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#1: Put the Alarm Siren in the Military Garrison, it fits and is one buildings less.

#1: Keep the Alarm Siren seperate, I want to have it near my other levers.

#2: I have traded with Gnomes, build Artificer and Weather Control Station.

#2: I have NOT traded with Gnomes, did not have the chance to build their buildings.

[Meph]

Finishing Forge has been removed, since it only had 2 reactions. The reactions are now in the Crucible.


@all (sayke got me thinking) My thoughts on the metals:

I just cleaned up the list, removed ores and stones and wood. List is only 50% the size and should be much easier to read. I made the other one yesterday night at 0300, so excuse the mess. There are no absolute infos about what makes a metal better for armor, so I will sort them by the number as before. I try to make a list that shows only weapons grade, only armor grade, only decorative metals. Another list for the leather (hope that works) and another one for the woods. (not really important that one, but hey)

I will remove the 4 steel upgrades.
I will remove the slade metal and slade alloys. Too much confusion.
I will rename the feather iron and stainless steel, to pattern chrome/mithril
I might make the arc furnace metals harder to get.
I will make meteoric iron (steelgrade, doe) drop steel ore directly.
I will keep special named metals for other races for flavor, but these are iron/steel copies. Easy to identify what is what.
I will rebalance all metals a bit, since I can now see them side by side and compare directly.

[mglarev]

Confirmed the sugar bug. Also created http://masterworkdf.wikispaces.com/Known+Bugs

Edit: Also, I started to like slade. Maybe just simplify the making process it a bit?

[Meph]

But there is slade:stone and slade:metal, and weak slade:stone you can dig and that drops slade:ore.

[mglarev]

Err.. I did not notice this. Maybe it is much too complicated.

[bombzero]

the slades had no effect on my game due to their rarity... so no opinion.

you do plan on having valid substitutes for removed metals right? fireproof steel is the only item fulfilling its role, and battle steel is a feasible strong weapon material.

i like renaming feather iron and stainless steel to more... independent names.

small problem with meteoric, there is no such thing as 'steel ore'.... so yeah... lol. would just be adding one and removing one.


looks good i think, maybe it IS about time this mod entered a 'refinement' stage, i.e. removing useless things, streamlining current features.

[afftor]

I think slade metal should stay. How else would we get our hands on those nasty slade bludgeons besides mauls?
As I remember from tables meteoric iron was surprisingly good, and would like it to stay. However Its quite rare, so wouldn't impact me much.

[Meph]

Metal_Ore:"inorganic mat here" should work on direct steel. I could also make it drop wood ore if I wanted It is mostly renameing the meteoric iron to something more steel like, since it is close to steel, and not iron.

Valid replacement for fireproof steel: Netherwood bark. For the fireproof coat/robe above your steel armor. Damast steel will be replaced by one of the alloys. Chrome+Steel or so.

Streamlining is always good, same for flavor, balancing and fixes. I am also very, very curious about narhirils and sethcreyds progress on mages, since both work on this right now.

PS: Just checked my hell. Besides soul webs and my special demons down there... EVERYTHING is made of slademantine. That means you can dig in hell. And channel the lowest z level, to go deeper... this might als cause digable curious underground structures that give slademantine ore. Wow, slightly unbalanced it is.

[Flobulon]

Slowly but surely making progress on info charts... here's one for Dwarven Castes.
Warning - it's big! Could probably reduce it a bit for those with smaller monitors...

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

All info is correct as of 1.4, and as far as I'm aware nothing has changed since then except for pop ratios, which aren't included on the chart anyway.
Also, I haven't included "non-standard" dwarven castes as I didn't think it necessary, but I could if people wanted. Finally, here's a link to the album with the rest of my charts.

[Blah]

In my opinion the following is a good approach to metals:

1) Each metal should occupy a unique position on the effectiveness scale. That is, no duplicates that only differ in name, no metals that are very close to each other in terms of effectiveness.
2) New metals should be better than steel.
3) New metals should be worse than adamantine.
4) Each new metal should be clearly harder, expensive or more work-intensive to obtain than the previous ones.

So between steel and adamantine I can see room for 3-4 new metals. Let's say

1) Titanium: straight upgrade from steel but its ores are scarce. Can be ordered from the caravan.
2) Mithril: straight upgrade from titanium but its ores are scarce and only found deep and thus cannot be ordered from the caravan.
3) Hellwood: straight upgrade from Mithril, must conquer hell to obtain but is available in sufficient quantities. To be honest, this should be a metal and not wood.
4) Adamantine. Best of the best but there is only so much of it.

Also Titanium/Mithril/Hellwood should require increasingly demanding refining techniques.

[bombzero]

you got Netherbark clothing working then? good. havn't tested it myself yet but i heard some people had issues.

also, maybe just meteorite? that's what the ferrous metal that is found in meteors is typically called irl.


so a cloak, robe, and padded under armor of netherbark will protect from fire?

[Meph]

The bowyer savant lists Armorsmithing Besides that they are glorious and will be added by default to the next version.

[afftor]

Slowly but surely making progress on info charts... here's one for Dwarven Castes.
Warning - it's big! Could probably reduce it a bit for those with smaller monitors...

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

All info is correct as of 1.4, and as far as I'm aware nothing has changed since then except for pop ratios, which aren't included on the chart anyway.
Also, I haven't included "non-standard" dwarven castes as I didn't think it necessary, but I could if people wanted. Finally, here's a link to the album with the rest of my charts.

Non of the fighters use fighter skill...? Rangers could also use ambush and how about teacher/learner skill for fighters? I don't think it's used anywhere else anyway.

[sayke]

meph - aha! i like the way you're thinking on this =) good call on the pattern chrome/pattern mithril, for example - hell, all those planned changes look spot-on. the one thing you might want to consider is a fireproof armor upgrade path, such that people do have options for fireproof armor if it seems like they need some fireproof squads or platoons! what do you think about this upgrade path:

- fireproof armor material progression: titanium, wolfram, hellwood, slademantine

that would yield a light-ish but not terribly strong (i think) fireproof armor, a heavy strong rarer-then-steel fireproof armor, a wood fireproof armor, and an ultimate fireproof armor whose exact properties i'm not sure of but are probably plenty badass =D

also, i note that the leathers are now a bit weird! scales should be generic, no? as it stands i see "drake scale" and "darter scale", which seem suspiciously similar to the "cow leather" this mod is trying to avoid by using "common leather", right...?  should it just be "scale plate" instead? also, where does scale fit on the chitin -> leather -> tough hide non-metal armor/value progression? if scale was the heaviest/best one in that progression, i think it would make perfect sense! it should then be more expensive, make better armor, etc...

also, in the interest of making more materials have one-word names, you might want to rename "tough hide" just "hide - that way you could have chitin (5p) -> leather (10p) -> hide (30p) -> scale (50p?), for that material progression.

finally, i note that frill lizards still seem to have black backgrounds! i really love this mod but seeing some of the more interesting creatures (the ones you added) stick out like a sore thumb makes it feel less polished. it's the little things like that that people notice right away - the devil's in the details, man! =D

in general, though, awesome. i really like where this mod is at now, and where it's going. i'll continue to test it out and give feedback and suggestions. cheers!

[slay_mithos]

@Flobulon:
Great chart, could help all of us that don't quite understand how it really works.
But, bow savant have a boost in armor smithing?
Copy/paste and forgot to rename maybe?

[Flobulon]

The bowyer savant lists Armorsmithing Besides that they are glorious and will be added by default to the next version.

No it doesn't, don't know what you're talking about...
(Fixed )

And thanks, glad you like it!