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Author Topic: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Game Over!  (Read 89422 times)

Toaster

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Day One (13/13) - #4ksxb549ksap053l
« Reply #105 on: January 20, 2013, 12:25:06 am »

NQT:  Sounds like a Freudian slip to me.
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notquitethere

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Day One (13/13) - #4ksxb549ksap053l
« Reply #106 on: January 20, 2013, 12:30:25 am »

Toaster: It was a parapraxis, but not one that reveals anything malign about my character. Tiruin and Captain Ford are both active players in the BM I was just playing in, hence the possibility of getting them confused.
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TolyK

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Actually full, rolling setup
« Reply #107 on: January 20, 2013, 02:27:54 am »

Damn, so many posts - I forgot about that problem :P

Let's begin.

TolyK: How do you feel about this game, given your playstyle. Supposing you're scum, how would you pick your targets?
Given my playstyle, I'd probably die as scum on the second or third day. :D
But supposing I were scum, I'd probably look for people who seemed to not go after each other much/played coallied, which is basically the safest strategy. I'd prefer lynching targets to killing them, since that's safer, and is more likely to hit town rather than mason, which means that kills would be statistically safer.

TolyK:  Under what circumstances would you fire off your kill D1?
If there were obviously people mason-buddying (and I were scum), I'd think about firing off my kill D1, but on the other hand it could also be a trap.
As I said just above, I'd prefer lynching folks to killing them. If I slipped really badly, I'd probably go for a dox on somebody (statistically bad - 44% chance of hitting), probably someone who's not voting me.

Toaster
So why did you ask?
Well I know what I think is the right course of action. I wanted to know what you thought.
Quote
Also, since you have my attention- Would you make a tie at day-end to save a mafia-buddy?  Mason-buddy?
Obviously yes if I were scum: according to the rules, in the case of an absolute tie, the mafia get to decide who gets lynched.

Let's run through the mason scenario in a bit more detail:

I am a mason and I have the option of voting for a non-mason to force a tie. If I don't force a tie, another mason will be lyched. What do I do?

Option one: I vote for a non-mason, creating a tie (assuming no plurality vote, whatever that is). If the person I voted for is scum, the scum will kill the mason. Me forcing a draw reveals me to be mason to the scum (as town wouldn't do this), and so they'll probably have the mason I was trying to save lynched anyway, as it's a safe mason-kill for them. So whether or not the person I vote for is scum, the mafia will lynch the mason I was trying to save.

Option two: I don't vote and the mason gets lynched, revealing them to be mason. We're one mason down and no one knows I'm mason.

Option three: I bandwagon on the mason kill. A mason will die but people will suspect me less as a mason.

Whichever way I look at it, the mason dies. Option three is probably best because it might make me look town to scum, potentially resulting in a rebound-kill.

Obolisk0430 and TolyK: do you think my reasoning here is sound?
Not quite:
 Option 1's logic assumes the lynchee is a certified mason. If not, you could be either scum (who wants to even the votes to cause confusion) or just some townie who thinks the other person is more scummy.
 Option 3's "good" part also has a flipside - town move you closer to scum if you obviously bandwagon. Or, nothing can happen at all, which is basically the same as Option 2 except that you helped kill a fellow mason.
Hold on...
It's the townie who gets the passive protection, not the mason, so it wouldn't "potentially result(...) in a rebound-kill", rather "make you a higher-risk kill target, and make you a higher-payoff lynch target".

Edosurist, you haven't posted yet, and I haven't seen you before. What practice do you have before this game? And, more importantly, what do you think is harder to play as, town or mason? (Give your reasoning).

Phantom: What do you think about this statement: "People tend to give examples of what they'd do if they were of a different alignment than they really are (if they are asked), and tend to ask questions that put the addressed person into their alignment. The first part is to throw people off their scent, while the second part is to get suggestions on how others would play their alignment." What part is true (if any), and what part is logically incorrect (if any)?

I have some other questions, but not enough time... whatevs.

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Shakerag: Who are you personally suspicious of?
At this point?  TolyK.

Teneb

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Actually full, rolling setup
« Reply #108 on: January 20, 2013, 09:13:53 am »

Deathsword: If you were mafia about to be lynched, what would you do? Would your answer change if one or more of your buddies was bussing you?
Were I mafia and was about to be lynched, and didn't think I could make the other players change their minds, I would perform a kill. Being bussed wouldn't change this answer.

Deathsword: How would you pretend not to be scum?
By not being scum.

More seriously, however: scum should act as they do in most games, which means they should act like town. I doubt the lack of a team-chat will change the scum's behaviour when it comes to this.



ZU: If you were scum, what players wouldn't you want on your team? Why?

NQT: Are you going to keep asking the same question to more than one player, or are you going to try and make some original ones? Also, nice attempt to buddy up to me, scum.

obolisk: I don't think I've seen you around here before. Have you ever played a setup like this?
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Nerjin

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Day One (13/13) - #4ksxb549ksap053l
« Reply #109 on: January 20, 2013, 10:38:50 am »

Nerjin: Do you believe it is good to claim as a Mason if Town? What if Town as Mason - and how would you look at both if you're scum?

As town claiming mason would likely get you lynched via the masons. Claiming Town as Mason... Hm... I think that might work. Some more hot-headed scum may go after you but more likely they won't do a thing until they are forced to by bad odds.

If I were scum I wouldn't trust either claim. So to shorten all of this: Town to Mason: Bad. Mason to Town: Less Bad. Scum-thought: Don't trust.

Nerjin: Do you think running a game gives you an edge in playing a game?

... Yep. I believe that running a vanilla game gives me a huge edge in this free-form one. Actually wait... No, no I don't. But seriously though I still feel I'm incredibly bad at Mafia compared to some of the older members on the forum. I believe I'm better than the newer ones just by the point that I've played a few games.

NQT I have a question for you. Why so interested in scum advice?

Nerjin: Do you think it will be more fun being a mason or a regular town?

Town isn't normal if you ask me in this game. But semantics aside I believe it'd be more fun to play as Mason if simply for the fact that you can die at any time. With town you have a week to save yourself. With Mason you can die at any time. I'm a gambler and I like taking risks. What can I say...
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notquitethere

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Actually full, rolling setup
« Reply #110 on: January 20, 2013, 01:52:36 pm »

Unvote

Deathsword
NQT: Are you going to keep asking the same question to more than one player, or are you going to try and make some original ones? Also, nice attempt to buddy up to me, scum.
It's efficient to get more than one person's perspective on the same issue, or do you disagree? If you'll look, I've asked everyone at least one question and most of them are different, which is more than can be said for some players. I'm sorry that you misinterpreted my friendly joking with Teruin as an earnest attempt to buddy up. Was that a deliberate twisting of the truth, Deathsword?

Nerjin
NQT I have a question for you. Why so interested in scum advice?
I'm interested in hunting scum, and asking how a player would play as scum seems like a pretty good line of enquiry. Do you disagree?
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Leafsnail

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Day One (13/13) - #4ksxb549ksap053l
« Reply #111 on: January 20, 2013, 01:56:51 pm »

Votecount (7 votes to lynch):
Dariush: Captain Ford (1)
Tiruin:
Nerjin:
Phantom of The Library: Toaster (1)
Captain Ford:
TolyK: Tiruin (1)
Edosurist: obolisk0430, TolyK (2)
Deathsword: notquitethere (1)
Urist Imiknorris:
notquitethere: Urist Imiknorris, Deathsword, Nerjin <--- L-4
zombie urist:
Toaster:
obolisk0430:

Not voting: Dariush, Phantom of The Library, Edosurist, zombie urist (4)

I'll try to give mod updates roughly every 24 hours, and I'll say if anyone hasn't posted since the last one.
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Captain Ford

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Day One (13/13) - #4ksxb549ksap053l
« Reply #112 on: January 20, 2013, 01:58:32 pm »

notquitethere:
On that note, how would you Captain Ford pretend to be scum?
Why would I want to do that? There's no alignment in this game that could benefit from pretending to be scum.

Also, apologies, I meant 'Tiruin', not 'Captain Ford'- no bizarre diversion intended!
Oh, that makes more sense now. Except the question still doesn't make any sense.

zombie urist:
Dariush: What is your strategy?
Phantom of the Library: In your opinion, which side has the advantage in this game?
notquitethere: Since you're here, same question. Which side do you think has the advantage?
Also, were you serious about lynching the last person to post?
Toaster: Have you ever played a setup like this before? If so, how did it go?
These questions are bad.
Why?

Nerjin:
Nerjin: Do you believe it is good to claim as a Mason if Town? What if Town as Mason - and how would you look at both if you're scum?

As town claiming mason would likely get you lynched via the masons. Claiming Town as Mason... Hm... I think that might work. Some more hot-headed scum may go after you but more likely they won't do a thing until they are forced to by bad odds.

If I were scum I wouldn't trust either claim. So to shorten all of this: Town to Mason: Bad. Mason to Town: Less Bad. Scum-thought: Don't trust.
Really? Wouldn't the masons be outing themselves if they went after you?
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...Holy shit. Ford, you get the Official Medal of Epic Awesomeness.
Its official! Ford! You need to put it in your sig now! "Official Mafia Welcomer!"

obolisk0430

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Day One (13/13) - #4ksxb549ksap053l
« Reply #113 on: January 20, 2013, 02:16:28 pm »

Toaster: you have posted twice since I posted, and haven't answered my question.  Answer it.
Deathsword:  I haven't played in a setup like this before, but I have been in a few games on this forum before.
NQT: If I understand correctly, then yes, I do agree with your reasoning.
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notquitethere

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Day One (13/13) - #4ksxb549ksap053l
« Reply #114 on: January 20, 2013, 02:37:08 pm »

notquitethere:
On that note, how would you Captain Ford pretend to be scum?
Why would I want to do that? There's no alignment in this game that could benefit from pretending to be scum.
Hah! And to compound my idiocy, I accidentally omitted the 'not' from the above question, which were editing allowed I would have fixed. Here's a better phrased question: is there any benefit in a townie claiming to be a mason or vice versa?
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Teneb

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Actually full, rolling setup
« Reply #115 on: January 20, 2013, 02:51:00 pm »

Deathsword
NQT: Are you going to keep asking the same question to more than one player, or are you going to try and make some original ones? Also, nice attempt to buddy up to me, scum.
It's efficient to get more than one person's perspective on the same issue, or do you disagree? If you'll look, I've asked everyone at least one question and most of them are different, which is more than can be said for some players.
Copying questions others have asked you in the same game or those you have asked to others is extremely lazy. You may have asked each player a question, but the number of questions matter little if their content is poor, as the usual case with RVS question (as their point is to get the game going). One can type a wall of text and say absolutely nothing at all. And when Tiruin accused you of buddying up to me you were quite quick to deflect it with sarcasm and a repeated question directed at Ford/Tiruin (you claim to have meant to ask Tiruin that, instead of Ford, but I think you are just trying to cover up your slip).

Quote from: NQT
I'm sorry that you misinterpreted my friendly joking with Teruin as an earnest attempt to buddy up. Was that a deliberate twisting of the truth, Deathsword?
No, I do indeed you were trying to buddy up with me, and then when I accused you of that together with a vote you were quick to vote me back. Why so jumpy, scum? Afraid you slipped and didn't cover up properly?
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Dariush

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Day One (13/13) - #4ksxb549ksap053l
« Reply #116 on: January 20, 2013, 03:12:00 pm »

Busy today, post tomorrow.

notquitethere

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Actually full, rolling setup
« Reply #117 on: January 20, 2013, 03:29:16 pm »

Deathsword
Copying questions others have asked you in the same game or those you have asked to others is extremely lazy.
Okay, I take your point: I will be a beacon of originality from here on in  :D. I still think it's better to engage as many people as possible.
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No, I do indeed you were trying to buddy up with me, and then when I accused you of that together with a vote you were quick to vote me back. Why so jumpy, scum? Afraid you slipped and didn't cover up properly?
Nice try Deathsword, but you're reading far too much into things. I said "Scumbuddy Deathsword, help me out here!" as a joking quip to Tiruin: of course I wasn't seriously trying to address you, let alone buddy up. Your hyper-paranoid response seemed to warrant a pressure vote, but I wouldn't read too much into it as we're still in the random vote stage.
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Captain Ford

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Day One (13/13) - #4ksxb549ksap053l
« Reply #118 on: January 20, 2013, 04:31:49 pm »

notquitethere:
On that note, how would you Captain Ford pretend to be scum?
Why would I want to do that? There's no alignment in this game that could benefit from pretending to be scum.
Hah! And to compound my idiocy, I accidentally omitted the 'not' from the above question, which were editing allowed I would have fixed. Here's a better phrased question: is there any benefit in a townie claiming to be a mason or vice versa?
No. Both townies and mafia have an incentive to claim mason. Masons can't tell which they are, so they should regard it as a nulltell. Masons could also claim it as a double-bluff, so a mason claim should universally be treated as a nulltell. Everyone has an incentive to claim it, and so it doesn't give anyone any new information.

On that note, I'm a mason. 8)
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...Holy shit. Ford, you get the Official Medal of Epic Awesomeness.
Its official! Ford! You need to put it in your sig now! "Official Mafia Welcomer!"

Captain Ford

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Re: Mafia and Masons and Hackers - Actually full, rolling setup
« Reply #119 on: January 20, 2013, 05:36:58 pm »

notquitethere:
Quote
Also, since you have my attention- Would you make a tie at day-end to save a mafia-buddy?  Mason-buddy?
Obviously yes if I were scum: according to the rules, in the case of an absolute tie, the mafia get to decide who gets lynched.
You must not have thought that through completely. If I saw you do that, I wouldn't hesitate to vote for your lynch.



Deathsword: You were awfully quick to jump on the bandwagon, weren't you?

You also jumped pretty hard when notquitethere named you in one of his posts. Seems like you don't want anyone thinking you're on a team.
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...Holy shit. Ford, you get the Official Medal of Epic Awesomeness.
Its official! Ford! You need to put it in your sig now! "Official Mafia Welcomer!"
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