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[Bdthemag]

Now to answer the questions that I haven't answered yet (If I didn't answer a question asked towards me, please bring it up.)

IronyOwl Sure he wasn't lurking anymore, but it did seem a hell of alot like active lurking.

Toaster Yes, i'll be getting to being useful, it was really stupid of me to think I could handle more than 2 mafia games at once.

Think The person I would most want on my scumteam if I was scum is Irony, from the games i've been in with him as scum he does a pretty good job. The person i'd want with a power role would be Vector, she seems like someone who could make good decisions on who to use that power on. And to continue what I said about Dariush, he doesn't neccesarley claim Jester all the time (although in one game I was in he did.), but he generally goes into a "Fuck you guy's" attitude and gets lynched.

[Solifuge]

I'm disinclined to Extend on Day 1, but I'm not outright opposed to it. We still have nearly a full day to finalize our investigations, either way.

Solifuge:  Meant to ask you.  Have you been reading games since you stopped playing?  What have you learned from any of them?

I only caught a handful of games over the last year or so. When the fancy struck me, I would take a recently completed game and read it from start to finish with fresh eyes, "playing along" by trying to mark the scum team before the lynch each day. If Scum/Mason/Dead Chat was available, I'd look at the things that made Scum afraid, the suspicions of dead players, and so on. I'd like to think I've gotten better at a number of things, specifically at noticing the more subtle defensive tells that speak of someone who is really committed to their personal survival. Should the opportunity present itself, I'll be glad to illustrate. :3

[Darvi]

Best. Reply. Ever.

Actually, I get Toasterscum feel. I dunno why.

Uhuh. And why're you not doing anything about it?

I'd like to survive this one night, due to being able to gift someone an inspect.

See, it's things like these that make me disbelieve people trying to look like a jester. That and your general worries about policylynches. Looks like textbook RIA to me.

Bastardbro: Do you have any other suspicions apart from Ottofar? And why are you not questioning anybody?

[Solifuge]

Glad you liked the picture, Darvi. Any reason why you responded to that, though, and not to the query I directed toward you?

[Darvi]

Because I don't give a fuck about what people think about me.

[Solifuge]

Pity, because you should. I give a fuck what I think about you... several fucks, in fact. For instance, I find it intriguing that you call out Ottofar on "active lurking" and not answering questions. Pot/Kettle much, my friend? :3

If you continue to be too poor in fucks to give any, maybe you can throw me a bone, and explain why you'd sooner slip in alongside recognized scumhunters aboard the Ottobus? Why you're putting a 3rd pressure-vote down, your only argument that he's lurking, not asking/answering questions, and is "a useless piece of crap".

Is it trust, self-preservation, or something else?

[Dariush]

So you answer an accusation of WIFOM with WIFOM?  Brilliant.

'To prevent Otto's lynch I would vote Darvi for a tie' isn't WIFOM in the way that 'scum would kill town to win and not other scum'.

I don't even know what to call this, but it's scummy bullshit all the same.  You're tunneling down Vector, trying to fling all sorts of shit at her to see what sticks.

Hehe, tunneling. After she called me out based on my wording, my claim of millery and a little laugh that accompanied it. That wasn't tunneling, obviously.

Now that disarming it hasn't worked, you're trying to discredit it. She's not town because then she might have a point, and she's not scum because then you'd have to pressure her to confirm and convince everyone else. Instead she's "maybe" completely irrelevant and should be ignored.

Look, you just... what. You just put a whole load of bullshit in my mouth that didn't have any relation to what I said.

How about you give me your list of scumpicks, as well as your specific opinion on Ottofar, Native, Vector, Pandar, and Solifuge?

BD for lurking, Pandar for tying the shit up, Otto and Vector at the bottom for being Jesters. (is it even possible to have two jesters in a single game?...) Giving you my specific opinions on the following people would be my greatest pleasure, but only after you did the same for Darvi, Toaster, Bdthemag, Think0028, Solifuge, Vector, Pandarsenic, Ottofar and NativeForeigner. Thanks in advance.

Now, Pandar...

Not only has Vector become incredibly, blatant obvtown

Care to explain? Also why did you unvote Otto, thus creating a three-way tie, despite wanting him lynched earlier so much?

You answered it by saying you should have added an "IMO."  That doesn't change the meaning at all.  Before it was your opinion; now it's your opinion.  Nothing has changed.

So, if it's only my opinion, how is questioning other people about it scummy?

d. Hateful rage, huh?  Way to delegitimize my opinion of you by characterizing it as one of Vector's angry snaps.

Isn't it one of your angry madness-induced snaps?

I dunno, what do you think you would have done?  Why are you asking us what you would do?

Since the fact that it was a rhetorical question doesn't get through to your feeble little mind, well fuck you.
If I wanted to prevent Otto's lynch, I would have voted Darvi.
I was asking you because it was a fucking rhetorical question.
Satisfied?

Just.... throwing that out there, for no reason, without any implication at all that Vector might be scum because of it?

With that observation I established that Vector couldn't be town (well, if she's telling the truth about always being a grammar nazi, then it's wrong), and with the next one I established that she couldn't be scum either. Well, the first one was kinda redundant since neither town nor scum would blindly tunnel me like that, but whatever, I forgot about it at the time of writing.

Solifuge, what are your other suspects except Darvi?

Think, you're unusually quiet. What is your opinion about Vector and her accusations?

BD,

-snip-

Uh... so you answered by question and ignored what I wrote before it. All right, I'll ask you directly - are you going to continue ((pseudo)active)lurking? If you can't keep up, ask for a replacement.

Also you came back, answered a couple of questions aaaaand... faded back out. Do you still suspect Ottofar? Do you think he may be a Jester?

[Ottofar]

Pandar never voted me. He was re-unvoting Vector.

Also, uh, how is she Jester?

[Toaster]

Dariush:

So you answer an accusation of WIFOM with WIFOM?  Brilliant.

'To prevent Otto's lynch I would vote Darvi for a tie' isn't WIFOM in the way that 'scum would kill town to win and not other scum'.

What does this even mean?  Your statement was WIFOM. The first statement is WIFOM.  The second is not.

I don't even know what to call this, but it's scummy bullshit all the same.  You're tunneling down Vector, trying to fling all sorts of shit at her to see what sticks.

Hehe, tunneling. After she called me out based on my wording, my claim of millery and a little laugh that accompanied it. That wasn't tunneling, obviously.

This isn't deflection, obviously.


Darvi:

Because I don't give a fuck about what people think about me.

Interesting statement.  What if you had, for example, two votes more than anyone else?  What would you do then?


BD:  Noted.  Why aren't you questioning others?  Do you just expect scum to fall in your lap?

[Darvi]

Darvi:

Because I don't give a fuck about what people think about me.

Interesting statement.  What if you had, for example, two votes more than anyone else?  What would you do then?

So what. Keep going. It doesn't matter if I get lynched as long as we find the scum.

If I wanted to prevent Otto's lynch, I would have voted Darvi.
I was asking you because it was a fucking rhetorical question.
Satisfied?

Hahaha. Sure. There is a little something called "bussing" and I can assure you that most of us know what it means.

With that observation I established that Vector couldn't be town (well, if she's telling the truth about always being a grammar nazi, then it's wrong), and with the next one I established that she couldn't be scum either. Well, the first one was kinda redundant since neither town nor scum would blindly tunnel me like that, but whatever, I forgot about it at the time of writing.

You established what? All I see is you bullshitting around. Even if she was fussing about wording as scum, you're still trying to imply a correlation that doesn't exist since you don't know she wouldn't do the same as town. That's a null-tell that you're trying to sell us as a scumtell.

You know what? Dariush. Go hang.

[Ottofar]

What is it, a four-way tie?

[Pandarsenic]

Dariush: Get your facts straight and I'll answer real questions, not imaginaries like IF I had unvoted Ottofar and not Vector, etc.

And Vector... well, obvtown is a very relative statement, especially for a Magnificent Bitch like Vector who is incredibly unpredictable, but nothing she so far is doing or saying in any way resembles scum play. Not just her own, which wouldn't be a terribly good indicator, but in general.

[Vector]

Dear Dariush:

You're so cute when you're angry!  Why can't you be angry more?  Then we could always be having fun.

Hehe, tunneling. After she called me out based on my wording, my claim of millery and a little laugh that accompanied it. That wasn't tunneling, obviously.

If you think I'm tunneling, that gives you absolutely zero excuse to tunnel.  Example: if you find a lurker, you do not excuse your lurking by accusing the other of lurking.  "But moooooooooommy, she started it!"

No.  You sound 3.  Grow up.

How about you give me your list of scumpicks, as well as your specific opinion on Ottofar, Native, Vector, Pandar, and Solifuge?

BD for lurking, Pandar for tying the shit up, Otto and Vector at the bottom for being Jesters. (is it even possible to have two jesters in a single game?...) Giving you my specific opinions on the following people would be my greatest pleasure, but only after you did the same for Darvi, Toaster, Bdthemag, Think0028, Solifuge, Vector, Pandarsenic, Ottofar and NativeForeigner. Thanks in advance.

This is not how this game works, honey.  You do not have someone ask you a question and then give them a question twice as large to answer first in favor of fuck-you economics.

If you think I'm that much scum, then as I said--come get me, huh?  I'm under a lurker and a tie-maker on that list, and you think my case on you is total bullshit, I'm tunneling, I'm bending, I have nothing to say?

What do I have to do to get to the top of that list?  Are you too afraid of me to actually bring up some allegations?

Oh, right.  You think I'm a jester, and therefore mafia.  That makes so much sense.

What makes more sense is that you have your list with two people holding trivial scumtells, and then two people you tacked on because you couldn't figure out what to do with them.  Despite "thinking" that they're actually third party, rather than scum.  Thinking is, of course, in scare-quotes because I don't think you're actually using a single rational braincell to make your accusations.

You're running scared.

You answered it by saying you should have added an "IMO."  That doesn't change the meaning at all.  Before it was your opinion; now it's your opinion.  Nothing has changed.

So, if it's only my opinion, how is questioning other people about it scummy?

It was always your opinion, whether you stuck a weasel-word in front of it or not.  If you think it's WIFOM, you don't ask other people to do the analysis for you and invite them in the wine-infested waters.  You say "that's WIFOM, stay out!"

If it was scummy before, it's more scummy because you think throwing weak modifiers will do something.  Instead, you're only implementing a smokescreen.  A non-answer.

d. Hateful rage, huh?  Way to delegitimize my opinion of you by characterizing it as one of Vector's angry snaps.

Isn't it one of your angry madness-induced snaps?

First hateful, then rage, then... madness.  I see.  Insanity?  Nice step up right there.  Your ad hominem attacks only inform me that you don't have any other options.

If you'd seen me angry, you'd remember it.  I'm amused, sweetheart.  Positively giggling.

I dunno, what do you think you would have done?  Why are you asking us what you would do?

Since the fact that it was a rhetorical question doesn't get through to your feeble little mind, well fuck you.
If I wanted to prevent Otto's lynch, I would have voted Darvi.
I was asking you because it was a fucking rhetorical question.
Satisfied?

Fuck me?  I'm sorry, but my feeble little mind has higher standards.  It can't quite manage to work out why "fuck you" is a good answer to an accusation.  And, therefore, it must be a solicitation--to which I say "no thanks, I don't sleep with scum."

A rhetorical question should serve some rhetorical purpose.  In general, it opens the mind to an array of possibilities to the question, which are to be answered by the speaker or otherwise made obvious.  To simply create this widening without clarification is to leave the listener to draw its own conclusions.  Exempli gratia--"Wow, this is a stupid question and it sounds like this dude is windmilling."

You can see I'd especially have that reaction given that you were unable to provide a suitable explanation the first time I asked about this.

But thank you for the swearing and the insults.  I do so enjoy seeing you flustered.

Just.... throwing that out there, for no reason, without any implication at all that Vector might be scum because of it?

With that observation I established that Vector couldn't be town (well, if she's telling the truth about always being a grammar nazi, then it's wrong), and with the next one I established that she couldn't be scum either. Well, the first one was kinda redundant since neither town nor scum would blindly tunnel me like that, but whatever, I forgot about it at the time of writing.

You know, no matter how many times you say I'm blindly tunneling, that doesn't make me a blind tunneler, and it's not going to make anyone believe you any harder.  It just makes you look like you don't know how to say anything else.

You know what that is?  Boring.  Really, really boring.

You know something that's easy to check?  My meta.  I have some 5% of the posts in the entire subforum.  I'm sure I've played at least 30 games here, and because I'm almost never lynched or nightkilled, you can see me play from start to finish.  Wouldn't take that long, even.  I gave you a game reference for my analysis of your particular post.  So if you want verifiable truth for my rhetorical analyses (if you even care about the truth at all), you should really consider looking up your attacking point now that I've provided you with a reliable and unbiased source.

Oh, and furthermore: the sooner you realize that this isn't tunneling, or a pressure vote, or a soft little hit in the face with a bunch of bananas (*pap*!), the faster you'll start actually gaining traction on my attack.  You could be right!  You could be town.  But while you're sitting here flailing your arms around, swearing more and more, and dropping tell after tell, I'm really not prone to shift my vote.

Now, if you started answering people's reasonable, transparent, and non-evasive questioning, got yourself a reasonable scumlist, calmed down, and showed some sort of willingness to play along with the hunt, I'd consider unvoting you.

But right now... nah.  Try harder.

[IronyOwl]

Extend.

Looks like textbook RIA to me.

Because I don't give a fuck about what people think about me.

Speaking of RIA...

Darvi. What's your read on Think and Solifuge?

"Doesn't matter, must find scum" isn't a valid excuse for ignoring questions. In addition to getting scum lynched, you also have something of a duty to not force town to waste lynched on you because you're being stubborn and opaque.

In fact, you know your vote on Dariush? I was about to vote him, but now your vote- possibly a bandwagon from a somewhat scummy player- has made me reconsider. Is that what you want, to turn a guaranteed vote on obvscum into a dubious, reluctant decision because you are also scummy?

Now that disarming it hasn't worked, you're trying to discredit it. She's not town because then she might have a point, and she's not scum because then you'd have to pressure her to confirm and convince everyone else. Instead she's "maybe" completely irrelevant and should be ignored.

Look, you just... what. You just put a whole load of bullshit in my mouth that didn't have any relation to what I said.

Because it makes more sense than the bullshit you've got in there at present. It's true that her case was weak on you to begin with, but you rapidly gave her cause to suspect you of being scum, and going from "her arguments are weak/bad" to "clearly it's physically impossible for her to not be a jester" makes much, much more sense as an attempt to disarm her case on you (which you'd tried before) than as genuine reasoning.

How about you give me your list of scumpicks, as well as your specific opinion on Ottofar, Native, Vector, Pandar, and Solifuge?

BD for lurking, Pandar for tying the shit up, Otto and Vector at the bottom for being Jesters. (is it even possible to have two jesters in a single game?...) Giving you my specific opinions on the following people would be my greatest pleasure, but only after you did the same for Darvi, Toaster, Bdthemag, Think0028, Solifuge, Vector, Pandarsenic, Ottofar and NativeForeigner. Thanks in advance.

Under ANY other conditions I would lynch you for this horseshit. Which is to say, more specifically, that I'd answer it and then vote you until you satisfactorily explained why my answering it and more was necessary for you to do so, other than the obvious that you're wriggling, opinionless scum.

Anyway, lucky for you my gut is telling me you're not scum. How it possibly could have arrived at this conclusion is utterly beyond me, but I'm forced to trust it nonetheless. Thus, I'll just point out that you're an absolutely awful player who's going to cost us a lynch disposing of your scummy ass. Protip: RIA doesn't work that way and it's not meant to be used as town.

d. Hateful rage, huh?  Way to delegitimize my opinion of you by characterizing it as one of Vector's angry snaps.

Isn't it one of your angry madness-induced snaps?

While there is no doubt a tint of anger, or at least enthusiasm, to her ruthless predations, I can assure you with complete certainty that this is gleeful Vector.

Just.... throwing that out there, for no reason, without any implication at all that Vector might be scum because of it?

With that observation I established that Vector couldn't be town (well, if she's telling the truth about always being a grammar nazi, then it's wrong), and with the next one I established that she couldn't be scum either. Well, the first one was kinda redundant since neither town nor scum would blindly tunnel me like that, but whatever, I forgot about it at the time of writing.

Really. So after calling Vector a tunneling Jester for her ever-expanding case, you "prove" that she couldn't be scum or town by... claiming she's tunneling. Nice. Good to see your standards are even across the board.

What is it, a four-way tie?

Still here, still doing nothing. Why is that?

[NativeForeigner]

Vector: Any suspicions other than the struggling Dariush?