY was no choice in the matter was there?

TF2 got its microtransactions part way through as well.  It was my favorite game up to that point.   

Sometimes I'm paranoid about buying things that MIGHT eventually get microtransactions.  It sort of seems like a bad deal that companies can change their games so drastically after you buy it.

The thing about TF2 is that what you can buy doesn't really give a gameplay advantage. It just lets you collect new hats and sometimes keys to open crates, but none of the weapons even give an outright advantage. They're usually bonuses balanced by negatives.
Also, Valve don't charge for basic upgrades or maps.

They sell weaponry.  Having more offensive choices is an advantage(admittedly a small one, but that is all that it takes for me to be annoyed).  Frankly they should never have started dropping weapons at all, just give all the weapons to everyone, and make the silly hats collectible.  It was a scumbag move by Valve.  They could have made plenty of money just off the cosmetics.

I felt dirty playing a game that had even a small P2W advantage, so I quit it.

[peskyninja]

Bad news Sega will get relic.SEGA! SEGA! SEGA! THEY WILL GET HOMEWOLRD! HOMEWORLD! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.

[LoSboccacc]

totally expect "impossible space marine space total war 20121: tales of sonic"