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Author Topic: FTL - Faster than light - spaceship crew management and roguelike.  (Read 378507 times)

BurnedToast

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Re: FTL - Faster than light - spaceship crew management and roguelike.
« Reply #2640 on: April 07, 2014, 02:43:22 pm »

After 3 or 4 games immediately ended by chains of enemies with missile launchers, I'm started to get really, really pissed that a constant pass/fail condition is "is there a shop that sells a drone bay and a defense drone before Sector 3 and can you afford to buy it instead of repair back to yellow? If any of those are no, die."

THIS. It's obviously possible to win without a defense drone... but if you don't have it, the whole game is just a giant lotto. Get hit by too many missiles (putting you behind the curve) or have a missile hit something important? too bad, game over.

My last game I actually did really well till sector 3 or 4... and then ate two breech missiles in a row to the engine room (the first one managed to start a fire as well as making a breech for extra BS).

Game over, nothing I could have done, it just totally removes all skill and strategy from the game, you just randomly die sometimes and it sucks

You could also upgrade your engines so you take less damage from missiles, and you can upgrade your offenses so you disable their missiles before they get a chance to fire. There are probably other solutions as well, some that even work well together in combination.

It's not a strict 'defense drone or bust' situation.

Totally maxed out (which is very expensive) is only 55% chance to dodge. That still leaves a LOT of room for RNG to just screw you over with nothing you can do about it.

Hitting their weapon room to stop missiles is problematic because missile weapons tend to use little power so they are usually the last to go down, and meanwhile you're shooting through their shields and full dodge chance the whole time so it usually takes a while unless it's sector 1.

A cloak or a hacker also deal with enemy missiles pretty well.  Heck my last win didn't even have drones.

Cloak is almost as rare as defense drone and costs 150 - a very heavy investment in the early-mid game (especially since you have to keep it saved up just hoping to get one) . Hacking I have not experimented with that much, but at level 1 does not seem to drain the enemy weapons very much. It might be a viable alternative to defense done after you've ranked it to 2.

Edit: Just tested it, even maxed out hacking only drains maybe half the charge from a breech missile, it's got plenty of time to fire while hacking is on cooldown.
« Last Edit: April 07, 2014, 03:38:28 pm by BurnedToast »
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Urist Imiknorris

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Re: FTL - Faster than light - spaceship crew management and roguelike.
« Reply #2641 on: April 07, 2014, 03:26:45 pm »

Fuck pulsars.
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Leafsnail

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Re: FTL - Faster than light - spaceship crew management and roguelike.
« Reply #2642 on: April 07, 2014, 04:08:03 pm »

THIS. It's obviously possible to win without a defense drone... but if you don't have it, the whole game is just a giant lotto. Get hit by too many missiles (putting you behind the curve) or have a missile hit something important? too bad, game over.

My last game I actually did really well till sector 3 or 4... and then ate two breech missiles in a row to the engine room (the first one managed to start a fire as well as making a breech for extra BS).

Game over, nothing I could have done, it just totally removes all skill and strategy from the game, you just randomly die sometimes and it sucks
You're saying that their breach missiles... created a hull breach??  How very unusual and unlucky.

In all seriousness though if all your other systems were intact you should have been able to do something.  Weapons, drones, hacking and cloaking can all provide answers to missiles.  You should be able to get at least one of them running.

Totally maxed out (which is very expensive) is only 55% chance to dodge. That still leaves a LOT of room for RNG to just screw you over with nothing you can do about it.
Or 100% with a cloak.  But in any case five levels of engines is usually enough, 45%.  Yes, you'll still get an occasional unlucky hit, but overall you'll get hit a lot less and the damage will not add up as much.  You also get to flee more easily.

Hitting their weapon room to stop missiles is problematic because missile weapons tend to use little power so they are usually the last to go down, and meanwhile you're shooting through their shields and full dodge chance the whole time so it usually takes a while unless it's sector 1.
This isn't true at all.  The dangerous missiles (Hermes, Breach, Hull, Pegasus) all take 3, which makes them pretty easy to knock down.  The only cheap one is the Artemis, which really shouldn't be a game ending threat past like sector 2.

Swarm apparently takes 2 power but I don't think I've ever seen an enemy use it.

Cloak is almost as rare as defense drone and costs 150 - a very heavy investment in the early-mid game (especially since you have to keep it saved up just hoping to get one) . Hacking I have not experimented with that much, but at level 1 does not seem to drain the enemy weapons very much. It might be a viable alternative to defense done after you've ranked it to 2.

Edit: Just tested it, even maxed out hacking only drains maybe half the charge from a breech missile, it's got plenty of time to fire while hacking is on cooldown.
Cloaking isn't any rarer than any other system, and is really good enough to be worth buying at some point.  Same for hacking only it's also way cheaper.

And I wasn't claiming that hacking could keep the enemy missiles out of the equation forever, but maxed out it gives you 28 extra seconds in addition to the 20 or so that a dangerous missile takes to charge.  If you can't do anything at all in 50 seconds then frankly you deserve to lose.

It just seems strange, it's like you're expecting FTL to be a game where the enemy can never retaliate in a meaningful way.
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Arcvasti

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Re: FTL - Faster than light - spaceship crew management and roguelike.
« Reply #2643 on: April 07, 2014, 05:16:13 pm »


Above missile rant/essay spoiler-ed because it might be a tad harsh on the people[It might just be one person? Not sure.] complaining about how missiles are unfair/unbalanced. Also its a bit long, so it'll look neater on your screen. Most of the above also goes for Flak weapons as they're the same principle.
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Neonivek

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Re: FTL - Faster than light - spaceship crew management and roguelike.
« Reply #2644 on: April 07, 2014, 05:24:39 pm »

The issue are those ships that SOMEHOW have 4 missiles.

Nevermind how fast your missiles would run out if you were carrying that sort of firepower. You might as well kiss your butt goodbye if they manage to unload those on you.
« Last Edit: April 07, 2014, 05:27:56 pm by Neonivek »
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Moogie

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Re: FTL - Faster than light - spaceship crew management and roguelike.
« Reply #2645 on: April 07, 2014, 05:38:18 pm »

Yeah, that's pretty much my gripe with NPC ships. Unlimited supply of missiles/drones. Imagine if we could leave our launchers on auto-fire with impunity like they do.
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RedKing

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Re: FTL - Faster than light - spaceship crew management and roguelike.
« Reply #2646 on: April 07, 2014, 05:45:31 pm »

Yeah, that's pretty much my gripe with NPC ships. Unlimited supply of missiles/drones. Imagine if we could leave our launchers on auto-fire with impunity like they do.
It's not unlimited. I actually ran one out today while working to get the "Tough Little Ship" achievement. I didn't keep track of how many he had fired, but I'd guess 12-15.
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Moogie

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Re: FTL - Faster than light - spaceship crew management and roguelike.
« Reply #2647 on: April 07, 2014, 05:48:17 pm »

Oh? I guess I rescind my complaint, then. :P Though, it would be nice if the AI occasionally tried to preserve its supplies like we must do. They may have about as many missiles as the average player is carrying, but they're still free to fire all of them in a single battle because they have no other existence in the game.
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Darkmere

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Re: FTL - Faster than light - spaceship crew management and roguelike.
« Reply #2648 on: April 07, 2014, 05:58:02 pm »

Yeah so my original rant against missiles was that I ran into a series of them in three games or so that caused me to lose via attrition because I couldn't afford any of the other alternative shit to fend them off. I never said they were unbalanced or game-breaking, I just wanted to vent about 3 straight unlucky early games. That's when the thread turned into an e-dick contest and I had to be informed, immediately, that I was being a whinybitch who needs to lrn2play. I'll go back to keeping my input to myself, I'm truly sorry I wanted to join the discussion.  ::)
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Neonivek

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Re: FTL - Faster than light - spaceship crew management and roguelike.
« Reply #2649 on: April 07, 2014, 05:59:25 pm »

Yeah so my original rant against missiles was that I ran into a series of them in three games or so that caused me to lose via attrition because I couldn't afford any of the other alternative shit to fend them off. I never said they were unbalanced or game-breaking, I just wanted to vent about 3 straight unlucky early games. That's when the thread turned into an e-dick contest and I had to be informed, immediately, that I was being a whinybitch who needs to lrn2play. I'll go back to keeping my input to myself, I'm truly sorry I wanted to join the discussion.  ::)

Hi welcome to videogames discussions in general where being displeased with anything is tantamount to just "not getting it" and finding anything too difficult or unfair means you are a whiny baby who needs to be spanked.

I hope you enjoy your stay at videogame discussion land.
« Last Edit: April 07, 2014, 06:02:00 pm by Neonivek »
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Moogie

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Re: FTL - Faster than light - spaceship crew management and roguelike.
« Reply #2650 on: April 07, 2014, 06:21:02 pm »

FTL is one of those games that tricks people into believing you can just 'get good, son'. Eventually everyone realises that skill is only half of the equation. Luck is the other two-thirds.
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Neonivek

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Re: FTL - Faster than light - spaceship crew management and roguelike.
« Reply #2651 on: April 07, 2014, 06:31:47 pm »

FTL is one of those games that tricks people into believing you can just 'get good, son'. Eventually everyone realises that skill is only half of the equation. Luck is the other two-thirds.

I split it into three

1) skill
2) Luck
and
3) Prior knowledge

Mind you the new update lowered the knowledge threshold a bit.
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My Name is Immaterial

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Re: FTL - Faster than light - spaceship crew management and roguelike.
« Reply #2652 on: April 07, 2014, 06:43:26 pm »

3 is actually "having the wiki open in another tab".

Thexor

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Re: FTL - Faster than light - spaceship crew management and roguelike.
« Reply #2653 on: April 07, 2014, 06:53:05 pm »

3 is actually "having the wiki open in another tab".
I use the wiki for exactly one thing: checking "which of these options has a chance of killing a crew member?"

Oh, and figuring out which sectors are options for unlocking the Crystal Ship (pre-Advanced update), because that quest line has enough RNG when you know exactly what to do.
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monk12

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Re: FTL - Faster than light - spaceship crew management and roguelike.
« Reply #2654 on: April 07, 2014, 08:09:26 pm »

I was gonna put my two cents in, but then I remembered that we've had this conversation like every ten pages since the thread began, so there's not much reason to belabor the point.
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