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Author Topic: American Election Megathread - It's Over  (Read 768407 times)

Nadaka

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6465 on: October 12, 2012, 12:44:34 pm »

Idk why people care about the debates, it's basically just reality TV type theatrics.

Words carry no weight, especially not from a political figure. I'd place far more importance on their actions rather then how polished their rehearsed rhetoric and half-memorized statistics are.

The majority of people care for nothing more than reality TV type theatrics.
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Sheb

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6466 on: October 12, 2012, 12:47:27 pm »

It's kind of a self-fullfilling prophecy: deabte are important because a lot of people cares about them, and a lot of people cares about them 'cause they're important (And fun to watch).
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mainiac

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6467 on: October 12, 2012, 01:01:43 pm »

Idk why people care about the debates, it's basically just reality TV type theatrics.

Words carry no weight, especially not from a political figure. I'd place far more importance on their actions rather then how polished their rehearsed rhetoric and half-memorized statistics are.

1) Debates influence the elections
2) They actually do say some pretty substantive stuff if you know politics well enough to understand the context of their statements.  That sounds pretty arcane but it's actually pretty simple to explain what they are saying.  Unfortunately whenever people try to explain a load of !POLITICS! get's in the way thanks to a partisan 2 party culture.
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« Last Edit: February 10, 1988, 03:27:23 pm by UR MOM »
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Mictlantecuhtli

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6468 on: October 12, 2012, 04:06:04 pm »

This day's news is only about how the right wing is calling him crazy, which is crossing the line into disrespecting his office since all they ever do is talk shit about him.

Then the left doesn't care, because he is energized and showed some backbone while also calling out lies.

I hate our media.
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Mictlantecuhtli

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6469 on: October 12, 2012, 08:08:30 pm »

Breaking News: Shot fired at Obama campaign headquarters, breaking glass and making the campaign workers take cover.

Don't worry, Fox news hasn't mentioned anything about it. They only care about Americans when it's a good political moment.
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Santorum leaves a bad taste in my mouth,
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Flying Dice

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6470 on: October 12, 2012, 10:04:26 pm »

Not that politically motivated shootings are a particularly new thing.
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Duuvian

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6471 on: October 13, 2012, 02:40:06 am »

Oh damn....  I laughed out loud when Ryan said that he could bring "Honesty" as a person at the white house.

Ahahaha me too.
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Owlbread

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6472 on: October 13, 2012, 07:51:38 am »

Not that politically motivated shootings are a particularly new thing.

Just remember that "English" guy in Quebec who was shooting a month or two ago. Bad shit, and it could cause tension between the Francophones and the English speakers. I tell you though, seeing as the Quebecois Nationalists are making a come-back and nationalism is on the rise in Venice (quite strongly - apparently 70% of the population support it) and even more so in Catalonia (with the backing of the president and a hell of a lot of the population apparently), and possibly in the old country of Scotland if the conditions are right, I think we could see Quebec thinking twice in the next two years about staying a part of Canada. There could be a little flurry of independence referendums and even one or two yes votes. Don't forget Flanders either, or some of the more obscure movements in Italy.

Sorry for the derail, I just thought it would be safe to do that just now while we wait for interesting stuff to come up from the presidential campaigns.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2012, 07:53:42 am by Owlbread »
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mainiac

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6473 on: October 13, 2012, 08:15:25 am »

Everybody is always talking about regions breaking away in Europe.  Why is this time different?
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Owlbread

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6474 on: October 13, 2012, 08:48:54 am »

Everybody is always talking about regions breaking away in Europe.  Why is this time different?

Because there's actually a good chance this time. More so than in the last 10 years. The regions themselves are also very important - Catalonia, Venice and Scotland are integral parts of Unions that have existed for 200-300 years. The world map would become very different indeed. Can you imagine a UK without Scotland? Or Italy without Venice? Spain without Barcelona?
« Last Edit: October 13, 2012, 08:50:59 am by Owlbread »
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MetalSlimeHunt

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6475 on: October 13, 2012, 10:06:45 am »

Can you imagine a UK without Scotland?
Yes.
Quote
Or Italy without Venice?
Yes.
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Spain without Barcelona?
Since when is Barcelona trying to become independent?
« Last Edit: October 13, 2012, 10:20:07 am by MetalSlimeHunt »
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Owlbread

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6476 on: October 13, 2012, 10:17:32 am »

Can you imagine a UK without Scotland?
Yes.
Quote
Or Italy without Venice?
Yes.
Spain without Barcelona?
Since when is Barcelona trying to become independent?



Barcelona is the capital of Catalonia, monsieur le pedant. I thought it would be easier to imagine Spain without Catalonia than Spain without the city of Barcelona.

It is also interesting that you can imagine the UK without Scotland. It's just such a big thing to me though, Scotland's always been so integral to the Union. It's like the two original founding members of a band splitting up. Not that I don't support independence of course, I'd vote yes in a flash, it's just a bit of a milestone I think.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2012, 10:20:20 am by Owlbread »
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mainiac

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6477 on: October 13, 2012, 11:50:45 am »

Everybody is always talking about regions breaking away in Europe.  Why is this time different?

Because there's actually a good chance this time. More so than in the last 10 years.

I repeat myself.  Why is this time different?  'More so than in the last 10 years.' is a pretty meaningless statement.  Major separatist movements have existed in every region you have listed for two centuries.  Compared to the Carlist Wars the current Catalonian movement is tiny.

Show some actual evidence that this is different then the past 200 years.  With Scotland in particular I have seen recent polls showing only a third or less of the region supporting independence which is down from half the country supporting it thirty years ago.
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« Last Edit: February 10, 1988, 03:27:23 pm by UR MOM »
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Leafsnail

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6478 on: October 13, 2012, 11:55:17 am »

The SNP is hoping that doing things like...

- Lowering the voting age to 16 for this vote (16-18 year olds seem more likely to support independence)
- Delaying the vote into 2014 so that Scottish people feel more angry about the current government that has barely any Scottish component
- Holding the vote on the anniversary of the Battle of Bannockburn
- Using a hilariously leading question like "Do you agree that Scotland should be an independent country?"

Will be enough to swing the vote in their favour.  Current indications don't seem to suggest that will be the case, but there's another two years for the Conservatives to majorly piss off Scotland, so who knows.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2012, 12:02:54 pm by Leafsnail »
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Owlbread

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Re: American Election Megathread
« Reply #6479 on: October 13, 2012, 12:01:37 pm »

Everybody is always talking about regions breaking away in Europe.  Why is this time different?

Because there's actually a good chance this time. More so than in the last 10 years.

I repeat myself.  Why is this time different?  'More so than in the last 10 years.' is a pretty meaningless statement.  Major separatist movements have existed in every region you have listed for two centuries.  Compared to the Carlist Wars the current Catalonian movement is tiny.

Show some actual evidence that this is different then the past 200 years.  With Scotland in particular I have seen recent polls showing only a third or less of the region supporting independence which is down from half the country supporting it thirty years ago.

I sincerely disagree that a half supported it thirty years ago. And about a third of Scots support independence, yes. But things may change over the next two years.

The reason why this time is different is that Catalonia, for the first time in decades, has a president who supports independence and is now in an economic crisis, despite being one of the wealthiest regions in Spain. It is also facing a complete block from the Spanish government who are basically saying "no, no independence referendums, not at all. We are also going to make sure that all your schoolchildren are aware of their Spanishness, so we are going to promote a hispanicisation program." That is not going to go down well with the Catalans, who held an enormous rally for independence which attracted over a million supporters. Things were not like this in Catalonia 10 years ago.

The SNP is hoping that doing things like...

- Lowering the voting age to 16 for this vote (16-18 year olds seem more likely to support independence)
- Delaying the vote into 2014 so that Scottish people feel more angry about the current government that has barely any Scottish component
- Holding the vote on the anniversary of the Battle of Bannockburn
- Using a hilariously leading question like "Do you agree that Scotland should be an independent country?"

Will be enough to swing the vote in their favour.  Current indications don't seem to suggest that will be the case though.  Although there's another two years for the Conservatives to majorly piss off Scotland, so who knows.

No, not just the SNP. That is incorrect. The SSP and the Green Party both support these proposals, and form something we should be referring to as the Yes Campaign. It is a common practise in the British-establishment-allied media e.g. most newspapers, television stations etc to reduce either the thousands of Scots who support independence or the pro-independence groups as a whole to the SNP or Alex Salmond, thereby portraying them as a sort of crazy fringe group that somehow managed to get in control of the country, applying policies that nobody wants.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2012, 12:05:37 pm by Owlbread »
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