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[MagmaMcFry]

Erm, you do know that you can reuse a thermometer after transmitting the measurement, right?

[WillowLuman]

At penalty for transmission, though. Or was that the barometer?

[TheBronzePickle]

Yes, but for those of us who have taken the no-transmission challenge (which I get the feeling so far is only me) then you'll know the bane of having to visit a place over and again to milk it of all its delicious science because it's really hard to safely and easily transport more than one Science Jr. anywhere when you're still using 1m parts to take off and parachutes to land.

[Vattic]

I've set myself the rule of not doing repeat transmissions of the same data, but I really like robotic missions.

[ank]

The "no infinite experiment repeats" sound like they're going to make science a lot more painful to happen. No more queueing up dozens of transmissions simultaneously while passing through high atmosphere. Also, no more gathering science from multiple sciomes with the same vessel

Actually, it sounds like instead of repeatedly transmitting from 1 biome, you will be able to gather multiple biome experiments with 1 vessel as long as you collect and store with EVA. Much better then repeatedly mounting slightly different missions to the same planet.

Take for example a Science Jr, and land it on Eve. If you bring an antenna and a solar panel, you can get 20 transmissions each from Kerbin's surface, low/high Kerbin atmosphere, low/high Kerbin orbit, high over the sun, high/low Eve orbit, high/low Eve atmosphere and Eve's surface. That is a fuckton of science you get there: around 1900, using just the Science Jr.. I unlocked almost the entire tech tree in only six missions (landing pad sample, Mun orbit/return, Mun landing/landing/return, Minmus landing/return, a Moho orbit and an Eve landing), and I don't see how that's grindy at all, since I don't really need to go to the same place twice. Now imagine how much science I would not be able to gather at once if the science modules weren't infinitely resettable (or at least not without the occasional EVA). I couldn't do the atmosphere samples, I'd need to EVA a few times in every other sciome, and the science I'd get from Moho or Eve would be further decimated because I can't return the science completely. This would essentially mean that I wouldn't get enough science on the first trip to the planets, necessitating second and third trips just to get enough science to unlock the necessary parts for the fourth and fifth trips. I really don't see how that's better than before.

I don't think you are getting how broken the current system is.
Right now, there is NO reason ever to return anything, you can just spam transmission, and suck up all the science from whereever.
This leads to stupid stuff like 5000 science with only a few parts unlocked.
I want to stress that there is NO penalty to transmission, you just have to do it a bunch of times over and over.

I have yet to meet a person that thinks it fun to spam transmit on 6 different science modules, 20 times during a mission.


The new system will make it so there is a portion of science reserved for bringing it back to Kerbin. That way you can still transmit science, but there will be a reason to make a return craft.


To fix the system for myself, I don't allow transmission of anything but crew reports(which is intended to be transmitted), and tiny bits a science like 3 science from a goo container.

[Sean Mirrsen]

Your quote tags are broken, so I can't see where the post you quote ends and yours begins.

edit: okay, so text order was broken as well. The paragraph below is now redundant.

Spoiler: Now redundant (click to show/hide)

But anyway.

The gist of it is that the current system is, indeed, broken. That you can gather massive amounts of science from one trip is hardly good game balance. Rewards skill, perhaps, but skill at what? Hopping around? How about doing actual science? A kerbal repeatedly going out to reaffirm that the Duna surface is indeed still as red as a minute ago should not give you scientific progress. Same with other experiments. Career's not meant to be a cakewalk, methinks. Simpler to start out and get going, but harder to advance.

[ank]

Ninja fixed!

[alexandertnt]

I think that a surface sample should not be transmittable at all, since half the fun of getting a surface sample should be the challenge of getting it back to Kerbin.

[Sean Mirrsen]

No, it should still be transmittable, a little. "The soil is gray, mushy, has the consistency of pudding, but tastes awful" is still basic observational data, that an average Kerbal would be able to relay by radio as well as he can an EVA report - the difference being that he can't actually analyze the sample, just describe it. So you get only a small return from it.

But if he brings it to the new Lab module...

[miauw62]

From the info they've given, I think that the lab module will probably be the size of an orange tank or so. Which is pretty cool anyway.

[Sean Mirrsen]

From the screenshot they've given, it's about the size of two Hitchhikers mashed together. Maybe less.

[miauw62]

Somehow I didn't realize that was the lab. So that's half an orange tank.

[MagmaMcFry]

I'm pretty sure it will be remodeled too.

[Sean Mirrsen]

Somehow I didn't realize that was the lab. So that's half an orange tank.

Yeah. With the rest of the science stuff being reasonably heavy, I'd expect at least four-five tons in the Lab. A bit of a hefty thing to bring along, but utterly indispensable for places like Eve where getting samples back is incredibly hard. You'd still have to get the kerbal back of course, but that is at least doable.

[Eric Blank]

This makes me want to design a new mega-rover around a science module to scout Eve and Duna.

I still haven't gotten to Jool orbit, though. I got a redesigned lander and IPD up, but I'm busy with a test flight around the Mun. Located a Kethane deposit worth throwing Jeb at, and I'm going to find out how much potential fuel I can taxi back up to the IPD. Which is going to be important for this mission.