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[Sonlirain]

Ok so i took a peek at the orign humble bundle.

Now mind you despite everthing its a very good deal. Especially for 5$

However the bait and switch they did with hte hidden games by golly that was hilarious.
So almsot all of the hidden games were titles almost or over a decade old.

Sadder still all of those games already have newer titles that render them mostly obsolete.

Wing Commander is jsut an inferior (and uglier as much as i wish it was not the case) Freespace.
Sim City 2000 despite being a game i played on my first PC (not counting my commodore) has to make way for Sim City 4 as it is nothing but a straight upgrade meaning there is no returning to Simcity 2000. (and not even mentioning games like skylines)
And then you have Ultima... another good game but rather clunky for todays standards.

They should have given out more exotic games that don't have much in the way of competition today like Dungeon Keeper 1-2, Sim Tower or... Sim City 2000 bundled with Sim Copter and Streets of Sim City.

[Mephisto]

However the bait and switch they did with hte hidden games by golly that was hilarious.
So almsot all of the hidden games were titles almost or over a decade old.

I fail to see anything resembling "bait and switch" and the beat the average games were by no means hidden. Am I missing something?

[forsaken1111]

Indeed. Just because there are newer games in the genre does not render older games 'obsolete'. Hell I still play some classics like x-com and MOO2 on occasion.

[penguinofhonor]

.

[Delta Foxtrot]

As a fan of Freespace 2 I find Wing Commander to be very much worth playing.

[Sonlirain]

It is bait and switch because the games that weve visible were pretty neat ones and all rather new(ish) while the hidden ones turned out to be all around 20 years old.

As i said there is little reason to play Sim City 2000 if you already have Sim City 4 that has everything SC2000 has and more.
Sim City 2000 became obsolete with the arrival of sim city 3000 and SC 3000 got obsoleted by SC4 because those games all cater to the same type of player with Sim City 4 being simply objectively better in every way possible.
Same thing with "Abe's oddysee new and tasty". The remake of the first game rendered the game obsolete because New and tasty was everything the old game was AND MORE.

The exact same applies to wing commander.

There were simply many better space shooters released after them and.

Simply put if they really wanted to put in old games they could at least do it by puttign games that had something fresh about them like rarely used mechanics.
Magic Carpet. Populus 3, Dungeon Keeper, Black and White to name but a few.

I fail to see anything resembling "bait and switch" and the beat the average games were by no means hidden. Am I missing something?

The second 4 (the old ones) were hidden untill today. The first 8 games were relatively recent so most people probably expected things like mass effect 1 to be among the hidden games. Instead they got titles that are all a decade old.

Now don't get me wrong i still think this is a great deal and bang for the buck but the old games there just look like an afterthought where the humble bundle division at EA realized they exceeded the planned bundle budget and still had to throw in several games.
- What do we do now Joe?
- Let's just throw in some old crap we'll never sell anyway because everyone downloads it for free thinking its abandonware by now.

[Reelya]

Idk, I loathed SC3000 and would still play SC2000 over that.

It usually goes the way of better interfaces, but not always. Compare Master of Orion 1 to any of the sequels. MOO 1 is the smoothest playing version of them all.

[forsaken1111]

Apparently it's a bait and switch when you expect one thing and are given another, even though you had no reason to expect the first thing.

So it's a bait and switch if I expect to get a cookie with lunch, even though there is nothing saying I will get a cookie, but they give me a cracker instead.

[Reelya]

I kind of fail to see the "switch" if you're getting what was in the offer. They baited you with SC2000 .... and you got SC2000. Bait and switch isn't a relevant expression. "Not very good extras" would be more precise. You knew what you were getting before you clicked "ok".

Also, for things like Wing Commander 3 and 4, some people play through older games in a series to enjoy the story too, as well as notch up campaign completion (which is a story element). In a similar way, I play through a lot of different RTS's to complete the campaigns. I don't automatically not play something because it's not as good as Starcraft II, because that's not the point. I don't play RTS's multiplayer, I play the campaigns, and playing more games (old and new) gives me more unique missions to complete. So it's kind of irrelevant than a single-player game like Wing Commander IV isn't as good as Freespace. It's actually a different play experience altogether. It's a campaign made up of set missions with a strongly scripted plot, not a free-roaming sandbox-like thing.

[forsaken1111]

I kind of fail to see the "switch" if you're getting what was in the offer. They baited you with SC2000 .... and you got SC2000. Bait and switch isn't a relevant expression. "Not very good extras" would be more precise. You knew what you were getting before you clicked "ok".

If I understand correctly, he is saying that his expectations were lead in a certain direction by the type of games offered and so he expected more games of that type to be revealed at a later date. When the reveal happened, the games were of a different type he didn't expect so he feels as though he was tricked or fooled somehow when really he fooled himself.

[Sonlirain]

Apparently it's a bait and switch when you expect one thing and are given another, even though you had no reason to expect the first thing.

So it's a bait and switch if I expect to get a cookie with lunch, even though there is nothing saying I will get a cookie, but they give me a cracker instead.

There was good reason to expect something newer.
The origianl 8 games shown were very interesting titles like
Dragon age 1 and 2.
Mass Effect 2.
Dead Space 2

With those games being the main titles most people buying the bundle probably expected the remaining 4 "secret" games to be Mass Effect and Dead Space 1 to set the player up for the eventual purchase of the third game from the respective series (especially considering you could export Sheppy from game to game) and there weren't really many other known games EA could throw in there.

But instead they just decided to scrape the bottom of the barrel so hard they uncovered relicts from the mid 90's instead.

If I understand correctly, he is saying that his expectations were lead in a certain direction by the type of games offered and so he expected more games of that type to be revealed at a later date. When the reveal happened, the games were of a different type he didn't expect so he feels as though he was tricked or fooled somehow when really he fooled himself.

Close but no cigar because i don't feel fooled because i didn't buy the bundle in the first place (because i shun Orign and how it fucked me over in the past) but i doubt anyone expected to see Wing Commander ever again outside of a mausoleum with a museum built around it.

[Levi]

Steam is having a roguelikes sale.  Annoyingly nothing with a good sale that I need, but these are my recommendations:

Tower of Guns
Spleunky
Super House of Dead Ninjas
FTL
Rogue Legacy

[Meta]

Even if we can argue about Sonlirain's choice of words, I must say that I agree with him. This selection of additional games is definitely sub-par for a Humble Bundle. It may be because Origin still lacks a good catalogue of games, and is therefore forced to limit its selection to such old games.

[Shadowlord]

They gave away one of the wing commander games in their free game thing they do. It was probably the worst one they've given away, since it lacked fly-by-mouse and expected you to have a joystick (and was a dos game). You could fly your fighter with your keyboard's arrow keys, but doing that when wing commander originally came out, I could only get like 6 missions or something into the original wing commander with the reflexes of a 13 year old (or somewhere around there, I didn't do the math).

Dogfighting by keyboard now? gg no re.

As for origin, they have all of EA's games, nothing would have stopped them from adding Mass Effect 1, they just wanted to add games nobody was buying so they could, I assume, write off their full value on their taxes or something.

[Reelya]

Well it would be easy to wack together a script to emulate the old joystick with mouse or a gamepad nowadays. I'm kinda tempted to boot up the original wing commander and see if I could get further in it by tweaking the controls.

Also, the idea that teens have these amazing eye-hand coordination skills isn't really true in my experience. I played the original Boulder Dash a lot as a kid, did very badly. Then, played it once in my 20s and was able to clear all the levels in one go.